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A swing and one hell of a hit. For better or worse?


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#1 Trakel

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Posted November 20 2012 - 05:23 PM

So my first impressions so far as follows.

The adjustments to the maps, are fantastic. I like having more options as far as where I want to go and how I'm going to get there. I'm the type of person that loves to work around other people to go flank or get in from behind. More options to do so now, that's great.

But the problem I'm seeing here is that things are being changed a little too drastically.

The new bruiser mech looked like my perfect setup. Tanky, and capable of putting out some DPS. Except that the Vulcan now overheats your mech in less than 10 seconds, it feels like. Perfectly fits the "bruiser" name though. Prepare for only assists, if you're going to play it. You simply can't kill anything without overheating.

But that could be a problem solved with upgrades and optimizations right? Not exactly.

While it's nice seeing some degree of drawback for an upgrade, I feel like "What's the point?" I don't feel the need to purchase any upgrades because the upgrade itself just isn't enough to justify spending the points, and then having a drawback - as well as barely doing anything as far as "upgrade" goes. The optimizations are even worse, barely doing anything.

If I picked up ALL of the heat reduction optimization and upgrades, I'd only have 7.56% heat reduction. With a whopping 1.56% of that coming from optimizations. All of the extra time I gain firing by that percentage is nullified by the 1% damage reduction on the upgrade.

Another thing on Optimizations, the only tree that looks even remotely worthy of skilling into is defense. Why? Because of the revamped optimizations that one point that adds 3.5% armor is awesome, the only other one that increases your armor being in the movement tree, for an astounding 0.9% boost - for three points.

Having leveled the Assault, Sharpshooter, and Infiltrator classes in both CBEs 1 and 2.. I feel like the changes made were way too drastic. The sharpshooter for instance, is useless in my opinion. The slug rifle is so inaccurate now, I have to be right next to my enemy to hit him with it not zoomed in. While it was buffed in some ways, it still doesn't justify playing it. In order to hit anything at a distance, you have to be zoomed in limiting your field of view, while also making it retarded hard keeping up with the fast paced nature of the game in such a shaky, too hard to understand view.

The assault for the most part feels unchanged.

I can't comment on the infiltrator as of right now, maybe later. But this is just my overall .02 so far.

More things of note - Why is the server browser gone? Why are all of my mechs gone? Why did my stats get reset? This is still a CBE right? Why bother reseting anything. I can understand wanting to do the mechs because of the amount of changes, but still.

The most noteworthy of these changes being the server browser. Why remove that at all? That's like taking a plus from the game in my opinion, one that doesn't need to be removed. It's like deciding to make your game a little worse because of no reason, although I'm sure you do have one... whatever it is.

Edited by Trakel, November 20 2012 - 05:34 PM.


#2 Saunders

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Posted November 20 2012 - 05:35 PM

Hi Trakel, thanks for the great post!

Expect to see some balance updates shortly - that's what these closed beta tests are for!  We added a lot of new stuff, and will be tweaking accordingly.  Expect the Sharpshooter, for instance, to play more like it used to sometime between now and open beta.
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#3 Trakel

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Posted November 20 2012 - 05:43 PM

View PostSaunders, on November 20 2012 - 05:35 PM, said:

Hi Trakel, thanks for the great post!

Expect to see some balance updates shortly - that's what these closed beta tests are for!  We added a lot of new stuff, and will be tweaking accordingly.  Expect the Sharpshooter, for instance, to play more like it used to sometime between now and open beta.

That's great news to hear. One of the things I've always felt like was a problem for balance was that those balancing said issue usually swing a little too hard with the changes. I think a good example of that would be what happened with the Sharpshooter, and perhaps the Point-D Vulcan.

Thank you for the reply!

#4 F15H3R

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Posted November 20 2012 - 05:45 PM

View PostTrakel, on November 20 2012 - 05:23 PM, said:

The most noteworthy of these changes being the server browser. Why remove that at all? That's like taking a plus from the game in my opinion, one that doesn't need to be removed.

If I remember correctly from reading the patch notes, they did this to better facilitate the updated Match-making system they've implemented.  I doubt it'll be removed from the open beta.
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#5 Trakel

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Posted November 20 2012 - 05:47 PM

View PostF15H3R, on November 20 2012 - 05:45 PM, said:

View PostTrakel, on November 20 2012 - 05:23 PM, said:

The most noteworthy of these changes being the server browser. Why remove that at all? That's like taking a plus from the game in my opinion, one that doesn't need to be removed.

If I remember correctly from reading the patch notes, they did this to better facilitate the updated Match-making system they've implemented.  I doubt it'll be removed from the open beta.

Aye, when I made this post and the additions to it in edit form I hadn't noticed the patch notes thread.

#6 [HWK]Deuy

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Posted November 20 2012 - 05:49 PM

Also the server browser was specifically removed from this beta to force the use of matchmaking.  This isn't just to annoy people, it's so we can test and gather data about the matchmaking system so we can improve it.  The server browser will be back sometime in the future, eventually with dedicated server support.

#7 TerranCmdr

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Posted November 20 2012 - 09:12 PM

Please change back the Sharpshooter!  I feel completely useless in it now.  

I used the special damage ability and scored a direct hit on an enemy with my sabot, and it only took down about 1/3 of their health (B-class mech).  The scope is too shaky when running around to the point of not being able to shoot anything, and the SA Hawkins' ROF is now pathetic.

Edited by TerranCmdr, November 20 2012 - 09:13 PM.

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#8 Nitris

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Posted November 20 2012 - 09:37 PM

View PostDeuy, on November 20 2012 - 05:49 PM, said:

Also the server browser was specifically removed from this beta to force the use of matchmaking.  This isn't just to annoy people, it's so we can test and gather data about the matchmaking system so we can improve it.  The server browser will be back sometime in the future, eventually with dedicated server support.

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#9 ShadowSkulkerer

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Posted November 21 2012 - 12:12 AM

View PostDeuy, on November 20 2012 - 05:49 PM, said:

Also the server browser was specifically removed from this beta to force the use of matchmaking.  This isn't just to annoy people, it's so we can test and gather data about the matchmaking system so we can improve it.  The server browser will be back sometime in the future, eventually with dedicated server support.

O_O   I just played a game with you...  

Anyway good news on the snipers and focus on matchmaker improvement.   Can't agree more about the uselessness of Upgrades now,   They weren't overpowered before and now they are almost null.   Please switch them back.

#10 ShadowSkulkerer

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Posted November 21 2012 - 12:15 AM

View PostDeuy, on November 20 2012 - 05:49 PM, said:

Also the server browser was specifically removed from this beta to force the use of matchmaking.  This isn't just to annoy people, it's so we can test and gather data about the matchmaking system so we can improve it.  The server browser will be back sometime in the future, eventually with dedicated server support.

O_O   I just played a game with you...  

Anyway good news on the snipers and focus on matchmaker improvement.   Can't agree more about the uselessness of Upgrades now,   They weren't overpowered before and now they are almost null.   Please switch them back.

EDIT:   Sorry for the double post.   I refreshed the page to see if it had went through...   Excuse me "gone through."

Edited by ShadowSkulkerer, November 21 2012 - 12:16 AM.


#11 Chouzin

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Posted November 21 2012 - 12:17 AM

View PostSaunders, on November 20 2012 - 05:35 PM, said:

Hi Trakel, thanks for the great post!

Expect to see some balance updates shortly - that's what these closed beta tests are for!  We added a lot of new stuff, and will be tweaking accordingly.  Expect the Sharpshooter, for instance, to play more like it used to sometime between now and open beta.

Please buff the vulcan please! :D

#12 Etan

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Posted November 21 2012 - 04:42 AM

So if server list is not there thats fine i understand the testing of matchmaking but can we get a party system?
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#13 Dread_Lord_Pitr

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Posted November 21 2012 - 05:38 AM

View PostTerranCmdr, on November 20 2012 - 09:12 PM, said:

Please change back the Sharpshooter!  I feel completely useless in it now.  

I used the special damage ability and scored a direct hit on an enemy with my sabot, and it only took down about 1/3 of their health (B-class mech).  The scope is too shaky when running around to the point of not being able to shoot anything, and the SA Hawkins' ROF is now pathetic.

The whole Sharpshooter was just ruined, half the time you couldn't hit the broad side of a fuzzy bunny barn even when scoped in and STANDING STILL.
And that's with the slug rifle, i'm not even going into how unbelievably useless the Sabot now is, thanks to all the fanboys and Alpha players getting on my last working nerve today with their Elitist attitudes, i feel i can't do this without swearing so much that my post would be considered a breeding ground for the Fuzzy Bunnies.
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#14 Akrium

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Posted November 21 2012 - 05:54 AM

View PostEtan, on November 21 2012 - 04:42 AM, said:

So if server list is not there thats fine i understand the testing of matchmaking but can we get a party system?

Before the party system is in place one needs to get a valid match making system in place. Once they got their math figured out on that, it should be much easier to implement a party joining. As I am assuming you will also want everyone on the same team as well.

#15 Etan

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Posted November 21 2012 - 06:11 AM

I am fine with the team getting split up as long as i can get my entire group into the game.
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#16 Lithium03

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Posted November 21 2012 - 06:45 AM

View PostDread_Lord_Pitr, on November 21 2012 - 05:38 AM, said:

And that's with the slug rifle, i'm not even going into how unbelievably useless the Sabot now is, thanks to all the fanboys and Alpha players getting on my last working nerve today with their Elitist attitudes, i feel i can't do this without swearing so much that my post would be considered a breeding ground for the Fuzzy Bunnies.

Please elaborate.

#17 DarkPulse

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Posted November 21 2012 - 08:22 AM

View PostDeuy, on November 20 2012 - 05:49 PM, said:

Also the server browser was specifically removed from this beta to force the use of matchmaking.  This isn't just to annoy people, it's so we can test and gather data about the matchmaking system so we can improve it.  The server browser will be back sometime in the future, eventually with dedicated server support.
Dedicated servers?

Does that mean we'll be able to have player-hosted Hawken servers? :)
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#18 NotAnExit

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Posted November 21 2012 - 10:05 AM

My biggest issue with matchmaking is this:  If I get in a game already mid-way through that looks completely pointless and one-sided, and I drop out, I really don't want to be put right back into that same match.

#19 CaliberMengsk

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Posted November 21 2012 - 10:49 AM

View PostDarkPulse, on November 21 2012 - 08:22 AM, said:

View PostDeuy, on November 20 2012 - 05:49 PM, said:

Also the server browser was specifically removed from this beta to force the use of matchmaking.  This isn't just to annoy people, it's so we can test and gather data about the matchmaking system so we can improve it.  The server browser will be back sometime in the future, eventually with dedicated server support.
Dedicated servers?

Does that mean we'll be able to have player-hosted Hawken servers? :)
Actually, through command line you can already start a server on a local system (open command prompt, browse to exe, then enter the exe with "game.exe server mapname" so for a dm on titan would be something like "Hawken-Shipping-32-blah-blah.exe server dm-titan" and it will launch the server.) That said, the master server currently denies access, so it doesn't show in the server browser, and since they removed console commands like open, there is no way to connect to it.

Edited by CaliberMengsk, November 21 2012 - 10:50 AM.

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#20 GrayTech

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Posted November 22 2012 - 03:35 AM

Matchmaking:

The majority of the missile games I played were remarkably unbalanced.
Oddly, when a new player would join, the system would consistently add them to the currenty winning side.
In addition there did not appear to be any level weighting going on. If the system is calculating based on
mech level for team balance it wasn't apparent.

There were several matches with level 0 mechs on one team pitted against level 10 plus on the other.
Now it could be that players switched sides, but if the matchmaking system set this up it was a bloodbath.

Not complaining, just feedback on what wasn't fun. (fun being the point of this)
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