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The real situation regarding Rocketeers.

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#1 ReachH

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Posted November 25 2012 - 06:22 AM

So I'm just going to assume that the existing 'seeker missile thread' is just 7 pages of noob retardation and experienced players trying to stem the tide of QQ. So I won't be replying to that.

But I want to give my honest impressions after trying out the class.

Seeker Missiles
The only problem with the seeker missile is its rate of fire. It is so high that it gives it the ability to spam while rounding a corner. If anyone follows, they die. The crazy rate of fire on the seeker when not homing allows you to suppress anywhere, making engaging a good rocketeer challenging. These two abilities that are allowed to the Rocketeer are more important than 'QQ aimbot high dps BAWWW' (recap: un-pursuable around corners; suppression). However it is comparable to how SS abuse corners and LoS as well.

Other than that, the rocketeer fills its role of 'stream-of-death' very well. While not able to reliably kill mechs who know how to dodge behind cover, it is excellent at zoning enemies out, and punishing bad positions.

Turret Mode
The turret mode is still a joke, just give them a mortar/siege mode for Gods sake. This would add to the theme of suppression.

The 1v1 Factor

I have purposely avoided the 1v1 discussion, because I believe that players who fixate on 1v1 balance are, quite frankly, bad. Although this is necessary for DeathMatch considerations (save that for another topic).

But just to state the obvious, it is a mech who was envisioned by the designers to be a stream of high explosives. Why would you step in front of that?

That being said, I felt that the rocketeer felt a little too agile and it was too easy to throw around, but this is probably due to the recent boost tweak. On the other hand its comparable mobility allows it to fend off multiple attackers while running away. Something you would expect from a mech that is just supposed to spam ordinance. Something to consider.

Closing Thoughts

All that being said, I still feel that hit-scan is still the most deadly (as in guaranteed kills vs good players - who will likely run away and repair - not just noobs who stand in your volley-o-death), and SS is still my preferred mech :)

Talking speculatively, I think the Rocketeer fills a nice niche of making fast A-Class damage dealers a little more cautious when choosing when to commit to an attack. As a SS, I for one welcome my new Rocketeer buddy to screen out those nasty infiltrators now that my 1v1 is no longer OP.

All in all an excellent change that only needs a little more tweaking. Before you condemn the new Rocketeer, ask yourself would you really want to have viable mechs limited to an elite few 'class A' mechs? No. You would want each mech to be godly in its own playstyle. And for team games to have a deep and dynamic interaction between classes. So suck it up and learn how to play against this new mech, because it should be here to stay.

*edit* Follow up thoughts:

http://community.pla..._40#entry106135

Edited by ReachH, November 28 2012 - 05:18 AM.

View Post[HWK]HUGHES, on October 23 2013 - 06:01 PM, said:

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#2 Sythorian

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Posted November 25 2012 - 06:26 AM

To be completely honest.

I find the Rocketeer a little easy to beat. The Seeker is a major nuisance, but the best way to bet a Rocketeer is to attack from the side, or from behind.

By default a Rocketeer should be deadly from the front.

#3 ReachH

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Posted November 25 2012 - 06:34 AM

View PostSythorian, on November 25 2012 - 06:26 AM, said:

To be completely honest.

I find the Rocketeer a little easy to beat. The Seeker is a major nuisance, but the best way to bet a Rocketeer is to attack from the side, or from behind.

By default a Rocketeer should be deadly from the front.

Could you give an idea of what mech you use and how you play?

View Post[HWK]HUGHES, on October 23 2013 - 06:01 PM, said:

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#4 Akrium

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Posted November 25 2012 - 06:39 AM

My issues with the rocketeer:

This is a game that supports mitigation through avoidance of damage. Why do they put in a weapon that auto-seeks? and not just 1.. but 2. and both given to one mech. I rather wish the rockets didn't auto-lock and instead they tighten up the spread. Or even better.. drop the number of rockets but increase the damage each does and tighten the spread and drop auto-lock. As it stands it is crazy OP because in the right hands the damage is a bit over the top when you combine it all together.

End game A-Class will be hard to play because ppl will know how to time damage right and when to hit them at their most vulnerable times. Yes A-Class is doing well now.. but that is because ppl haven't figure out how to fight them yet. Once they do.. it will level out fast. A-Class truly takes advantage of new players to the game. But people that have figure it out, they don't have the advantage.

#5 DarkPulse

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Posted November 25 2012 - 07:42 AM

View PostReachH, on November 25 2012 - 06:22 AM, said:

So I'm just going to assume that the existing 'seeker missile thread' is just 7 pages of noob retardation and experienced players trying to stem the tide of QQ. So I won't be replying to that.

But I want to give my honest impressions after trying out the class.

Seeker Missiles
The only problem with the seeker missile is its rate of fire. It is so high that it gives it the ability to spam while rounding a corner. If anyone follows, they die. The crazy rate of fire on the seeker when not homing allows you to suppress anywhere, making engaging a good rocketeer challenging. These two abilities that are allowed to the Rocketeer are more important than 'QQ aimbot high dps BAWWW' (recap: un-pursuable around corners; suppression). However it is comparable to how SS abuse corners and LoS as well.

Other than that, the rocketeer fills its role of 'stream-of-death' very well. While not able to reliably kill mechs who know how to dodge behind cover, it is excellent at zoning enemies out, and punishing bad positions.

Turret Mode
The turret mode is still a joke, just give them a mortar/siege mode for Gods sake. This would add to the theme of suppression.

The 1v1 Factor

I have purposely avoided the 1v1 discussion, because I believe that players who fixate on 1v1 balance are, quite frankly, bad. Although this is necessary for DeathMatch considerations (save that for another topic).

But just to state the obvious, it is a mech who was envisioned by the designers to be a stream of high explosives. Why would you step in front of that?

That being said, I felt that the rocketeer felt a little too agile and it was too easy to throw around, but this is probably due to the recent boost tweak. On the other hand its comparable mobility allows it to fend off multiple attackers while running away. Something you would expect from a mech that is just supposed to spam ordinance. Something to consider.

Closing Thoughts

All that being said, I still feel that hit-scan is still the most deadly (as in guaranteed kills vs good players - who will likely run away and repair - not just noobs who stand in your volley-o-death), and SS is still my preferred mech :)

Talking speculatively, I think the Rocketeer fills a nice niche of making fast A-Class damage dealers a little more cautious when choosing when to commit to an attack. As a SS, I for one welcome my new Rocketeer buddy to screen out those nasty infiltrators now that my 1v1 is no longer OP.

All in all an excellent change that only needs a little more tweaking. Before you condemn the new Rocketeer, ask yourself would you really want to have viable mechs limited to an elite few 'class A' mechs? No. You would want each mech to be godly in its own playstyle. And for team games to have a deep and dynamic interaction between classes. So suck it up and learn how to play against this new mech, because it should be here to stay.
Thank you. Someone who gets it for a change.

I fully agree that all it really needs is a ROF decrease, and probably a damage increase to balance reduced ROF, and then a heat increase to counter increased damage. The rockets right now do about 80 damage apiece but you can fire them about once a second (or somewhat less, I never thought to time it); maybe make it every 1.5 or 1.75 seconds but up the damage to 125-150 or so, with the corresponding heat increase. They are, after all, rockets. They should sting a bit, and if the ROF is reduced, the damage does need to be upped some to compensate it and make it an actually viable weapon.

That, as a whole, should be the general rule: The slower it fires, the more damage it should do, but also the more heat it should produce. 80 damage a second or so seems to be a "golden number" and this isn't too dissimilar in strength to that: 125 damage at 1.5 second fire rate produces an effective 83.33... DPS, while 150 at 1.75 is a slightly higher 85.71 DPS. The latter is actually fairly similar to where the Flak Cannon is (153 damage if all shots hit, takes about 1.6 seconds to re-fire IIRC) and nobody seems to have an issue with that.

This will balance it to still be potent and viable, without it experiencing the mass uselessness of a serious nerf along the lines of the complainers. Remember, kids, there's a reason Vulcan went from "Slightly overpowered" to "absolutely worthless" within one beta phase.

Edited by DarkPulse, November 25 2012 - 07:47 AM.

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#6 Akaon

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Posted November 25 2012 - 08:13 AM

Best post i've read in a long time! Fully agree with it and i really hope they will take this into account when they make changes to the rocketeer, assuming they will.
Also, slower rate of fire with similar dps/heat generation will make it slightly harder to play (as missiles hitting walls will have a bigger impact on your damage output), while being more rewarding to proper timing. Most likely more fun to play because of that.

#7 The_Silencer

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Posted November 25 2012 - 09:21 AM

Nerf its fire rate.

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#8 Zyrusticae

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Posted November 25 2012 - 09:49 AM

I'm surprised to see no mention of its incredibly low heat generation.

Seriously, isn't that an issue?

#9 Meanman

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Posted November 25 2012 - 11:17 AM

here is a thought to consider, a new player learning the game will die a lot. and feel quite discouraged. the lvl 20 and lvl 0 in the same game although a great way to learn tends to make the new player die often. and fps that is online call of duty, halo, ect there are all ways player that are supremely better than new folks. I don't play COD or Halo for that reason. what fun is it to just die 8000 times. there should be new player arenas and lvl based grouping. im new to this and find it great fun. I also play mmorpg ddo online. if some of the better player from here came to my game and pvp'd against me on my toons there where lvl matter and gear matters you would allways die endlessly. which is my point. have some considerations for learning players. to simply call them noobs and kill them is not going to make the game fun or grow.

#10 KejiGoto

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Posted November 25 2012 - 12:07 PM

I can definitely agree that the rate of fire needs to come down on the Rocketeer. I'm all for the whole stream of death concept but I've seen Rocketeer just sit there pumping out missile after missile with no signs of overheating meanwhile I can dodge around them but it feels like my weapons overheat way faster which is rather annoying.

This becomes a big problem, in my opinion, on maps like Uptown where there isn't much space to move around and there are so many vantage points where death can just be rained down on everyone.

Maybe give them like a three rocket clip or something where they get three quick blasts at the current rate of fire but then there is a delayed reload period? Feels odd to me that the Rocketeer can pump out missiles like no tomorrow but the grenade launcher takes a few moments to reload between shots. Not saying the grenade launcher needs to come up in rate of fire but that the missiles the Rocketeer can launch are just ridiculous at times.

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#11 Beemann

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Posted November 25 2012 - 05:45 PM

View PostReachH, on November 25 2012 - 06:22 AM, said:

Seeker Missiles
The only problem with the seeker missile is its rate of fire. It is so high that it gives it the ability to spam while rounding a corner. If anyone follows, they die. The crazy rate of fire on the seeker when not homing allows you to suppress anywhere, making engaging a good rocketeer challenging. These two abilities that are allowed to the Rocketeer are more important than 'QQ aimbot high dps BAWWW' (recap: un-pursuable around corners; suppression). However it is comparable to how SS abuse corners and LoS as well.

Other than that, the rocketeer fills its role of 'stream-of-death' very well. While not able to reliably kill mechs who know how to dodge behind cover, it is excellent at zoning enemies out, and punishing bad positions.
Er... the Seeker is impossible to dodge once one of them hits you because they make it nigh-impossible to see, on top of being hard to spot already

On top of that, they have fairly low heat generation for an explosive

On top of THAT they have the high ROF you're referring to

On top of THAT they have comparable DPS to other primaries, while having autoaim

The autoaim is also a problem for both low and high levels of play. At a low level of play (when everyone is bad at aiming) the seeker becomes an overbearing threat, even compared to other C mechs in their optimal ranges. At a high level, seeker play becomes detrimental. As soon as people counter seekers, the class becomes entirely useless. There is no way to get better with a weapon that aims for you, and as a result the Rocketeer becomes the evolutionary dead-end of skilled play

View PostReachH, on November 25 2012 - 06:22 AM, said:

The 1v1 Factor

I have purposely avoided the 1v1 discussion, because I believe that players who fixate on 1v1 balance are, quite frankly, bad. Although this is necessary for DeathMatch considerations (save that for another topic).

But just to state the obvious, it is a mech who was envisioned by the designers to be a stream of high explosives. Why would you step in front of that?

That being said, I felt that the rocketeer felt a little too agile and it was too easy to throw around, but this is probably due to the recent boost tweak. On the other hand its comparable mobility allows it to fend off multiple attackers while running away. Something you would expect from a mech that is just supposed to spam ordinance. Something to consider.
So wait... as a non-rocketeer your interactions with the rocketeer should be
1. Stay away from the rocketeer
2. Have multiple people assist you in fighting the rocketeer
3. Make sure you kill it quickly or it will RUN AWAY?
Yeah you know exactly what balance is

If one rocketeer should be able to fight multiple targets with ease, how do you combat 3 or more rocketeers?

As for mechs who counter A mechs, (derpy scouts aside, dunno why Flak of any sort made it onto an A, let alone the Flak Vulcan that they've called the Mini-Flak), Flak Brawlers and Heat Grenadiers are both very powerful, and pre-nerf sharpshooters were fantastic. Well played Assaults can also do quite a bit of damage, though I mostly see people steer clear of those in order to try out other mechs
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#12 Timber_Wolf

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Posted November 25 2012 - 07:22 PM

View PostReachH, on November 25 2012 - 06:22 AM, said:

Seeker Missiles
The only problem with the seeker missile is its rate of fire. It is so high that it gives it the ability to spam while rounding a corner. If anyone follows, they die. The crazy rate of fire on the seeker when not homing allows you to suppress anywhere, making engaging a good rocketeer challenging. These two abilities that are allowed to the Rocketeer are more important than 'QQ aimbot high dps BAWWW' (recap: un-pursuable around corners; suppression). However it is comparable to how SS abuse corners and LoS as well.

Other than that, the rocketeer fills its role of 'stream-of-death' very well. While not able to reliably kill mechs who know how to dodge behind cover, it is excellent at zoning enemies out, and punishing bad positions.

What about the fact they're impossible to see?  If they were more obvious it wouldn't be as much of a problem.  But combined with auto-aim and the sheer volume of them that makes it ridiculous.

View PostReachH, on November 25 2012 - 06:22 AM, said:

The 1v1 Factor

I have purposely avoided the 1v1 discussion, because I believe that players who fixate on 1v1 balance are, quite frankly, bad. Although this is necessary for DeathMatch considerations (save that for another topic).

But just to state the obvious, it is a mech who was envisioned by the designers to be a stream of high explosives. Why would you step in front of that?

Because, you know, there are never situations in missile assault or siege where you'll fight 1v1.

View PostReachH, on November 25 2012 - 06:22 AM, said:

That being said, I felt that the rocketeer felt a little too agile and it was too easy to throw around, but this is probably due to the recent boost tweak. On the other hand its comparable mobility allows it to fend off multiple attackers while running away. Something you would expect from a mech that is just supposed to spam ordinance. Something to consider.

Wait, so it's not meant to be 1v1ed, should be able to fight off multiple people while fleeing and be good at point defense at short, mid, and some good range?

View PostReachH, on November 25 2012 - 06:22 AM, said:

Closing Thoughts

All that being said, I still feel that hit-scan is still the most deadly (as in guaranteed kills vs good players - who will likely run away and repair - not just noobs who stand in your volley-o-death), and SS is still my preferred mech :)

Talking speculatively, I think the Rocketeer fills a nice niche of making fast A-Class damage dealers a little more cautious when choosing when to commit to an attack. As a SS, I for one welcome my new Rocketeer buddy to screen out those nasty infiltrators now that my 1v1 is no longer OP.

Yeah, A class and B class.  A class are the only ones who can realistically dodge that many missiles and get close enough to you.  Sure, B class can tank a couple more hits, but no damage is always better than some damage.  The seekers have high RoF, which you said should be lowered so fine, can match the DPS of most other weapons without needing you to aim, and have low heat production.  There's something very very wrong when most games I join are at least 2 rocketeers and change vs. 2 rocketeers and change.  I'd defend the mini-flak before I defend the seeker, at least you have to be kind of good to not blow up before getting to the enemy.

View PostReachH, on November 25 2012 - 06:22 AM, said:

All in all an excellent change that only needs a little more tweaking. Before you condemn the new Rocketeer, ask yourself would you really want to have viable mechs limited to an elite few 'class A' mechs? No. You would want each mech to be godly in its own playstyle. And for team games to have a deep and dynamic interaction between classes. So suck it up and learn how to play against this new mech, because it should be here to stay.

While I like the idea that the rocketeer should throw volleys of missiles in a direction, I don't think this is the way to do it.  Area, lane denial, and space control should be what it's good at.  Blowing huge loads of missiles to prevent people from wanting to venture in that direction.  The seeker can be made to do this, sure. but it needs more tweaks than just a lower RoF.  As far as turret mode goes, it sucks right now, yes, but a mortar or something that most people are wanting, fits with the whole vibe of area denial as well, giving the rocketeer a very clearly defined role.  Sort of like a siege tank from StarCraft, if you will, just with more rockets, which by default makes it way cooler.  Rockets are awesome.

Edited by Timber_Wolf, November 25 2012 - 07:25 PM.

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#13 Lithium03

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Posted November 25 2012 - 07:50 PM

View PostDarkPulse, on November 25 2012 - 07:42 AM, said:

View PostReachH, on November 25 2012 - 06:22 AM, said:


...The rockets right now do about 80 damage apiece...

Except they do 58 apiece.

View PostZyrusticae, on November 25 2012 - 09:49 AM, said:

I'm surprised to see no mention of its incredibly low heat generation.

Seriously, isn't that an issue?

It's the 5th greatest heat generator out of 15 weapons, and due to the ability to charge the HEAT cannon, it's effectively 0, so Seeker gets bumped up to 4th greatest.

View PostKejiGoto, on November 25 2012 - 12:07 PM, said:

Feels odd to me that the Rocketeer can pump out missiles like no tomorrow but the grenade launcher takes a few moments to reload between shots.

Rev-GL fires 1.2 grenades per second, Seeker fires 1.4 rockets per second, not that huge of a difference.

#14 KsanatoR

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Posted November 25 2012 - 10:22 PM

Yeah its hard to kill target, spamming seekers, use strafe, use corners, use TEAM, i kill them pretty well, just running 100 m from another side :ph34r: and making 900 dmg in a few seconds for camping rocketeer :lol:

#15 ReachH

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Posted November 26 2012 - 02:23 AM

View PostBeemann, on November 25 2012 - 05:45 PM, said:

Er... the Seeker is impossible to dodge once one of them hits you because they make it nigh-impossible to see, on top of being hard to spot already


If you consider your own play, you will realise you almost never dodge from reaction - you dodge from instinct. This plays into the whole 'have to get used to the new Rocketeer thing'.

Quote

On top of that, they have fairly low heat generation for an explosive



Regarding the heat generation, it is a primary weapon; also read:

View PostLithium03, on November 25 2012 - 07:50 PM, said:

It's the 5th greatest heat generator out of 15 weapons, and due to the ability to charge the HEAT cannon, it's effectively 0, so Seeker gets bumped up to 4th greatest.

So :/

Besides, moving from the realm of 'is it balanced?' talk to 'is it realistic?' talk; it is more realistic for a rocket, who has its propulsion in the projectile and not the gun, to generate less heat.


Quote

On top of THAT they have the high ROF you're referring to

On top of THAT they have comparable DPS to other primaries, while having autoaim

The autoaim is also a problem for both low and high levels of play. At a low level of play (when everyone is bad at aiming) the seeker becomes an overbearing threat, even compared to other C mechs in their optimal ranges. At a high level, seeker play becomes detrimental. As soon as people counter seekers, the class becomes entirely useless. There is no way to get better with a weapon that aims for you, and as a result the Rocketeer becomes the evolutionary dead-end of skilled play

I don't pretend to understand the garbage that preceded that final sentence, but that is a good observation.

Except there is this concept in fps called predictive rockets. If you have ever eaten a detonator mid-air, or rounded a corner and stepped on a grenade, you will know what I am talking about. Also remember they have splash, so firing just next to cover if you predict that that is where they will end up is really good.

My argument was simply the high rate of fire makes it a spammable skill, rather than a high risk-reward skill (lower RoF, higher damage per shot).

Quote

So wait... as a non-rocketeer your interactions with the rocketeer should be
1. Stay away from the rocketeer
2. Have multiple people assist you in fighting the rocketeer

I'm pretty sure I communicated none of this. This is all your inference, from your own limited understanding/play style.

'Do not step in front of' =/= 'must run away from'

View PostTimber_Wolf, on November 25 2012 - 07:22 PM, said:

What about the fact they're impossible to see?  If they were more obvious it wouldn't be as much of a problem.  But combined with auto-aim and the sheer volume of them that makes it ridiculous.

Again, you dodge from instinct not reaction. And you should interpret 'dodge' as 'dodge into cover'.

Quote

Because, you know, there are never situations in missile assault or siege where you'll fight 1v1.

I don't play siege or assault, maybe you could contribute more to the discussion.

Quote

Wait, so it's not meant to be 1v1ed, should be able to fight off multiple people while fleeing and be good at point defense at short, mid, and some good range?

View PostBeemann, on November 25 2012 - 05:45 PM, said:

3. Make sure you kill it quickly or it will RUN AWAY?
Yeah you know exactly what balance is

If one rocketeer should be able to fight multiple targets with ease, how do you combat 3 or more rocketeers?

Yes, you will lose a face to face confrontation with a hail of explosives.

As for the fighting while running, it is basically retreating down a path that the enemy does not have LoS, and laying down indirect-fire (fire that takes time to reach is target) to cover areas where they are likely to pursue. The SS can do this because of its hit-scan burst. And the Rocketeer can theoretically do this better because of rockets. I don't play infiltrator, but I'm sure there are good infiltrators who use grenades to cover their retreat. Same for TOWs. etc.

There seems to be a poor understanding of the potential of the dumb-fired seeker missile to cover a retreat. There's not much I can do to explain :/

At its most basic level, its when you round a corner and eat a Detonator or grenade or TOW or whatever that was fired before your enemy could see you. Imagine the enemy doing this while you are chasing him 2v1 and he is running away around lots of corners. So you take a lot of damage but cannot get a clean shot.

View Post[HWK]HUGHES, on October 23 2013 - 06:01 PM, said:

Development happens.


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#16 Beemann

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Posted November 26 2012 - 03:09 AM

You seem to have missed the core of the argument entirely
If a class isn't balanced for 1v1 (in that it's so powerful it shouldn't be looking at you if you hope to survive) and if it can choose its fights through firepower, and engage multiple targets
Then what do you expect to do against multiple rocketeers?
If a numbers advantage is required to beat a particular mech, what do you do when you CANT have the numbers advantage?
If there's no way to viably shut down a rocketeer (which there shouldn't be, by your admission) then they're imbalanced
If a rocketeer facing you = you die (something else that you yourself said), then they aren't balanced

Also lol@ another thread in which people try to base balance off of deathmatch
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#17 DarkPulse

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Posted November 26 2012 - 06:39 AM

View PostLithium03, on November 25 2012 - 07:50 PM, said:

...The rockets right now do about 80 damage apiece...
I haven't exactly tested for numbers, and finding numbers now is harder since the devs hid all the stuff away. 58 is pretty light, all things considered, but if they up the ROF delay, they definitely need to up the damage then. As I said, I think a DPS of roughly 80/second is a decent "golden number" for most weapons.

View PostBeemann, on November 26 2012 - 03:09 AM, said:

You seem to have missed the core of the argument entirely
If a class isn't balanced for 1v1 (in that it's so powerful it shouldn't be looking at you if you hope to survive) and if it can choose its fights through firepower, and engage multiple targets
Then what do you expect to do against multiple rocketeers?
If a numbers advantage is required to beat a particular mech, what do you do when you CANT have the numbers advantage?
If there's no way to viably shut down a rocketeer (which there shouldn't be, by your admission) then they're imbalanced
If a rocketeer facing you = you die (something else that you yourself said), then they aren't balanced

Also lol@ another thread in which people try to base balance off of deathmatch
I've taken down Rocketeers 1v1. Granted, I wasn't in the best of shape afterwards, but it's entirely possible to out-DPS them.

Hint: Smaller, faster mechs do wonders.

If there's two? Then obviously you work on splitting them apart, or at least their attention. Shouldn't be too hard.

Edited by DarkPulse, November 26 2012 - 06:40 AM.

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A coagulated, gloomy thinking in the intelligence, as my major ego.
An antinomian theorem of behaviorism, in all of my thinkings.
It's what we call "The Inversion Impulse."

#18 Lithium03

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Posted November 26 2012 - 07:01 AM

View PostDarkPulse, on November 26 2012 - 06:39 AM, said:

View PostLithium03, on November 25 2012 - 07:50 PM, said:

...The rockets right now do about 80 damage apiece...
I haven't exactly tested for numbers, and finding numbers now is harder since the devs hid all the stuff away. 58 is pretty light, all things considered, but if they up the ROF delay, they definitely need to up the damage then. As I said, I think a DPS of roughly 80/second is a decent "golden number" for most weapons.

At 58 per rocket and 1.4 rockets per second, they do 81 dps, soooooo they're fine as is? Aside from auto aim ofc. The tooltips in game are actually accurate (save for the vulcan and sabot, both got buffs, but the tooltip hasn't changed for the sabot, and the heat in-game hasn't changed for the vulcan. I don't play SS so I'm relying on others who said the SS got better after the 21st) So if they're off it's likely a bug or a non updated tooltip, which is still a bug.

#19 DarkPulse

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Posted November 26 2012 - 07:34 AM

View PostLithium03, on November 26 2012 - 07:01 AM, said:

At 58 per rocket and 1.4 rockets per second, they do 81 dps, soooooo they're fine as is? Aside from auto aim ofc. The tooltips in game are actually accurate (save for the vulcan and sabot, both got buffs, but the tooltip hasn't changed for the sabot, and the heat in-game hasn't changed for the vulcan. I don't play SS so I'm relying on others who said the SS got better after the 21st) So if they're off it's likely a bug or a non updated tooltip, which is still a bug.
I never said I have a problem with them as-is. :P I simply stated that if they intend to reduce the ROF (because that's what most people seem to be complaining about, second being their tracking ability which I doubt is going away), then they need to increase the damage accordingly. It makes it more of a skillful use of the Seeker, rather than spamming it.

I'm trying to avoid a situation like the Vulcan and the Sharpshooter, where it got nerfed into absolute oblivion.
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#20 Spawny

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Posted November 26 2012 - 08:36 AM

I have no trouble fighting and killing rocketeers as an A-class. Provided the rocketeer is a new player.
Experienced C-class pilots are be very hard to kill for me, as they will try to keep their distance. I only have to eat 1 volley and I'm pretty much dead.

As it is now, I haven't had much trouble, but I play missile mostly.
Alpha 2 B-Class Bruiser
Closed Beta 1 C-Class Brawler
Closed Beta 2 A-Class Berzerker
Closed Beta 3 A-Class Scout





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