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How to save Hawken and improve playerbase size

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#1
dmirtygorachyov

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Lag compensation.

 

Atm the game is very heavily biased towards whoever lives near the server. Anyone who plays offpeak times or in the dead regions know that they will have to que on NA in order to find a game, but the downside is that you have to play with high ping which is an instant loss against anyone who has some basic understanding of the game.

 

This should have been implemented a long long time ago in any modern shooter, but now is better than never.

 

Pros

 

-More even playing field, less ping advantage

-Players with high ping can actually play the game instead of uninstalling the game after a few rounds

-More responsive gameplay

-Larger playerbase 

-Caps at 400ms to reduce anomalies

-Cheaper long term, not as many local servers needed

-Prestep for projectiles

 

Cons

 

-QQ I got shot through wall 

 

Small price to pay for a large improvement over the current game. I played this game when it was first released and it was the first thing I noticed. After about 10 games I decided that I'll just wait for local servers, but even now with local servers the playerbase just isn't there, so they are just a waste of money. Its probably cheaper to just remove the AU and SEA regions (which are completely dead) and just add lag compensation and let everyone play on NA/EU and maybe a Asian server somewhere abit central.

 

I QQ cos I care, and its sad to see this game suffer from things like this. Pls tq



#2
6ixxer

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I installed Lag compensator.

Its called Rocketeer.
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#3
coldform

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bottoms up!
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I like going against the best of any game I play. Helps you in the long run n motivates u to do more. Always room for improvement not failure

z6aJAX7.png?1

 

czerofive-Today at 2:22 AM > got banned from playing lazertag - I used a knife to conserve ammo

FIRST OFF WHAT THE FUZZ IS A "SHILL"


#4
Lioot

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Removing the AUS and SEA servers won't be improving playerbase size anytime soon, and even with lag compensation, I wouldn't play on a centralised Asia server. No amount of lag compensation is going to fix 180+ ping


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#5
StubbornPuppet

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Lag Compensation?  Seriously?

 

These so-called "Compensations" are really just a cheezy algorithm that gives the benefit of the doubt in any encounter to the person with the higher ping.  It's done so that laggy players get the benefit of "what I saw on my screen is what happened!"  The game is forced to even further screw everyone with a lower ping than the person with the highest ping by stripping them of whatever THEY rightfully saw happen on their screen.

 

I say "further" because players with a low ping ALREADY get certain advantages - ones which are naturally balancing the disadvantages.  When you are a high ping player, you have problems with your hits registering because the other players are likely no longer exactly where you see them.  HOWEVER, you, the high ping player, are teleporting around the screen and their visual hits on you aren't registering for them.

 

So, if you add 'lag compensation', high ping players are STILL teleporting around the screen, not registering hits... while enjoying the added benefit of getting hit registration that makes other players go, "WHAT THE LITERAL F***! - I was long dodged behind this wall and that rocket STILL hit me?  B.S.!!!"

 

Sorry, it's just not fair.  And, yes, I think it has ruined the experience in games that implement it - even has shown that plenty of players will intentionally cap their connection speeds or reroute through roundabout connections to make sure they get a high ping.

 

No thanks.


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To be serious for a moment this is just a joke

 


#6
dmirtygorachyov

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Lag Compensation?  Seriously?

 

These so-called "Compensations" are really just a cheezy algorithm that gives the benefit of the doubt in any encounter to the person with the higher ping.  It's done so that laggy players get the benefit of "what I saw on my screen is what happened!"  The game is forced to even further screw everyone with a lower ping than the person with the highest ping by stripping them of whatever THEY rightfully saw happen on their screen.

 

I say "further" because players with a low ping ALREADY get certain advantages - ones which are naturally balancing the disadvantages.  When you are a high ping player, you have problems with your hits registering because the other players are likely no longer exactly where you see them.  HOWEVER, you, the high ping player, are teleporting around the screen and their visual hits on you aren't registering for them.

 

So, if you add 'lag compensation', high ping players are STILL teleporting around the screen, not registering hits... while enjoying the added benefit of getting hit registration that makes other players go, "WHAT THE LITERAL F***! - I was long dodged behind this wall and that rocket STILL hit me?  B.S.!!!"

 

Sorry, it's just not fair.  And, yes, I think it has ruined the experience in games that implement it - even has shown that plenty of players will intentionally cap their connection speeds or reroute through roundabout connections to make sure they get a high ping.

 

No thanks.

 

 

....

 

Yea I guess you are right, I bet games like CSGO would be just as popular as hawken if they removed lag compensation and called it a day /s. No wonder Trump is winning.



#7
DemitronPrime

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Removing the AUS and SEA servers won't be improving playerbase size anytime soon, and even with lag compensation, I wouldn't play on a centralised Asia server. No amount of lag compensation is going to fix 180+ ping

Truth!!

 

to be honest, Ontrav has already put forward HOW TO COMPENSATE FOR LAG... its called leading your aim...

the fact that you are talking from an american point of view and basically saying fuzzy bunny other regions... -100 points #hammertime

 

as To 6ixxer....

Cockateer only works SOOO much... i mean sure you can HIT things but we all know that the little target on the logo basically screams SHOOT ME FIRST

 

there was another thread where some one mentions a far better idea. where as a globalized ping, making region selection optional and making the QUE for battle match people with similar pings no matter their region sounds much more feasible in my opinion


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#8
StubbornPuppet

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....

 

Yea I guess you are right, I bet games like CSGO would be just as popular as hawken if they removed lag compensation and called it a day /s. No wonder Trump is winning.

 

Oh, good point!  You've sure got me there.  1+1=3  It's so obvious... why didn't I see it before?


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To be serious for a moment this is just a joke

 


#9
dmirtygorachyov

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Oh, good point!  You've sure got me there.  1+1=3  It's so obvious... why didn't I see it before?

 

Honest question do u think overwatch/csgo/bf4/cod /destiny would be as popular as they are without lag comp? Actually u dont even have to answer it, steamcharts and overwatch preorders already explained the situation, its wether the devs and the dozens of active players wish to accept it.



#10
6ixxer

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as To 6ixxer....
Cockateer only works SOOO much... i mean sure you can HIT things but we all know that the little target on the logo basically screams SHOOT ME FIRST

I believe the word you are after is ROCKETARD.
Its all about AC, deploy turrets and hellfire lockon spam.

400+ ping I can still play it, make kills and have fun.
I'm sure no reasonable person expects a stellar play experience on 400 ping.
Don't expect to take down 1900+ MMR players easily.

<insert realistic expectations here>
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#11
PsychedelicGrass

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You're not supposed to get kills in rocketeer you're supposed to annoy the enemy into submission with constant ringing sounds, turrets, and holograms.
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What's the big fuzzy bunnyng deal? Lots of amazing people have committed suicide, and they turned out alright.

 


#12
DemitronPrime

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You're not supposed to get kills in rocketeer you're supposed to annoy the enemy into submission with constant ringing sounds, turrets, and holograms.

I have nightmares about that damn sound...


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#13
Shade__

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I have nightmares about that damn sound...

we all do... we all do... we all do... ;m;


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#14
Texhnolyzing

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I have nightmares about that damn sound...

 

I am glad I muted my in-game sounds a month ago, but I'm still haunted in my dreams.



#15
Nept

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Lag Compensation?  Seriously?

 

These so-called "Compensations" are really just a cheezy algorithm that gives the benefit of the doubt in any encounter to the person with the higher ping.  It's done so that laggy players get the benefit of "what I saw on my screen is what happened!"  The game is forced to even further screw everyone with a lower ping than the person with the highest ping by stripping them of whatever THEY rightfully saw happen on their screen.

 

I say "further" because players with a low ping ALREADY get certain advantages - ones which are naturally balancing the disadvantages.  When you are a high ping player, you have problems with your hits registering because the other players are likely no longer exactly where you see them.  HOWEVER, you, the high ping player, are teleporting around the screen and their visual hits on you aren't registering for them.

 

So, if you add 'lag compensation', high ping players are STILL teleporting around the screen, not registering hits... while enjoying the added benefit of getting hit registration that makes other players go, "WHAT THE LITERAL F***! - I was long dodged behind this wall and that rocket STILL hit me?  B.S.!!!"

 

Sorry, it's just not fair.  And, yes, I think it has ruined the experience in games that implement it - even has shown that plenty of players will intentionally cap their connection speeds or reroute through roundabout connections to make sure they get a high ping.

 

No thanks.

 


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#16
PoopSlinger

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Battlefield 4 has lag compensation and it sucks.  Playing on Euro servers with kindos/anixko was like giving me super powers.  High ping players (115-160 seemed to be optimal.) could run around shooting people all willy nilly.


khn3gAi.jpg?1CitkI9t.jpgGkp2fB7.jpg

Come on Crafty, you have been officially called out on your lies. Your online reputation is at stake here, this is just like an old school street race running for pink slips. Its run what you brung and hope its enough. Put up or shut the fuzzy bunny up.


#17
dmirtygorachyov

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Battlefield 4 has lag compensation and it sucks.  Playing on Euro servers with kindos/anixko was like giving me super powers.  High ping players (115-160 seemed to be optimal.) could run around shooting people all willy nilly.

 

I think the 80k current active players might have a different opinion on what sucks or what doesn't, i can almost guarantee if hawken has lag comp its playerbase will increase form 250 active to atleast 1k in just a few months. A simple NETCODE UPDATE advertisement on steam is all that is needed to save the game, maybe even turn it into something worth while.



#18
StubbornPuppet

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And these guys are really doing a good job of trying to get netcode right... and listen to the players about where the problems in their "interpolation delay" are.  And they've been wise enough to write exception rule overrides... which are adjustable based on ping.  It sounds like they are doing a fantastic job addressing the biggest problems with lag compensation, but you can see that it still causes noteworthy problems.

 

The best thing they are doing is putting a cap on their 'favor the shooter' time.  This is something I've never heard of a game doing before and even these guys hadn't thought of it before a player suggested it.  Seems fair enough too - because, like I said before, it's not fair when a person with a crappy connection get to wreck it for everyone else.

 

I applaud their efforts.

 

My favorite takeaway from them is the term "Dominated by Latency".


Edited by StubbornPuppet, 26 May 2016 - 07:03 AM.

To be serious for a moment this is just a joke

 


#19
FRX23

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How to save Hawken and improve playerbase size

 

1. Don't smurf.

2. Be friendly with newbies.

3. Tick Ready in team based match only when the teams will be even.

4. Try to not leave middle game.


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#20
KarlSchlag

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1. Don't smurf.

2. Be friendly with newbies.

3. Tick Ready in team based match only when the teams will be even.

4. Try to not leave middle game.

Yes!

 

...and no

 

have been doing this for 2 years now. This community rocks.

 

Cya in Overwatch


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#21
DemitronPrime

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1. Don't smurf.

2. Be friendly with newbies.

3. Tick Ready in team based match only when the teams will be even.

4. Try to not leave middle game.

 

3 sometimes isnt an option....

 

but i do agree to this.

 

Yes!

 

...and no

 

have been doing this for 2 years now. This community rocks.

 

Cya in Overwatch

 STFU about overwatch already. sick of hearing about that stupid cartoon game ON THE HAWKEN FORUMS....

 

How to save Hawken ::

1 :: Stop being elitist pricks

2 :: Stop Pluging a that stupid cartoon half pie barely shooter game

3 :: Stop complaining

4 :: Stop Smurfing like little cry babies

5 :: HELP the noobs get better by NOT STOMPING them ( its not that hard to go easy on people, if you say it is your full of fuzzy bunny )

6 :: ENJOY THE GEAME


Edited by DemitronPrime, 28 May 2016 - 02:02 PM.

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#22
dmirtygorachyov

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The best thing they are doing is putting a cap on their 'favor the shooter' time.  This is something I've never heard of a game doing before and even these guys hadn't thought of it before a player suggested it.  Seems fair enough too - because, like I said before, it's not fair when a person with a crappy connection get to wreck it for everyone else.

 

 

 You have never heard of this? 
 

TF2 does it for most classes, Destiny does it, COD does it, BF4 does it, CSGO does it. How have you never heard of "favor the shooter"?

 

Planetside 2 does it, war thunder does it, warframe does it. Think of a popular shooter and it does it.

 

and first you said this....---

 

 

Lag Compensation?  Seriously?

 

These so-called "Compensations" are really just a cheezy algorithm that gives the benefit of the doubt in any encounter to the person with the higher ping.  

 

Then you said this....

 

And these guys are really doing a good job of trying to get netcode right... and listen to the players about where the problems in their "interpolation delay" are.  

 

 

Shows that you have no idea what your stance is and what lag comp even does to gameplay. Their implementation of lag compensation is extremely basic compared to most shooters and there is very little that is different.

 

If anyone has played overwatch they would realise their netcode is extremely similar to games like dirtybomb/destiny/any lag compensated game. I would even argue that UT4 has better netcode and that they should learn from them.

 

1. Don't smurf.

2. Be friendly with newbies.

3. Tick Ready in team based match only when the teams will be even.

4. Try to not leave middle game.

 

1. smurf who? therre are no new players in this game. its dead.

2. See 1.

3. rofl

4. they probably will leave when they see how unresponsive this game is compared to other shooters with no lag comp



#23
DallasCreeper

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3 sometimes isnt an option....

 

but i do agree to this.

 

 STFU about overwatch already. sick of hearing about that stupid cartoon game ON THE HAWKEN FORUMS....

 

How to save Hawken ::

1 :: Stop being elitist pricks

2 :: Stop Pluging a that stupid cartoon half pie barely shooter game

3 :: Stop complaining

4 :: Stop Smurfing like little cry babies

5 :: HELP the noobs get better by NOT STOMPING them ( its not that hard to go easy on people, if you say it is your full of fuzzy bunny )

6 :: ENJOY THE GEAME

1. Singling out the elitist pricks is like singling out the Massachusetts chapter of the KKK, It's way too small to make any meaningful difference.

2. Overwatch isn't a bad game, it just doesn't belong here. 

3. Never going to happen... ever

4. I don't like smurfs either, but I don't think Crafty is much of a crybaby. 

5. Not stomping noobs? But that's the best part!

6. Why play a game you don't enjoy?


Edited by (TDM) DallasCreeper, 28 May 2016 - 04:22 PM.

 

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#24
6ixxer

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1. Singling out the elitist pricks is like singling out the Massachusetts chapter of the KKK, It's way too small to make any meaningful difference.

Still, I'm sure the Massachusetts African American population disagree on the 'meaningful' part and would really appreciate it. (Edit: Perhaps Massachusetts isn't the best similie. I think elitists affect a greater proportion of the Hawken community than you are implying)

In other words: They may be small in number, but there is a big group of people who want them to quit their fuzzy bunny, so still well worth mentioning.

#StopBeingElitistPricks

 

Hitler was just one guy, but look what happened when people listened to him and followed his way...


Edited by 6ixxer, 28 May 2016 - 04:35 PM.

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#25
6ixxer

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#StopBeingElitistPricks
 
Hitler was just one guy, but look what happened when people listened to him and followed his way...

And just like that, I added 3 shots to this thread O_o
!Hammertime


Edited by 6ixxer, 28 May 2016 - 04:40 PM.

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#26
DemitronPrime

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-snip-

 

Nothing against crafty, but tbh if he was as good as HE says he is, he wouldn't need to smurf...  and he is honestly a rather bad example because most his smurfs have a similar MMR to his main, give or take,

I am refering to those scrubish pricks that make a brand new account purposly to ruin some new player's day. it happens alot...

 

as for the stomping noobs and being the best part, i honestly thought more of you...

 

I DO enjoy Hawken, I just dont enjoy the crap people are PULLING in Hawken because they think they have a right or can/are getting away with it...

 

 

-snip-
In other words: They may be small in number, but there is a big group of people who want them to quit their fuzzy bunny, so still well worth mentioning.
#StopBeingElitistPricks

Hitler was just one guy, but look what happened when people listened to him and followed his way...

^  indeed

 

people say " I want Hawken to Survive " and yet their actions and personalities are the very things that are killing it....

not Everyone...

But IF it the shoe fits, I probibly AM talking about you...


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#27
6ixxer

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Nothing against crafty, but tbh if he was as good as HE says he is, he wouldn't need to smurf...  and he is honestly a rather bad example because most his smurfs have a similar MMR to his main, give or take,
I am refering to those scrubish pricks that make a brand new account purposly to ruin some new player's day. it happens alot...

^this.
I have one alt account that only has the starter Assault mech simply for use in mentoring, etc
Its MMR pretty closely matches my main account.

I think we know the difference between a veteran pilot ( lol Crafty) making an alt and how they rank up vs the douchebags who pretend its their first day and they are just good because they play some other FPS. Maybe if they blue balls weren't hanging out all over, then we might believe them, and welcome them to Hawken.

#28
DemitronPrime

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One more point i'd like to point out...

 

Overwatch Costs money, it is sold by Blizzard which.. . is a MONEY based corp, has been for YEARS

THey released this product what? 3-4 weeks ago?

 

Here is a clip from the forums

 

Spoiler

 

They are ALREADY complaining about Match Maker...

 

O_o you expect people to PAY for issues they can have for free?

 

PLAYHAWKEN.COM

 

GG

 

for the <3 of Hammertime and Hawken


Edited by DemitronPrime, 28 May 2016 - 04:58 PM.

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#29
DallasCreeper

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Spoiler

 

They are ALREADY complaining about Match Maker...

 

O_o you expect people to PAY for issues they can have for free?

 

This is why we can't have nice things. But back on topic please. 


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#30
Arkhaun

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as To 6ixxer....

Cockateer only works SOOO much... i mean sure you can HIT things but we all know that the little target on the logo basically screams SHOOT ME FIRST

 

 

as if the the 70ft of blocky hellfire spew that you'd have to be a retardis to ignore isnt a valid enough reason


SORRY CAPS

 

 

170323-R9tPRfBFIQ79.jpg
 

 


#31
HHJFTRU

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Hawken should not be F2P, but should cost some $ per account. And microtransactions for cosmetics. I already paid more for Hawken than the price of Overwatch. It's annoying when some people find fun in creating alt accounts every other day and destroying balance in the games where they get in. For free.

And an anti-cheat system is needed. At this very moment when I browse the EU servers I see 2 known cheaters and 3 annoying low level smurfs. For first glance, there may be more.

 

And noob servers until lvl15 and 1500 MMR. And fast MMR-adjustments in the first few levels.


Edited by someone, 29 May 2016 - 09:33 AM.

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Ceterum censeo ... bootcamp-servers!  &:

     #rapidMMR4newaccounts      #removethedelay

     #morespeed4EOC                 #lessspread4T-32

     #buffG2R                               #nerfZerk'n'Assault

     #dosomethingwithHF             #noisesupression4breacher

THANKS FOR THIS AWESOME GAME!

 


#32
dmirtygorachyov

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i love hawken


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#33
Shade__

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Reading these posts scare me, i don't know why but it just fills me with dread....


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#34
dmirtygorachyov

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Oh cool now i can actually make posts in real time instead of waiting for 3 days for my post to get approved. What a great new player experience. Lag comp pls.



#35
Shade__

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Oh cool now i can actually make posts in real time instead of waiting for 3 days for my post to get approved. What a great new player experience.

You have got to be kidding me, you know why that rule is in place right?

 tumblr_m59rtsSoyf1rwgovuo1_500.gif


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#36
The_Silencer

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in case you do not know about this yet

 

https://community.pl...-promo-posters/

 

This iniciative might be of help..


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The difference between theory and practice is smaller in theory than it is in practice.


#37
007eleven

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I agree, but fist off we just need to make sure Hawken can get on its feet and out of open beta before anything else.


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-Thanks to eth0


#38
dmirtygorachyov

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You have got to be kidding me, you know why that rule is in place right?

 tumblr_m59rtsSoyf1rwgovuo1_500.gif

 

To suppress new player opinions on a game that is already suffering from no growth?



#39
Silverfire

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To suppress new player opinions on a game that is already suffering from no growth?

 

No, to prevent forum spam accounts and to prevent people from posting NSFW stuff if they're being ragey. We've had our share of unfortunate experiences with fresh accounts posting gore and blood and forum spam.  This system wouldn't be terrible (first few posts must be approved) if we had a more active community manager.


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#40
dmirtygorachyov

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No, to prevent forum spam accounts and to prevent people from posting NSFW stuff if they're being ragey. We've had our share of unfortunate experiences with fresh accounts posting gore and blood and forum spam.  This system wouldn't be terrible (first few posts must be approved) if we had a more active community manager.

I would rage too if theres no lag comp, so it seems like a bandaid fix to me that hurts them more.






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