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A perspective on predator.


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#1 ArgosRho

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Posted March 07 2014 - 07:38 PM

Warning:

This is a perspective on the mech- "Predator" from a new player, with a weeks play time and study of the mechanics within HAWKEN, POST STEAM.

-------------------------------------------------------

PREDATOR: /TIPS/
-----EDIT I'm dang near max level with this thing, I dont use anything but the breacher and EOC Secondary, I dont know much about the other guns, so I dont write about them.---
---EDIT TWO- If you want to know about items, I use the armor regeneration (advanced) and shock coils. Nothing much else is needed for a stealthy approach.---
This medium B class mech provides three key skills to contribute to the battlefield. ​
  • Picking- The predator, even when played aggressively, feels purpose built to remove and cull the battlefield of those that are weakened and attempting a retreat.
  • This technique is applied in many ways, on especially weak targets the breacher at full charge will remove targets limping from the battlefield.
  • For those with forethought and and eye for ambush, the mine launcher can pepper the floor with enough to spike away large portions of health, with 4-5 mines you can quickly remove a weaker target as they attempt to move from the fight.
  • The key to a successful attack on those that retreat is to play to the predators cloak, imagine Jurassic Park's raptor and remember to attack from the flanks, using mines as a preliminary softener before getting into their face with a breach shot to end it quickly.
  • Observe the class of the target, C classes are harder to knock out unless they reside in their tank mode, which gives the predator a keen advantage when attacking from behind, a simple thing to do when you cloak and move outside of their field of view. B classes are sturdy, but a well planned strike will remove their power in the instance that you get into a fight with them, its not a terrible idea to hold right click and plant near their feet or intended direction of movement. Alternate to the breacher when the time allows to spike for large amounts of up front damage. A class mechs are dangerous if they get the chance to outmaneuver a predator, learn to take advantage of their low HP with a couple of mines and a from-behind breacher. Most A classes attempt to dodge frenetically as their health drops, use their panic and sweep for the kill when they are separated from the pack. Remember you're a wolf, a raptor, divide and conquer your foes before they can even get a shot off.
  • Take the lesser walked path, in most instances players tend to flock through common channels, there are observation points littered in every map that are perfect for the jump on a target. Even better is to lead a target to their own death, feigning fear or panic to pull a target around a corner pre-set with mines that will suddenly put them at the disadvantage.
   2.   Spiking- Know your limits, DoT is NOT your friend. The predator is dangerous in bursts, using sudden retreats to pull people to either a goose chase or their certain death.
  • In the instance you find large portions of the enemy team focused on your allies(I cant stress this enough, if they see you, its time to NOPE out of there), the best hope you have at helping is to EOC the floor around or behind the enemy. On a siege map, I've noticed that placing mines at key AA pathways and in crowds while out of observable view can really aid the team, remove their line of retreat or kill them, you've still helped your team. This also allows you to observe for weakened prey to attack and take out of the fight.
  • The breacher shotgun is hands the best friend for CQC. Ambushes can turn in your favor quickly with a close range burst from the breacher.
  • For the moment you find yourself head to head, remember, spamming fire of the EOC is NOT bad as long as you know where to fire. Predict their movement, remove their line of escape, or leave a path of mines to force their movement. There have been multiple instances where I simply hold right click and smash left when I'm in a full on head to head fight, leaving the enemy spiked with mines and breacher damage to finish them off.
   3.  Paranoia in the ranks- Over time, enemies will actively seek a predator out, use this.
  • Fear is your friend, in many cases as a predator, you can use the fear of a surprise minefield to deter chasing. This allows you to pick targets and move about quickly without fear of retribution from chasers.
  • People hold grudges, use their hatred of a predator to make them chase you from the fight, or to actively LOOK for you and lose focus of the objective. One less enemy for your allies is one less they have to worry about. In many cases the enemy looking for you is also the most likely to fall for a counter ambush, knowing they are looking for a predator means you can use the enemy players instinct to follow your known pathways and ambush from another.
  • Taking out the technician can break a fight, on objective based maps, the enemy may very well outlast your team if they have one, pick it down and remove their edge. One less mech and also one less healer, double whammy.
PREDATOR: IMPRESSIONS

I've played Predator almost exclusively since getting HAWKEN, yes I bought it, yes with money (the cardinal sin of the internet). I know I'm not known around here, nor am I a long time player, but mechanically I know this mech very well in my short time with it.  Its strengths lay with its ability to show up where the enemy would not expect a mech, especially one that doesn't show up on radar, and one that can set traps. Lateral thinking is key for the predator, as it revolves around removing enemies from the pack and surprising them from behind or the flank.

Do I think it could use a minor buff? Yes... the damage of the breacher feels heavily lacking at any range other than point blank...HOWEVER... I've played Team Fortress Two, a class known as the scout excelled in close range, but was quite squishy; its shotgun was the only major damage it had but the scout WORKED. If the developers see that the breacher is fine as is, I'm not going to complain.

Do I think the camo could be improved? Yes... I don't need perfect invisibility, but the current cloak could use a slight transparency tweak. I find that I can avoid most fights, but that's simply to using distraction as my friend. I've held perfectly still and watched multiple enemies walk right past me, much to my fear that they'd see me. In that same light however, the cloak is glaringly obvious in direct observation, the haze it has is very obvious.  

Is it as effective at killing as the more offensively based classes? No, but why should it be? A predator does not slaughter the masses, they remove the key pieces and watch the tower fall. Without that healer, the group falters and becomes broken by your allies rush. Without the defensive C class holding the front, your allies have the chance to push the line further back. Without an offense, the enemy is forced to hold their line or fall back, losing ground or objectives.

The predator is dangerous, just dangerous enough to win games. I like it, can I nitpick it? Yep, but that doesn't mean I'm dissatisfied.


TL;DR
fuzzy bunny that, read the post. Tips'n'fuzzy bunny.

Edited by ArgosRho, March 07 2014 - 07:41 PM.


#2 mrvile

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Posted March 07 2014 - 10:12 PM

Does the breacher's immediate-shotgun-after-railgun thing still exist? An instant point blank double shot is devastating, I sort of figured it wasn't working as intended and would get fixed but I haven't read anything about it recently.

#3 ArgosRho

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Posted March 07 2014 - 10:49 PM

View Postmrvile, on March 07 2014 - 10:12 PM, said:

Does the breacher's immediate-shotgun-after-railgun thing still exist? An instant point blank double shot is devastating, I sort of figured it wasn't working as intended and would get fixed but I haven't read anything about it recently.

I've yet to test this, I'll respond asap with results when I get back from a match. To my knowledge I've not experienced that, but that would honestly be devastating. I feel like there was a cooldown bar on the left of my crosshairs that functioned the same for each, its the little dotted reload bar it has to show when its able to be fired again, just inside of the heat bars

#4 ArgosRho

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Posted March 08 2014 - 01:48 AM

View PostArgosRho, on March 07 2014 - 10:49 PM, said:

View Postmrvile, on March 07 2014 - 10:12 PM, said:

Does the breacher's immediate-shotgun-after-railgun thing still exist? An instant point blank double shot is devastating, I sort of figured it wasn't working as intended and would get fixed but I haven't read anything about it recently.

I've yet to test this, I'll respond asap with results when I get back from a match. To my knowledge I've not experienced that, but that would honestly be devastating. I feel like there was a cooldown bar on the left of my crosshairs that functioned the same for each, its the little dotted reload bar it has to show when its able to be fired again, just inside of the heat bars


Report:
FULLY CHARGING THE BREACHER AND FIRING IT POINT BLANK, FOLLOWED BY A QUICK TAP CLICK SPAM WILL ALLOW FOR WHAT AMOUNTS TO A DOUBLE SHOT.
---
Pretty friggen dangerous

#5 Lightangel112

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Posted March 08 2014 - 02:06 AM

Basically the breacher fires a round every 2 seconds.
When you release a charged shot and do the flak shot.
The delay is reduced to about 1 second, so u save 1 second.
Therefore your dps using that combo is 244 rather than the 172.
I might be wrong though... that is why you should always charge it up.

Edited by Lightangel112, March 08 2014 - 02:08 AM.

View PostMeraple, on June 01 2014 - 11:54 AM, said:

If you want to be a Professional Yolodriver just go with DETs and the rest EMPs.

#6 ArgosRho

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Posted March 08 2014 - 02:46 AM

View PostLightangel112, on March 08 2014 - 02:06 AM, said:

Basically the breacher fires a round every 2 seconds.
When you release a charged shot and do the flak shot.
The delay is reduced to about 1 second, so u save 1 second.
Therefore your dps using that combo is 244 rather than the 172.
I might be wrong though... that is why you should always charge it up.

I did some tests on an A class group I could stalk easily in game. The double burst deeply affects how well the breacher operates, for the BETTER. The double burst requires a keen shot, but it can be done.

#7 Hijinks_The_Turtle

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Posted March 08 2014 - 09:59 AM

I've clocked a lot of hours on the Pred, and it was my first max ranked mech.  And guess what?  I STILL have trouble with the double burst combo for breacher. XD

View PostArgosRho, on March 07 2014 - 07:38 PM, said:

Warning:

This is a perspective on the mech- "Predator" from a new player, with a weeks play time and study of the mechanics within HAWKEN, POST STEAM.

-------------------------------------------------------

PREDATOR: /TIPS/
-----EDIT I'm dang near max level with this thing, I dont use anything but the breacher and EOC Secondary, I dont know much about the other guns, so I dont write about them.---
---EDIT TWO- If you want to know about items, I use the armor regeneration (advanced) and shock coils. Nothing much else is needed for a stealthy approach.---
This medium B class mech provides three key skills to contribute to the battlefield. ​
  • Picking- The predator, even when played aggressively, feels purpose built to remove and cull the battlefield of those that are weakened and attempting a retreat.
  • This technique is applied in many ways, on especially weak targets the breacher at full charge will remove targets limping from the battlefield.
  • For those with forethought and and eye for ambush, the mine launcher can pepper the floor with enough to spike away large portions of health, with 4-5 mines you can quickly remove a weaker target as they attempt to move from the fight.
  • The key to a successful attack on those that retreat is to play to the predators cloak, imagine Jurassic Park's raptor and remember to attack from the flanks, using mines as a preliminary softener before getting into their face with a breach shot to end it quickly.
  • Observe the class of the target, C classes are harder to knock out unless they reside in their tank mode, which gives the predator a keen advantage when attacking from behind, a simple thing to do when you cloak and move outside of their field of view. B classes are sturdy, but a well planned strike will remove their power in the instance that you get into a fight with them, its not a terrible idea to hold right click and plant near their feet or intended direction of movement. Alternate to the breacher when the time allows to spike for large amounts of up front damage. A class mechs are dangerous if they get the chance to outmaneuver a predator, learn to take advantage of their low HP with a couple of mines and a from-behind breacher. Most A classes attempt to dodge frenetically as their health drops, use their panic and sweep for the kill when they are separated from the pack. Remember you're a wolf, a raptor, divide and conquer your foes before they can even get a shot off.
  • Take the lesser walked path, in most instances players tend to flock through common channels, there are observation points littered in every map that are perfect for the jump on a target. Even better is to lead a target to their own death, feigning fear or panic to pull a target around a corner pre-set with mines that will suddenly put them at the disadvantage.
   2.   Spiking- Know your limits, DoT is NOT your friend. The predator is dangerous in bursts, using sudden retreats to pull people to either a goose chase or their certain death.
  • In the instance you find large portions of the enemy team focused on your allies(I cant stress this enough, if they see you, its time to NOPE out of there), the best hope you have at helping is to EOC the floor around or behind the enemy. On a siege map, I've noticed that placing mines at key AA pathways and in crowds while out of observable view can really aid the team, remove their line of retreat or kill them, you've still helped your team. This also allows you to observe for weakened prey to attack and take out of the fight.
  • The breacher shotgun is hands the best friend for CQC. Ambushes can turn in your favor quickly with a close range burst from the breacher.
  • For the moment you find yourself head to head, remember, spamming fire of the EOC is NOT bad as long as you know where to fire. Predict their movement, remove their line of escape, or leave a path of mines to force their movement. There have been multiple instances where I simply hold right click and smash left when I'm in a full on head to head fight, leaving the enemy spiked with mines and breacher damage to finish them off.
   3.  Paranoia in the ranks- Over time, enemies will actively seek a predator out, use this.
  • Fear is your friend, in many cases as a predator, you can use the fear of a surprise minefield to deter chasing. This allows you to pick targets and move about quickly without fear of retribution from chasers.
  • People hold grudges, use their hatred of a predator to make them chase you from the fight, or to actively LOOK for you and lose focus of the objective. One less enemy for your allies is one less they have to worry about. In many cases the enemy looking for you is also the most likely to fall for a counter ambush, knowing they are looking for a predator means you can use the enemy players instinct to follow your known pathways and ambush from another.
  • Taking out the technician can break a fight, on objective based maps, the enemy may very well outlast your team if they have one, pick it down and remove their edge. One less mech and also one less healer, double whammy.
PREDATOR: IMPRESSIONS

I've played Predator almost exclusively since getting HAWKEN, yes I bought it, yes with money (the cardinal sin of the internet). I know I'm not known around here, nor am I a long time player, but mechanically I know this mech very well in my short time with it.  Its strengths lay with its ability to show up where the enemy would not expect a mech, especially one that doesn't show up on radar, and one that can set traps. Lateral thinking is key for the predator, as it revolves around removing enemies from the pack and surprising them from behind or the flank.

Do I think it could use a minor buff? Yes... the damage of the breacher feels heavily lacking at any range other than point blank...HOWEVER... I've played Team Fortress Two, a class known as the scout excelled in close range, but was quite squishy; its shotgun was the only major damage it had but the scout WORKED. If the developers see that the breacher is fine as is, I'm not going to complain.

Do I think the camo could be improved? Yes... I don't need perfect invisibility, but the current cloak could use a slight transparency tweak. I find that I can avoid most fights, but that's simply to using distraction as my friend. I've held perfectly still and watched multiple enemies walk right past me, much to my fear that they'd see me. In that same light however, the cloak is glaringly obvious in direct observation, the haze it has is very obvious.  

Is it as effective at killing as the more offensively based classes? No, but why should it be? A predator does not slaughter the masses, they remove the key pieces and watch the tower fall. Without that healer, the group falters and becomes broken by your allies rush. Without the defensive C class holding the front, your allies have the chance to push the line further back. Without an offense, the enemy is forced to hold their line or fall back, losing ground or objectives.

The predator is dangerous, just dangerous enough to win games. I like it, can I nitpick it? Yep, but that doesn't mean I'm dissatisfied.


TL;DR
fuzzy bunny that, read the post. Tips'n'fuzzy bunny.


Like the other two, this is a nice guide.  I'm glad at how many guides there are for Predator, however, it would be nice if all three of these guides were put together.

Edited by Hijinks_The_Turtle, March 08 2014 - 10:00 AM.


#8 ArgosRho

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Posted March 08 2014 - 03:03 PM

Well, I honestly found that guides like this are only so helpful. I hope to make a video soon, showing places I hide on maps, area of ambush, and what I do as a player. Remember however, I'm new, I dont dodge well, I'm slow paced and patient for a reason.

EDIT----
On that note, what good screen capture software could be used to ensure quality production?

Edited by ArgosRho, March 08 2014 - 03:05 PM.


#9 bikt0r

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Posted March 08 2014 - 04:10 PM

View PostArgosRho, on March 08 2014 - 03:03 PM, said:

EDIT----
On that note, what good screen capture software could be used to ensure quality production?

What kind of graphics card do you have? If you have an nvidia you might be able to use Shadowplay which has options for the card to manually record play, saves the last (i think its max of 20) minutes of gameplay on the fly as well as linking to a Twitch account forstreaming without the need for another program running in the background.

For me i can get it to record at 1080p withno real hassles. It also encodes in H.264 as its running.

#10 DFTR

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Posted March 08 2014 - 04:28 PM

The Predator is a tricky mech to use well but fortunately there are many decent Predator players (Lightangel, Meraple) who are willing to help out.

Argos, most people use OBS.  I like Bandicam (not free, but very little effect on my FPS or system resource).  I look forward to seeing your video.  BTW, Hatesyourface has some Predator videos on trapmaking/ambushes if you want to check it out.  He talks a little about locations and trap placement if you want to expand on the topic.  He used Bandicam BTW.  


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#11 ArgosRho

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Posted March 08 2014 - 05:30 PM

Money isnt a problem, I'm military with a little bit of extra cash hanging around.
The provided video uses a pretty good set of trap placement, but I feel I can provide a few more.

I'll try to cut it down to just the placement, and it working, I dont like to meander.

#12 DoctorDrew

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Posted March 08 2014 - 08:48 PM

i like the predator myself i guess, aside from the terribly obvious invisibility it's kinda fun; although i'm definitely not going to be going 20-0 like i do with the recruit

a melee weapon or something for the predator would probably make it really fun to play, considering i really hate the mine layer (when i bought the predator, i had something like the AvP predator in mind, not a 'trapper')

also this is probably old but:
http://games.on.net/...-melee-weapons/
i can only hope

Edited by DoctorDrew, March 08 2014 - 08:49 PM.


#13 ArgosRho

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Posted March 08 2014 - 08:58 PM

View PostDoctorDrew, on March 08 2014 - 08:48 PM, said:

i like the predator myself i guess, aside from the terribly obvious invisibility it's kinda fun; although i'm definitely not going to be going 20-0 like i do with the recruit

a melee weapon or something for the predator would probably make it really fun to play, considering i really hate the mine layer (when i bought the predator, i had something like the AvP predator in mind, not a 'trapper')

also this is probably old but:
http://games.on.net/...-melee-weapons/
i can only hope


Melee would be terrible in my opinion, but to each his own.
Mines are actually quite useful, but require again, that you burst them. Don't rely in DoT, as a predator you are an assassin through and through.
And 20-0, I've run moments like that with pred. This past day I've done badly, but I honestly think that's due to the fact I have alot of people over and they are burning my internet connection like its the Salem witch trials

#14 DoctorDrew

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Posted March 08 2014 - 10:44 PM

i dunno, when i play as a predator i don't really feel like i'm 'predating' anything, especially when there are higher level players and can see your invisibility from a mile away (or there are people using fuzzy bunny hellfire missiles) and getting in the back lines where people repair usually means that if i can't secure the kill, their teammates will be there to end me

by the way, what do you mean by bursting the mines?

#15 Meraple

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Posted March 09 2014 - 01:14 AM

I don't really lay traps..
I prefer shooting down full-HP A classes in 2 seconds with an alpha strike.

You can burst the mines with the middle mouse button.
It's basicly a way to manually detonate them.

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#16 LoC_TR

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Posted March 09 2014 - 01:21 AM

Talk to LordTemujin if you get the chance, he's quite adapt at using a predator and knows its ins and outs!

Edited by LoC_TR, March 09 2014 - 01:21 AM.

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#17 ArgosRho

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Posted March 09 2014 - 02:43 AM

Some screen-shots of some recent matches today, I've been testing the EOC-R, and I have to say it can be dangerous if used as an ambush tool.
The breacher has been dependable and very reliable in the moments that the EOC-R was not viable for combat.
I'll attempt videos as soon as I can, I'm quite busy some days.

EDIT--
Yes I swear a lot. Sorry.

Attached Files


Edited by ArgosRho, March 09 2014 - 02:47 AM.


#18 Hijinks_The_Turtle

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Posted March 09 2014 - 09:36 AM

Nice job, I'll tell you that's it's much harder to pull those off at higher tiers.  Keep on practicing! :D

#19 DoctorDrew

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Posted March 09 2014 - 10:10 AM

View PostHijinks_The_Turtle, on March 09 2014 - 09:36 AM, said:

Nice job, I'll tell you that's it's much harder to pull those off at higher tiers.  Keep on practicing! :D

yeah, most of those people seem kinda low-mid level, playing against level 21-30's where you almost always have to be hidden behind something in order to avoid them seeing you regardless of stealth is a really boring and bad experience in general, especially if they're using a-classes and you don't instagib them before they stop repairing (every round it's always A-classes as the top 3 players, this is getting really ridiculous)

i'd honestly like to see a level 30 predator player go up against those other level 30's to see if it's actually viable or not, because at this point when i play infiltrator i do the predators 'job' ten times better and i'm still strong at 1v1ing someone, with fuzzy bunny tons of mobility to escape

#20 DFTR

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Posted March 09 2014 - 11:28 AM

@Doctor Drew, levels mean much less now.  I've been a level 30 for some time; however Hawken is my first FPS to play consistently so I may very well lose to a level 1 who's coming from Call of Duty.  It's not like D&D where a level 1 can't even scratch a higher level's armor class.  
AngryHampster for example is like level 25 but he would easily take down most level 30s (regardless of mech they use).  

Anyway Argos, I look forward to your videos.

BTW, here's Angry's thread w/ videos (prior to Steam patch of course)

https://community.pl...os-eoc-youtube/

Note his tips are semi-serious about t-bagging etc.

Edited by DFTR, March 09 2014 - 11:32 AM.

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