 3
 3
 
#1
Posted August 19 2014 - 04:08 PM
I know MMR is a kind of indincation of how good you are at playing. But can someone tell, or show me some information about what it really is, and how the things I do in the game count on MMR?
Thanks.
#2
Posted August 19 2014 - 04:15 PM
Most recent topic on it. Not sure where the threads nokari is talking about are though.
Edited by ticklemyiguana, August 19 2014 - 04:15 PM.
 
#3
Posted August 19 2014 - 04:41 PM
- Kill/death ratio calculations per match
- Damage ratio calculations per match
- Accuracy rating for global weapons
- Misc match stats
- Pilot level (a lower pilot level amplifies the rating incremental change % more than likely)
- Amount of kills per match
- Amount of time played
- Damage/combat efficiency rating
- How "well" you do against MMR values that are greater than yours
- Survivability
Also, one fact that we all know to be true, is the equation parses its data when you complete 1 (one) match.
Edited by Draigun, August 19 2014 - 05:47 PM.

"The flesh is dying, and we're the next big thing.
The world we know is every bit of real — and a hell of a lot more pure — than this decaying mudball you're trying to save.
Ascension lies in new ideas, not dusted-off old ones." - Philosophy of the Virtual Adepts
#4
Posted August 19 2014 - 04:51 PM
So I recently decided to create a smurf for the purpose of playing either when I'm drunk or don't feel like taking things too seriously. Within about 4 hours of playtime on this account, my mmr was already 200 higher than my actual account. I thought it was funny that I sucked so badly when I first started playing that my mmr on the real account is still harder to raise than a smurf. Anyone else noticed something like this?
#5
Posted August 19 2014 - 04:52 PM
 Draigun, on August 19 2014 - 04:41 PM, said:
Draigun, on August 19 2014 - 04:41 PM, said:
Essentially the topic linked above mostly explains the fundamentals, but if I had to take a guess at what the specifics are:
- Kill/death ratio calculations per match
- Damage ratio calculations per match
- Accuracy rating for global weapons
- Misc match stats
- Pilot level (a lower pilot level amplifies the rating incremental change % more than likely)
- Amount of kills per match
- Amount of time played
- Damage/combat efficiency rating
- How "well" you do against MMR values that are greater than yours
- Survivability
Also, one fact that we all know to be true, is the equation parses its data when you complete 1 (one) match.
 
#6
Posted August 19 2014 - 04:55 PM
 ticklemyiguana, on August 19 2014 - 04:15 PM, said:
ticklemyiguana, on August 19 2014 - 04:15 PM, said:
Most recent topic on it. Not sure where the threads nokari is talking about are though.
Best post on it. https://community.pl...ed/#entry549622
Come join the Hawken IRC Channel and chat about Hawken: #hawkenscrim on irc.quakenet.net
Yes, I am a wizard - There is no cupcake conspiracy
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#7
Posted August 19 2014 - 05:45 PM
 Ashfire908, on August 19 2014 - 04:55 PM, said:
Ashfire908, on August 19 2014 - 04:55 PM, said:
 ticklemyiguana, on August 19 2014 - 04:15 PM, said:
ticklemyiguana, on August 19 2014 - 04:15 PM, said:
Most recent topic on it. Not sure where the threads nokari is talking about are though.
Best post on it. https://community.pl...ed/#entry549622
Edited by Draigun, August 19 2014 - 05:45 PM.

"The flesh is dying, and we're the next big thing.
The world we know is every bit of real — and a hell of a lot more pure — than this decaying mudball you're trying to save.
Ascension lies in new ideas, not dusted-off old ones." - Philosophy of the Virtual Adepts
#8
Posted August 19 2014 - 08:56 PM
 crockrocket, on August 19 2014 - 04:51 PM, said:
crockrocket, on August 19 2014 - 04:51 PM, said:
So I recently decided to create a smurf for the purpose of playing either when I'm drunk or don't feel like taking things too seriously. Within about 4 hours of playtime on this account, my mmr was already 200 higher than my actual account. I thought it was funny that I sucked so badly when I first started playing that my mmr on the real account is still harder to raise than a smurf. Anyone else noticed something like this?
 
					
					Lingua-indigenae *=0=* Clans & Guilds *=||=* Which Mech? *=X=* GPU Test *=W=* CPU Test *=O=* Dementia
#9
Posted August 20 2014 - 06:47 AM
How you improve, however, is entirely up to you. People have tried to help you multiple times, give tips, and even encouragement, but it seems that you have just brushed it off. Clearly it seems that you have given up, but that is not the case because you are still playing the game (hopefully).
My tip would be to revisit the core basics of the game:
1. Dodging when necessary. Don't just press shift everytime your dodge cooldown is up.
2. The key to good aim is "pre-fire or pre-aim". If you set up your reticle to the relative position of the enemy you will have an exponentially easier time targetting and tracking them. I.e. when peeking around corners, don't have your aim wandering off in the middle of nowhere, aim where you think the enemy is behind the wall.
3. Watch the dang radar!
 
#10
Posted August 20 2014 - 10:17 AM
Edited by Wasabi_Wei, August 20 2014 - 10:19 AM.
Just Saying: "If an officer of the law expects to be treated as such, then they had better act as one and uphold our laws and Rights in the pursuit of Justice."
#11
Posted August 20 2014 - 12:18 PM
 MushyMoosh, on August 20 2014 - 06:47 AM, said:
MushyMoosh, on August 20 2014 - 06:47 AM, said:
3. Watch the dang radar!
I've played with you a few times (just DM as far as I remember) and one of your complaints was that you always seem to get ganged up on. Watching the radar will help you avoid that. Something that some of the others (myself included) in those matches is attempting to be sneakier until you've actually spotted someone, or preferably even a couple people fighting so that you can ambush them while they're weak.
As far as I can tell, your skills are there, but you need to work on your situational awareness to avoid getting in spots where you're surrounded.
#12
Posted August 20 2014 - 03:20 PM
- When you need to get to your teammates fast to help prevent annihilation
 
- Chasing an enemy to finish what you started, given that you know they are attempting to return to the enemy
 
- Escaping the current situation, whether judgement indicates that if you stick around, 5 vs 2, for example, will not work; or you don't feel like you could outgun the opponent—some may debate that it shows weak players, but I disagree; the game guide even encourages a few classes to actually boost away
I unfortunately didn't know that boosting caused you to show up on the radar for awhile, and during that time, I was stuck in the 2000s of MMR. Now, I've almost surpassed the 2300 mark. Combat efficiency has increased dramatically, and generally, you will perform better. Premeditated strikes are always the best strikes in HAWKEN, but they are also the most difficult to setup.
Using this method alone will not make you better in terms of gameplay by any means; it should be used in conjunction with other methods and techniques, some of which you could probably find from some HAWKEN Steam guides created by the community.
Edited by Draigun, August 20 2014 - 03:32 PM.

"The flesh is dying, and we're the next big thing.
The world we know is every bit of real — and a hell of a lot more pure — than this decaying mudball you're trying to save.
Ascension lies in new ideas, not dusted-off old ones." - Philosophy of the Virtual Adepts
#13
Posted August 20 2014 - 03:50 PM
 Draigun, on August 20 2014 - 03:20 PM, said:
Draigun, on August 20 2014 - 03:20 PM, said:
- When you need to get to your teammates fast to help prevent annihilation
 
- Chasing an enemy to finish what you started, given that you know they are attempting to return to the enemy
 
- Escaping the current situation, whether judgement indicates that if you stick around, 5 vs 2, for example, will not work; or you don't feel like you could outgun the opponent—some may debate that it shows weak players, but I disagree; the game guide even encourages a few classes to actually boost away
I unfortunately didn't know that boosting caused you to show up on the radar for awhile, and during that time, I was stuck in the 2000s of MMR. Now, I've almost surpassed the 2300 mark. Combat efficiency has increased dramatically, and generally, you will perform better. Premeditated strikes are always the best strikes in HAWKEN, but they are also the most difficult to setup.
Using this method alone will not make you better in terms of gameplay by any means; it should be used in conjunction with other methods and techniques, some of which you could probably find from some HAWKEN Steam guides created by the community.
You can also boost after a dodge. Most people think their movements stop after a dodge, but you can change directions and boost in place of a dodge.
Also, how did you think people show up on radar o.O
Edited by MushyMoosh, August 20 2014 - 03:51 PM.
 
#14
Posted August 21 2014 - 06:41 PM
 Ashfire908, on August 19 2014 - 04:55 PM, said:
Ashfire908, on August 19 2014 - 04:55 PM, said:
 ticklemyiguana, on August 19 2014 - 04:15 PM, said:
ticklemyiguana, on August 19 2014 - 04:15 PM, said:
Most recent topic on it. Not sure where the threads nokari is talking about are though.
Best post on it. https://community.pl...ed/#entry549622
You know I think the "against higher mmr players" factor should be of higher importance. I just played a game on my 1800 mmr account in a 2100 average lobby, and got just under top 50% (maybe 2 players under). I would consider that a solid performance given that I'm clearly out of my league, however this doesn't result in an mmr raise (it essentially stayed the same, down 1 point). Maybe I'm wrong, but I feel like if I'm able to be a contributing member of a team that's out of my league, that means I should be closer to that level, right?
#15
Posted August 21 2014 - 08:22 PM
 crockrocket, on August 21 2014 - 06:41 PM, said:
crockrocket, on August 21 2014 - 06:41 PM, said:
 Ashfire908, on August 19 2014 - 04:55 PM, said:
Ashfire908, on August 19 2014 - 04:55 PM, said:
 ticklemyiguana, on August 19 2014 - 04:15 PM, said:
ticklemyiguana, on August 19 2014 - 04:15 PM, said:
Most recent topic on it. Not sure where the threads nokari is talking about are though.
Best post on it. https://community.pl...ed/#entry549622
You know I think the "against higher mmr players" factor should be of higher importance. I just played a game on my 1800 mmr account in a 2100 average lobby, and got just under top 50% (maybe 2 players under). I would consider that a solid performance given that I'm clearly out of my league, however this doesn't result in an mmr raise (it essentially stayed the same, down 1 point). Maybe I'm wrong, but I feel like if I'm able to be a contributing member of a team that's out of my league, that means I should be closer to that level, right?
That is the ideal working state of MMR implementation. But, not everything is perfect, and certainly not MMR. I honestly had thought the process of it was much more complex, but given sources, it actually seems like a 50% hard cap to increase or decrease. At least, I would have involved many more variables to make it much more accurate.
Also, believe it or not, it's actually impossible to calculate your "true" MMR value, since (I'm assuming) Ashfire doesn't have the full equation. Now, that doesn't mean he can't do some few tricks to estimate your MMR value. Thus,
That is why ScrimBot gives you a true MMR value between two of them, usually spanning 300? MMR in points. It is between this value that your MMR lies within. I don't know the confidence intervals for each set, but it might be around 95% confidence.
Edited by Draigun, August 21 2014 - 08:28 PM.

"The flesh is dying, and we're the next big thing.
The world we know is every bit of real — and a hell of a lot more pure — than this decaying mudball you're trying to save.
Ascension lies in new ideas, not dusted-off old ones." - Philosophy of the Virtual Adepts
#16
Posted August 21 2014 - 09:00 PM
 Draigun, on August 21 2014 - 08:22 PM, said:
Draigun, on August 21 2014 - 08:22 PM, said:
Also, believe it or not, it's actually impossible to calculate your "true" MMR value, since (I'm assuming) Ashfire doesn't have the full equation. Now, that doesn't mean he can't do some few tricks to estimate your MMR value. Thus,
That is why ScrimBot gives you a true MMR value between two of them, usually spanning 300? MMR in points. It is between this value that your MMR lies within. I don't know the confidence intervals for each set, but it might be around 95% confidence.
Not really. No, I don't know the MMR calculation (and from what I know I don't have anywhere near the info or time to derive it on the fly), so instead I just check the user's stats on the backend and return their reported MMR. The 'true' MMR reading is a output I added that gives I think a 90% confidence rating based off of the user's reported deviation.
What the command's code looks like, with all the input validation and rate limiting and other stuff removed:
stats = api.get_user_stats(user)
mmr = stats["MatchMaking.Rating"]
deviation = stats["MatchMaking.Deviation"]
message = "Your MMR is {0:.2f}, with an approximate true rating between {1:.2f}-{2:.2f}.".format(mmr, mmr - (deviation * 2), mmr + (deviation * 2))
"I'm bad at code, what is this?"
- Get the player's stats
 
- Grab the MMR
 
- Grab the MMR Deviation (glicko stuff)
 
- Format the message with the MMR. Range is just the MMR +- (deviation * 2)
Edited by Ashfire908, August 21 2014 - 09:08 PM.
Come join the Hawken IRC Channel and chat about Hawken: #hawkenscrim on irc.quakenet.net
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#17
Posted August 22 2014 - 05:51 AM
 Ashfire908, on August 21 2014 - 09:00 PM, said:
Ashfire908, on August 21 2014 - 09:00 PM, said:
stats = api.get_user_stats(user)
mmr = stats["MatchMaking.Rating"]
deviation = stats["MatchMaking.Deviation"]
message = "Your MMR is {0:.2f}, with an approximate true rating between {1:.2f}-{2:.2f}.".format(mmr, mmr - (deviation * 2), mmr + (deviation * 2))
"I'm bad at code, what is this?"
- Get the player's stats
 
- Grab the MMR
 
- Grab the MMR Deviation (glicko stuff)
 
- Format the message with the MMR. Range is just the MMR +- (deviation * 2)
I don't know why you are multiplying the deviation by 2.
this says that if your MMR 1500 and your deviation is 100 that your range is 1300 - 1700. This does not seem right to me. Might be better to divide by 2. so that your range would be 1450 - 1550, or don't divide or multiple by 2 which gives you 1400 - 1600.
Just a thought
#18
Posted August 22 2014 - 06:36 AM
 Draigun, on August 21 2014 - 08:22 PM, said:
Draigun, on August 21 2014 - 08:22 PM, said:
That is why ScrimBot gives you a true MMR value between two of them, usually spanning 300? MMR in points. It is between this value that your MMR lies within. I don't know the confidence intervals for each set, but it might be around 95% confidence.
Scrimbot pulls your MMR directly from Hawken. It does not calculate it because Hawken does that for everyone. Ashfire provides a range as well as the raw MMR. The range is only meant to give people an idea of where they currently are and how far up and down their MMR could be considered worthless because a players "true skill rating" is likely somewhere in the range not necessarily their raw score at that particular moment.
You are reading into it way too much.
Edited by Leonhardt, August 22 2014 - 06:37 AM.

#19
Posted August 22 2014 - 07:55 AM
 zorin1, on August 22 2014 - 05:51 AM, said:
zorin1, on August 22 2014 - 05:51 AM, said:
this says that if your MMR 1500 and your deviation is 100 that your range is 1300 - 1700. This does not seem right to me. Might be better to divide by 2. so that your range would be 1450 - 1550, or don't divide or multiple by 2 which gives you 1400 - 1600.
Just a thought
Because if I change the range I give, I change the confidence level (95% for the current setup) for the 'true' rating to be in that range. I can't just arbitrarily change it to whatever I want.
Come join the Hawken IRC Channel and chat about Hawken: #hawkenscrim on irc.quakenet.net
Yes, I am a wizard - There is no cupcake conspiracy
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#20
Posted August 22 2014 - 09:34 AM
1,96 is very close to 2, and for the purpose 2 works well enough.
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