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Reaper - KE-Sabot / ability

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#1
MomOw

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I didn't want to necro old thread so I start a new one. I know these stuff already have been discussed, but having spent a lot of time playing the reaper these days I do have a clearer point of view.

 

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So far my accuracy with KE-Sabot ranges from 50% to 58% depending on the server lag and the average MMR of the server

 

About KE-Sabot :

damages are low, why not, it goes together with a higher rof.

-> for scoped shot I don't think the higher rof does anything as basically you'd aim, scope, shoot, unscope, and good player wont stay visible long enough to shoot twice (beside bunker, but it's not relevant).

-> for unscope shots, the loss of accuracy is really hard for mid-range shots (50m, when zooming is really dumb)

-> Scoping time depending on FOV is weird and result in a sort of nerf to benefit from quick scoping.

My opinion :

-> Further reduction of KE-Sabot spread when unscope (i.e. same as Slug)

-> fixed scope zooming time, consistent with 75~80 FOV even with a FOV of 110

 

About Reaper ability :

I found out the real thing with of the ability (when not using RPR) : being able to land more KE-Sabot when not scoping.

My opinion :

-> I've read the idea to have the ability make the Sabot becomes penetrating shots, and I do agree that it would be a nice change.


Edited by (KDR) MomOw, 01 February 2016 - 11:32 AM.

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#2
CraftyDus

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reaper needs a huge nerf

sharpie needs triple damage on the powershot and half the cooldown


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#3
asipo

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even the damage is weak (but I dont its weak), they got high mobility to compensate

 

reaper can even 1v1 and corner poking which hard for SS

 

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Edited by asipo, 01 February 2016 - 06:10 AM.

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#4
eth0

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Any changes to KE-sabot (or slug) reload will alter the beautiful firing rhythm of slug reaper.

 

imho reaper is in a great spot. The ability alone is lackluster.


Pubstomping is a whole different strategic discussion, however, and usually just becomes an exploration of the ethics of dumpstering randos.

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#5
Amidatelion

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imho reaper is in a great spot. The ability alone is lackluster.

 

This. The RPR could use a little something as well, just because it is worse than the alternatives in every way. As some maniacs have proven the AM-SAR is perfectly viable, just irritating to play.

 

It's just that the ability right now is a glorified taunt. Therefore, I expect to see it bound to THC's holotaunt key in S4.



#6
MomOw

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OP modified for clarity (I hope so)

 

@Crafty : thanks for you enlightening insight, everything is clearer now.

 

@eth0 : I didn't mention in this thread to augment the rof of the KE-Sabot, just the zooming time : basically I don't want to adjust the FOV and mouse sensitivity just in order to have a more usable zoom.

 

@Amitadelion : you don't find that there is a range for which zooming is hardly usable and KE-Sabot spread too high ?

I have to check and give more precise values, but it seemed to me that between 50m and 100m unscoped KE was inaccurate and zooming hard to use.


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#7
CraftyDus

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Allowing for lower FOV is almost like cheating.
FOV should only be allowed to go as low as 120, no lower


Edited by CraftyDus, 01 February 2016 - 08:07 AM.

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#8
brackets

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On Reaper, scope accuracy applies just after you activate scope (even during scope-in time) - this means that the animation time doesn't actually affect quickscoping.

 

Slug has 0 spread unscoped - I think this might be too accurate for the unscoped ke-Sabot (although since the unscoped ke-Sabot is doing the same damage as the Slug Rifle, I wouldn't be totally opposed to that either). 



#9
Amidatelion

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OP modified for clarity (I hope so)

 

@Crafty : thanks for you enlightening insight, everything is clearer now.

 

@eth0 : I didn't mention in this thread to augment the rof of the KE-Sabot, just the zooming time : basically I don't want to adjust the FOV and mouse sensitivity just in order to have a more usable zoom.

 

@Amitadelion : you don't find that there is a range for which zooming is hardly usable and KE-Sabot spread too high ?

I have to check and give more precise values, but it seemed to me that between 50m and 100m unscoped KE was inaccurate and zooming hard to use.

 

The Reaper is a sniper mech and quickscoping is a skill you have to learn if you want to play it effectively. Scoped KE, like scoped Sabot, is 100% accurate. Just practice quickscoping and watch all your problems go away.



#10
CraftyDus

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there is no quickscoping in Hawken

you guys don't know what that means


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#11
Amidatelion

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And "there's no such thing as a MOBA."

 

Moving on.


Edited by Amidatelion, 01 February 2016 - 08:09 AM.


#12
MomOw

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@Amidatelion : the salty stats indicates spread values at column J and U, I don't know which one to consider.

 

So I guess I have to learn how to zoom, shoot while watching the Mech skin details, unzoom faster... well I don't like when games aren't fun to watch but I guess I'll have to get used to it.

 

You who seems to be more hardcore snipers than me, I'd like know your controls config because I set the thumb button for secondary weapon stuff, but it makes me moves and lose my aim (enough to miss if I don't ajust), resulting in being too slow to shoot efficiently.


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#13
Kopra

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KE-Sabot gets its max accuracy after 150ms of zooming (SS Sabot after 300ms). You get the bonus damage the very instant you start zooming, though, so with the ability you can do neat tricks around corners. It's still a situational ability, as 150ms is usually at range more than enough time to fire perfectly accurate hitscan onto your opponent.

 

I have a Reaper mouse setting (via Steelseries Engine), which makes M1 fire both primary and secondary, and M2 makes you zoom. Silent_ posted somewhere how you can make M2 to unzoom on release. You can possibly try other configurations with thumb buttons and whatnot, but ergonomy is the key.


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#14
eth0

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I say this as a "quickscoping" snipey reaper:

 

The Reaper is a sniper mech and quickscoping is a skill you have to learn if you want to play it effectively.

 

No.

 


Pubstomping is a whole different strategic discussion, however, and usually just becomes an exploration of the ethics of dumpstering randos.

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#15
The_Silencer

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IMO, the Reaper is fine as it is. Although its S.A (Special Ability) should work differently depending on what primary weapon you have equipped it with. New pilots are the ones who should need such a diversification tweak for the S.A; mostly due to the weapon range of the first or default primary weapon for this mech.

 

I created a thread on this very matter time ago but after a quick search can not find it.. I'll try later...


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#16
CounterlogicMan

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I think the reaper is fine were it is damage, rof, hp, etc. The only grip I have with it, as stated by many before, the ability is pretty lack luster. It is not useless, it just doesn't feel as impactful as abilities on other mechs. This is because the ke-sabot, am-sar, and slug rifle are already pretty accurate unscoped. It effects the rpr quite a bit, though if a mechs ability only effects one weapon meaningfully...that ability needs some revisions. The base kit is really good. Wish the am-sar smoke effect was toned down a little bit. It is really distracting.

 

I have no quarrels with the zooming mechanics.

 

 

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Edit: As for my configuration, I just have the weapon utility button set to one of the thumb buttons on my mouse. I run pretty low sensitivity in game at 9 and my mouse dpi is 1200. Sensitivity and dpi are totally preference though. You don't really NEED to do any crazy configurations to be good at sniping in Hawken, or any other game, for that matter. Do what makes you most comfortable. Maybe try a few configurations you see here out just to see how they feel, but don't let anyone tell you their configuration is the best way to do it. 


Edited by CounterlogicMan, 01 February 2016 - 11:58 PM.

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#17
CraftyDus

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In hawken I have scope set to left shift, my left-(wasd)-hand pinky finger scopes in and out.

pretty simple stuff.

 

I guess firing before the scope goes all the way in while playing hawken (I do this) is relatable to the true quickscoping in COD where you fire before the reticle closes in the scope.

 

 

In every other shooter that I snipe in, such as scout in cs I combine 2 weapon switches with every scope shot.

It's just a reflex thing that comes with time.

 

I scope-in with right mouse button (m2)

 

as I do that and fire simultaneously... I jam,  twice.... as fast as I can,  my mouse thumb to my secondary weapon (pistol)

 

so the instant the shot goes of, I am holding an unscoped pistol, which is transitioning back to the rifle.

 

looks like this (in the nohboard displayer the 2 and 5 number keys are on my mouse thumb)

 

 

this way I'm back out in the unscoped world asap to react to whatever comes up

 

I do this stuff manually. There's no macroing or scripting stuff to it for me.

I figure I don't need to fake it now that I've learned to do it consistently.


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