HAWKEN servers are up and our latest minor update is live!
Forgot Password? SUPPORT REDEEM CODE

Jump to content


[Public questionnaire] Are you still playing regularly? If not, why did you stop playing?


  • Please log in to reply
212 replies to this topic

#1 Xacius

Xacius

    The Saltan

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,889 posts
  • LocationOther games, waiting for dev beacon

Posted December 30 2013 - 03:57 AM

Greetings.  I've been playing Hawken since September of 2012, and have seen countless players come and go.  Some stayed, but most left the game for greener pastures.  New names have popped up in higher level matches, and the game seems to have a steady stream of players in the newbie level range.  Nonetheless, there are far fewer games available at max level than there used to be.  

Throughout the previous 15 months, I've taken numerous "breaks" from Hawken.  Sometimes it was because of school (finals), and other times it was in response to undesired gameplay changes.  

Many experienced players are currently on hiatus from Hawken due to an absence of support for organized matches. A lot of players are also waiting for additional gamemodes to keep gameplay interesting.  I realize that this thread probably won't accomplish what I want it to, largely because most people who have left the game no longer view the forums.  Even so, I figured I'd post anyway.  

If you've ever taken a break from the game or currently play less than 5 hours a week, then feel free to share why.  Are you still playing regularly? If not, why did you stop playing?

Edited by Xacius, December 30 2013 - 04:26 AM.

High MMR (2700+) livestream (scroll down on twitch page for in-depth bio and PC specs).   Check out my Steam Guide!

Exeon is fuzzy bunny bad.

Currently inactive.  Estimated return: TPG 2

#2 thedark20

thedark20

    Advanced Member

  • Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 105 posts
  • LocationSpain

Posted December 30 2013 - 04:22 AM

I still playing it, but less than before. One of the reasons is the careless about teamwork. People often leave the group and go alone around the map, getting killed by groups of enemy team and it's very frustrating. It gets you bored and you leave the game.
Posted Image

#3 FenixStryk

FenixStryk

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 798 posts
  • LocationUS-East

Posted December 30 2013 - 04:24 AM

I stopped playing regularly just before the Technician patch. It wasn't the Technician that made me leave; it was the repetition, the familiar faces, the predictable match results washing into each other. The game lost its novelty and there wasn't anything left for me to learn, practice or toy with -- not even the tailor-made burst B that was the old, unnerfed Raider.

In terms of match sway, there is little about this game that I feel takes higher level FPS skills on an individual level. Scrims and tourneys are won by team synergy, positioning (see: map knowledge) and intelligent resource management (health spread, item use, etc.) -- so while there is something for set teams to practice, casual pub players have virtually nothing to work towards once they have learned the basics and equipped themselves.

At the time I told myself I'd stop playing until average players got better, but that was just veiling the real issue: the game was boring, and is still boring. It will always be boring for me if I am not engaged simply by piloting my Mech, and right now that is still the case. There's just not enough to do between a slow walk, a limited dodge, a forward thrust and a jump using weapons with splash so large I barely have to think about it. There's no momentum to work with and no meaningful sense of marksmanship... there's nothing left but a treadmill.

These days it seems like it's too late for any meaningful change. The pond is too shallow and there is no way to fill it.

It was fun while it lasted.


#4 Xacius

Xacius

    The Saltan

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,889 posts
  • LocationOther games, waiting for dev beacon

Posted December 30 2013 - 04:28 AM

View PostFenixStryk, on December 30 2013 - 04:24 AM, said:

At the time I told myself I'd stop playing until average players got better, but that was just veiling the real issue: the game was boring, and is still boring. It will always be boring for me if I am not engaged simply by piloting my Mech, and right now that is still the case. There's just not enough to do between a slow walk, a limited dodge, a forward thrust and a jump using weapons with splash so large I barely have to think about it. There's no momentum to work with and no meaningful sense of marksmanship... there's nothing left but a treadmill.

Interesting!  I like your analysis.  With regards to movement, do you have any potential additions in mind that could increase the depth of the game?

Edited by Xacius, December 30 2013 - 04:29 AM.

High MMR (2700+) livestream (scroll down on twitch page for in-depth bio and PC specs).   Check out my Steam Guide!

Exeon is fuzzy bunny bad.

Currently inactive.  Estimated return: TPG 2

#5 Exeon

Exeon

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,009 posts
  • Locationnear the north pole

Posted December 30 2013 - 04:39 AM

I've taken a number of breaks, this is purely due to a lack of a competitive HAWKEN. You can only run over newbloods in pubs so much. I guess you could blame the low population(lack of skilled players mainly) and at other times lack of competitive support. There really aren't enough top tier players, I've been playing just as long as xacius and I doubt you could make more than 5-6 5(6)-man teams with all the really good players I've met since I started.

View PostDew, on April 04 2014 - 01:15 PM, said:

There's a difference between making the hoop 14 feet high and telling all the players that you have to wait for half a second after running before you can shoot the ball.


#6 HatesYourFace

HatesYourFace

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,941 posts
  • LocationNew York

Posted December 30 2013 - 04:42 AM

I still play quite a bit (A couple hours a day usually) But I'll admit it's not as much as I used to, but then again I've been on a solo player kick for a few months. Playing Endless Space and a few shooters I've been meaning to beat (Metro:2033 Last Light / ZenoClash 2)

In my opinion it's perfectly normal to go through phases of playing heavily then taking a break for a while to play something else, you'll get sick of anything if you do it to much. Hawken is still my go to online multiplayer game.

Really you can blame Endless Space lol, I just love me some 4x strategy.
Posted Image

I also play on "PoundSignYoloSwag" (Assault/G2 Assault) and "FriendshipIsMagic" (Rocketeer) But haven't been able to add them to my Sig yet due to computer problems.

#7 Onebullit

Onebullit

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,310 posts
  • LocationBelgium

Posted December 30 2013 - 04:53 AM

Didn't really take a break from Hawken but i must admit that i played a handfull of games
after the Technician patch.  I almost play once in 3 weeks and that's it.
Before the Technician patch, i used to play a few hours every day but not anymore.
Also, and this can maybe hurt but, there are other F2P games that are far more interesting then Hawken.

><(((((°> - - - - - - - - - - -  ><((°> ><((°> ><((°>

HAЩKEИ ---> hawken

Member of: Critical Assist


#8 FenixStryk

FenixStryk

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 798 posts
  • LocationUS-East

Posted December 30 2013 - 04:56 AM

View PostXacius, on December 30 2013 - 04:28 AM, said:

With regards to movement, do you have any potential additions in mind that could increase the depth of the game?
I would have to think about it before giving you a good answer. It's easy to say "make the game faster," but a proper solution needs to take certain limitations into account: the map pool, weapon splash and functionality, fuel limits, and so on.


For now, I'll say that I think walking should be fast enough to be a meaningful concern when aiming at a target, and that dodge/boost should be aggressively tuned to retain usefulness after the former change.

These days, unless your opponent has access to a dodge it feels closer to shooting a stationary target. They can stand there and take it, boost directly into it or jump up to make your next shot that much easier -- tell me, which of the three is the most viable option? There's nothing sudden about any of them, which explains the general popularity of low dodge CD Mechs that are better at covering up that flaw in Hawken's combat.

Type A preference is a symptom of a greater issue: dodging is the only viable form of evasive movement in combat. It's fair for it to be the most effective option, but right now it is the only option. In an engaging shooter, that simply shouldn't be the case.

It was fun while it lasted.


#9 HatesYourFace

HatesYourFace

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,941 posts
  • LocationNew York

Posted December 30 2013 - 05:05 AM

View PostFenixStryk, on December 30 2013 - 04:56 AM, said:

dodging is the only viable form of evasive movement in combat. It's fair for it to be the most effective option, but right now it is the only option. In an engaging shooter, that simply shouldn't be the case.

Honest question: What other first person shooters even have a dodge? Or any form of evasive option? In COD/Halo/BF/TF/MWO your options are to umm...duck, jump, nothing? I'm not sure what you're looking for but it sounds like it's Armored Core? Not that I wouldn't love a competitive online Armored Core game, but that doesn't mean I want to change this one untill it's more like it. We have way more mobility / ability to dodge in this game than any other FPS that I'm aware of or have ever played. So what was this "engaging shooter" you are comparing it to?
Posted Image

I also play on "PoundSignYoloSwag" (Assault/G2 Assault) and "FriendshipIsMagic" (Rocketeer) But haven't been able to add them to my Sig yet due to computer problems.

#10 FenixStryk

FenixStryk

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 798 posts
  • LocationUS-East

Posted December 30 2013 - 05:11 AM

View PostHatesYourFace, on December 30 2013 - 05:05 AM, said:

Honest question: What other first person shooters even have a dodge? Or any form of evasive option? [...] what was this "engaging shooter" you are comparing it to?
Every FPS where zig-zag movement is enough to evade a shotgun blast. Keep in mind, in many of the games you just listed off basic movement is already fast enough to do this.

It was fun while it lasted.


#11 Exeon

Exeon

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,009 posts
  • Locationnear the north pole

Posted December 30 2013 - 05:15 AM

View PostFenixStryk, on December 30 2013 - 04:24 AM, said:


At the time I told myself I'd stop playing until average players got better, but that was just veiling the real issue: the game was boring, and is still boring.

These days it seems like it's too late for any meaningful change. The pond is too shallow and there is no way to fill it.

When I get back from my trip I plan on working on guides. what wolfFTW started was great but there's a lot more to this game. The problem in my eyes is the average player skill level, they just don't have the tools to learn. I cant count how many players have wandered in to the bsb and in short time with the right information they've improved immensely. When they had ranked servers this problem was made much worse, the new players didn't have the experience of facing top tier players. Without seeing what a mech is actually capable of you get what I like to call mechwarrior tier aka beginner tier from ye old ranked servers rip. My only problem is these guides will only help forum users, what about the large majority of players that don't use it or has no friends that do? Many games have been putting some form of advertisement of important forum news in their game/launcher, why not an in game advice section(chatroom please???)

As far as your last comment, after the sweeping change of ascension or any number of changes that have been influenced by the community, I don't see how you could believe that. I'd love to see any depth increases that don't ruin the fun of hawken.

View PostDew, on April 04 2014 - 01:15 PM, said:

There's a difference between making the hoop 14 feet high and telling all the players that you have to wait for half a second after running before you can shoot the ball.


#12 FakeName

FakeName

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,927 posts
  • LocationIn the cockpit of my Succubus

Posted December 30 2013 - 05:19 AM

I don't play Hawken so much anymore, only if I am not in the mood for AC4, WoWP, WoT, Rome II and even LoL.

Reason for that are the following:

- Dmg and sustain system changed from offensive to defensive: it is mroe effective to have a tech in their back and "meditank" instead of going in, attack and KILL

- 670 HP inf

- countless bugs, which are very old and never fixed

- No update for weeks/months (only small, not worth to mention)

- No dmg, offensive internals, upgrades

- unrealistic internals (failsafe, deflectors, fuelconverter?!)

- Too many heal orbs

- Only TDM is played

- MM balance

- Useless abillities for some mechs (best example: reaper)

- Countless excuses from ADH for failure and delay of updates etc.

- Tuning not available for every mech (eg fuel tank for scout where SCOUT NEEDS FUEL TANK MOST! Inf does not need fuel tank, he already has a huge one)

- No ammo (spamming rockets and bullets is not punished)

- Overheating is a joke, either cooling units are OP or a mech NEVER overheats

- Some mechs are way too slow (even some A class mechs)

- Pilot lv restriction to join servers

- Missing KDR stats

- Missing MMR

- Clan system missign whic hwas announced to be implemented in Ascension

- HUD/UI is ugly and does not fit to Hawkens feeling of a "dirty, and polluted world"

- Unable to customize weapons and HUD

- Overflow of HC

- Lame customizations

- Gameplay of TDM (no objectives)

- Unable to start a DM match with 1 player (or atleast 2!!!)



Yep, as you can see MANY reasons why I don't play Hawken so often. And if I play, then I have to paly TDM, so I troll the MM and imbalance games for my advantage because I'm sick of beeing matched with the worst players in the room.

"Things change ... thank god, otherwise we would still hunt animals to survive and forge weapons of stone."

- FakeName

Posted Image


#13 HatesYourFace

HatesYourFace

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,941 posts
  • LocationNew York

Posted December 30 2013 - 05:20 AM

View PostFenixStryk, on December 30 2013 - 05:11 AM, said:

Every FPS where zig-zag movement is enough to evade a shotgun blast. Keep in mind, in many of the games you just listed off basic movement is already fast enough to do this.

That's relative to the skill of the opposing shooter, like any game...including this one.
Posted Image

I also play on "PoundSignYoloSwag" (Assault/G2 Assault) and "FriendshipIsMagic" (Rocketeer) But haven't been able to add them to my Sig yet due to computer problems.

#14 hendman

hendman

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,901 posts

Posted December 30 2013 - 05:22 AM

I stopped playing when Ascension was released. The tech took away the soul from hawken, ascension took away the look and feel.

#15 Aregon

Aregon

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 2,349 posts
  • LocationDistrict 19, Kobalt, Crion, Illal

Posted December 30 2013 - 05:22 AM

Hawken was the second game that was able to hold onto me this hard (the first was Lego Universe). It had a look that was so special, I was hooked even before starting to play the game! It had a story which easily could be expandable and fit me. It was all I had wished for, a game that included big robots going on war on each other for survival.

I shall admit that the game have been making me more stressed then relaxed at times, but I blame my competitive personality for that. The most frustrating thing I find got to actually be the players themselves. Many give constructive criticism (like you Xacius), but then there also are the pessimists. I can live with them being negative to the game, but when they start saying that it will go to hell just because of some minor problems I really get annoyed (I believe I don`t need to mention names here).

I shall admit the game got some problems here and there, but which game doesn`t? Mention one game without any glitches, bugs or balance problems (if you mention TF2 I will rip your head off). Back when Lego Universe still was rolling there was lots of stuff we wanted to implement and fix, but our voices was never really heard. And when a group of kids can stay positive to a game for over 4 years then you guys should too.

All in all I am glad for finding this game, the community is filled with great souls and the clans are simply great. People are constructive (most of you) and the Devs actually listen to the community (most of the time at least. The 90% failsafe is something we simply don`t mention).
I`ll fix it later.

#16 Akrium

Akrium

    Mean Kitty

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 2,217 posts
  • LocationUSA

Posted December 30 2013 - 05:23 AM

I won't play until the holiday event is over...

After trying 9 times I just got annoyed at "farming" for something that was supposed to be a special gift to the community. I am playing a FPS game, not a MMO.

Toss on the fact I don't like the game's play as much right now, I am waiting for another patch to hit to see if things peek my interest more then. I just really wanted that cosmetic and with the annoyance of not really enjoying the current game.. I had to just stop playing again.

Also previous reasons I took time away were:
I just got done leveling every mech at the time to lvl 25 (about a week or two off, long time ago now)
Ascension dropped and I uninstalled the game for a long while, until the bot/pred patch dropped.

#17 Exeon

Exeon

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,009 posts
  • Locationnear the north pole

Posted December 30 2013 - 05:28 AM

View PostFenixStryk, on December 30 2013 - 04:56 AM, said:


For now, I'll say that I think walking should be fast enough to be a meaningful concern when aiming at a target

I'd love to see this, I just imagine my scout as a giant velociraptor. I doubt it would happen but, I don't know what they'd do about boosting. It would be like activating warp drive also the turn rate cap. Devs can you set up a HAB server for this please, be adventurous!

View PostDew, on April 04 2014 - 01:15 PM, said:

There's a difference between making the hoop 14 feet high and telling all the players that you have to wait for half a second after running before you can shoot the ball.


#18 Xacius

Xacius

    The Saltan

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,889 posts
  • LocationOther games, waiting for dev beacon

Posted December 30 2013 - 05:33 AM

View PostFenixStryk, on December 30 2013 - 04:56 AM, said:

View PostXacius, on December 30 2013 - 04:28 AM, said:

With regards to movement, do you have any potential additions in mind that could increase the depth of the game?
I would have to think about it before giving you a good answer. It's easy to say "make the game faster," but a proper solution needs to take certain limitations into account: the map pool, weapon splash and functionality, fuel limits, and so on.


For now, I'll say that I think walking should be fast enough to be a meaningful concern when aiming at a target, and that dodge/boost should be aggressively tuned to retain usefulness after the former change.

These days, unless your opponent has access to a dodge it feels closer to shooting a stationary target. They can stand there and take it, boost directly into it or jump up to make your next shot that much easier -- tell me, which of the three is the most viable option? There's nothing sudden about any of them, which explains the general popularity of low dodge CD Mechs that are better at covering up that flaw in Hawken's combat.

Type A preference is a symptom of a greater issue: dodging is the only viable form of evasive movement in combat. It's fair for it to be the most effective option, but right now it is the only option. In an engaging shooter, that simply shouldn't be the case.

Your response really sparked my interest.  Here's what I've got so far:

Through analysis of competitive games with large followings, the most common shared characteristic is depth.  Fighting games like Marvel, Street Fighter, and SSB Melee have kept players interested for years because they offer deep mechanics requiring precise timing, spacing, and superb reaction speed (these mechanics give players more options).  Games like Counter Strike are popular because of the high skill ceiling with regards to precise aim. In the days of Arena FPS’s, Quake was popular because of its mixture of robust movement and demand for precision.  

Hawken, on the other hand, doesn’t have any features that take a considerable amount of time to master.  It lacks depth.  The aiming is easy in comparison to Counter Strike, in that precision is of little assistance due to lack of locational damage (a feature that a lot of players like—this isn’t the problem), large hitboxes, and slow speeds.  The movement is straightforward and easy to pick up, but lacks any real depth.  Dodges are predictable and boosting in the middle of combat to juke or evade simply stalls the inevitable (the player can’t retaliate while boosting and can’t boost indefinitely due to a fuel limitation).  All in all, the player’s options are limited.  Running and shooting is woefully ineffective because even the fastest run speeds are pitifully easy to track. In the air, players don’t have much control over the direction they’re flying in, and switching directions in mid-air is nearly impossible without coming to a complete stop for a couple seconds.  As such, flight paths are easily predictable (the Zerker is the only exception here.  I feel that if all mechs had comparable air speed to air dynamics zerker, the meta would evolve considerably).

At its core, the metagame is mostly knowledge-based, with aim playing a role (albeit a small one… aiming in Hawken isn’t that hard for the experienced FPS player).  One of the key aspects of becoming a good player is learning how to analyze movement, and when new players adopt that general understanding they become better at landing their shots.  Dodges are predictable, and boosting is flawed due to the reasons outlined above.  Some weapons are harder to utilize than others, but most of them are hitscan variations, auto-locks, or manually detonable, making them easy to hit.  

Vertical Progression was implemented because the devs wanted to give players something to work towards.  Through this, a grind yielding accomplishment through unlockables and better mech stats was substituted for the real grind: playing to get better.  However, in deeper analysis, there isn’t much to improve upon with regards to “getting better.”  

In summation, Hawken’s movement mechanics need to be reworked to facilitate deeper and technical gameplay.  Raise the skill ceiling.

Edited by Xacius, December 30 2013 - 06:41 AM.

High MMR (2700+) livestream (scroll down on twitch page for in-depth bio and PC specs).   Check out my Steam Guide!

Exeon is fuzzy bunny bad.

Currently inactive.  Estimated return: TPG 2

#19 The_Silencer

The_Silencer

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 9,266 posts
  • LocationStyx.

Posted December 30 2013 - 05:36 AM

I've been playing and I do play daily.

Posted Image

.

"The difference between theory and practice is smaller in theory than it is in practice"


#20 HatesYourFace

HatesYourFace

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 1,941 posts
  • LocationNew York

Posted December 30 2013 - 05:39 AM

I think the poll should have been:

Do you guys want mechs that move like tanks or jets?

This has been the fundamental schism in our ranks since day one, some of us want Steel Battalion/Mech Warrior...some of us want Armored Core/Gundam. I do not think it is possible to please both, but it's what Hawken is trying to do.

EDIT: As far as competitive games needing multiple evasive options: I'd cite World of Tanks as an example of a succesful game with NO dodging or evasive options at all really, even driving full speed in the lightest tank likely won't save you from enemy fire.

Edited by HatesYourFace, December 30 2013 - 05:41 AM.

Posted Image

I also play on "PoundSignYoloSwag" (Assault/G2 Assault) and "FriendshipIsMagic" (Rocketeer) But haven't been able to add them to my Sig yet due to computer problems.




1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users