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Primary Weapons: On the Breacher

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#1
The_Silencer

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What are your actual thoughts on this primary weapon?

 

Ranges and Efficiency of it when charged and/or not? Does it need any extra love from the devs?


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The difference between theory and practice is smaller in theory than it is in practice.


#2
Hyginos

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The charging sound needs to not be audible from orbit, and the charged slug could stand to have a nicer fall-off curve.

 

Other than that it's a strong weapon with a relatively steep learning curve IMO.


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#3
The_Silencer

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I've been playing with it for a while 5 mins ago and I've found it to be not really satisfying at long range when charged

 

edit: Yes, there's something wrong while charged with the SFX


Edited by The_Silencer, 29 February 2016 - 09:13 AM.

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The difference between theory and practice is smaller in theory than it is in practice.


#4
kaiserschmarrn_

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Excluding PPA, it is the best primary in the game. It is incredibly versatile; while having best burst damage of any primary in the game, it is also effective as a sniping tool for putting some pressure on ranged targets.

 

Not to mention you can actively increase the dps by firing charged then uncharged shots in combination.


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#5
Hyginos

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...while having best burst damage of any primary in the game...

 

That might be true by a generous definition in which you include follow up shots, but the EOCR does 156 to the Breacher's 144 in one volley.

 

Of course, uncharged Breaher is essentially a turbo-MIRV, so coming in second here is really not much of a detriment.


Edited by Hyginos, 29 February 2016 - 09:38 AM.

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#6
DallasCreeper

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That might be true by a generous definition in which you include follow up shots, but the EOCR does 156 to the Breacher's 144 in one volley.

 

Of course, uncharged Breaher is essentially a turbo-MIRV, so coming in second here is really not much of a detriment.

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#7
kaiserschmarrn_

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That might be true by a generous definition in which you include follow up shots, but the EOCR does 156 to the Breacher's 144 in one volley.

 

Of course, uncharged Breaher is essentially a turbo-MIRV, so coming in second here is really not much of a detriment.

I was talking about uncharged specifically, so the EOCR does significantly less than that in comparison, but yes, I see what you are saying.



#8
n3onfx

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I'd take the Breacher on every mech I play if I could, bar maybe the AR but that's it.


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#9
CrimsonKaim

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Extra love? Why does a hitscan weapon need love. It got bitches like Bilzerian and doesn't need any more love.


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#10
DallasCreeper

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New mech with AR, Breacher, and EOC for laughs. 


 

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Ridding the world of evil, one Berzerker at a time.


#11
Kopra

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The Breacher is so damn hard to use so it absolutely needs:

 

- infinite range

- more DPS

- less sound

- less spread

- splash damage (at least twice as big as charged HEAT)

- EMP on hit

- hitting through walls

- absorb fuel enchantment

- trap function

- resistance debuff (+30% damage at least)

- pinning enemies to walls

- disable AC, orblord, deflectors and shock coil

- dark hellsmokes Nvidia PhysX particles and laughing evil skulls that drip blood


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#12
Guns_N_Rozer

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The Breacher is so damn hard to use so it absolutely needs:

 

- infinite range

- more DPS

- less sound

- less spread

- splash damage (at least twice as big as charged HEAT)

- EMP on hit

- hitting through walls > how about bunker  :pirate: 

- absorb fuel enchantment

- trap function

- resistance debuff (+30% damage at least)

- pinning enemies to walls >  let me try on u first ,tell me how it feels  :teehee: 

- disable AC, orblord, deflectors and shock coil

- dark hellsmokes Nvidia PhysX particles and laughing evil skulls that drip blood   >   :wub:



#13
The_Silencer

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lol

speaking of Bunker.. try to charge it and fire to a couple of trucks in a row... only the first vehicle will explode

 

just as side note

 

Note++: 2-state weapon stats aren't explained well enough... nowhere (ingame nor official site). Accuracy/range values may be somehow confusing from a balancing stand point to the end-user. meh


Edited by The_Silencer, 29 February 2016 - 12:52 PM.

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The difference between theory and practice is smaller in theory than it is in practice.


#14
DerMax

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One of the strongest primaries in the game due to the charged+uncharged combo that deals 200,000,000 damages. I still think it's a bug.


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#15
The_Silencer

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on the SFX thing -when charged-, the same weird loop playing occurs redundantly for the T-32Bolt and EOC weapons, AFAIK


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The difference between theory and practice is smaller in theory than it is in practice.


#16
CoshCaust

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Too much damage.

Though my perception of its damage may be tied to the also-seemingly-OP damage of the Pred pucks.

 

shytznutzdog.hwk



#17
The_Silencer

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whatever...

 

now I'm curious, guys... seems to be that I've touched a nerve with this topic

 

could you coherently ellaborate more?

 

Thanks


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#18
CoshCaust

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whatever...

 

now I'm curious, guys... seems to be that I've touched a nerve with this topic

 

could you coherently ellaborate more?

 

Thanks

I talk a bit about it here:

https://community.pl...-mines/?p=80020

TL;DR: The Pred has a ludicrously high skill ceiling as a skirmisher- which is questionable to me.



#19
1uster

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It's hard. It's powerful. It needs good hit reg.

Unfortunately the last point is the biggest one.

 

Btw - I have a question:

The charged shot - is it one bullet or like some nails with much less spread then the uncharged shot? Because one match ago I saw hit reg on 2(!) mechs standing behind...


Edited by 1uster, 29 February 2016 - 03:19 PM.


#20
The_Silencer

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IIRC, it's intended to penetrate several mechs when charged. Although at long range, the "spread factor" makes it mostly useless from what I've personally seen.. I'd like to be wrong on that though


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#21
kaiserschmarrn_

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IIRC, it's intended to penetrate several mechs when charged. Although at long range, the "spread factor" makes it mostly useless from what I've personally seen.. I'd like to be wrong on that though

What spread factor? The charged shot has 100% accuracy...



#22
n3onfx

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What spread factor? The charged shot has 100% accuracy...

 

I think what he means is damage falloff. To be honest I have no idea if damage reduces once it goes through a mech and hits other mechs. Back on topic though the Breacher is an incredibly versatile weapon that is balanced only because the skill ceiling of the sole mech it is found on is so high.


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#23
CoshCaust

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Back on topic though the Breacher is an incredibly versatile weapon that is balanced only because the skill ceiling of the sole mech it is found on is so high.

Maybe. I'm on the fence, not arguing one way or another. It's just hard to accept that a mech with an MO like the Pred can have such relevance in a skirmish setting.

Edited by CoshCaust, 29 February 2016 - 09:23 PM.


#24
MechFighter5e3bf9

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if you think about how bolt action works in a gun you can see why your charged then uncharged combo has that extra speed, think of it as one in the chamber and hammer back so pulling trigger = insta fire then one sliding action loads the next shot and in a normal situation the chamber is clear and bolt open ready for a trigger pull allowing the bolt to load the chamber simultaneously cocking hammer so yeah, having chamber loaded cocked and ready will net you a speedy second shot compared to standard open bolt receivers (breecher is acting similar to an Autococker paintball gun (closed bolt automatic))


Edited by Bastardo, 29 February 2016 - 10:30 PM.


#25
1uster

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I think what he means is damage falloff. To be honest I have no idea if damage reduces once it goes through a mech and hits other mechs. Back on topic though the Breacher is an incredibly versatile weapon that is balanced only because the skill ceiling of the sole mech it is found on is so high.

 

No I asked actually for the accuracy / hit scan / how many "bullets" fact. But the damage falloff is also interesting. In my case yesterday they didn't lined up perfectly and I am not that precise, so it could be a little spread which damaged both mechs...

 

 

And another question:

Does this happen only to me - engaging an enemy and realize that my first charged breacher shot wasn't charged? So often I hold the mouse button walking cloaked up to the enemy and boom - standing naked.



#26
LaurenEmily

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Too much damage.

Though my perception of its damage may be tied to the also-seemingly-OP damage of the Pred pucks.

 

shytznutzdog.hwk

 

I think it seems op to you when someone can hit with both of the weapons simultaneously, i can tell the difference from my own experience from fighting experienced vs rookie predators, the experienced ones will melt you much faster but that is mostly due to the fact that they can utilize the mines properly, which can make the breacher seem very strong too. A predator who has meticulous breacher aim but can't use the mines in skirmishes won't be doing very good.

 

if you think about how bolt action works in a gun you can see why your charged then uncharged combo has that extra speed, think of it as one in the chamber and hammer back so pulling trigger = insta fire then one sliding action loads the next shot and in a normal situation the chamber is clear and bolt open ready for a trigger pull allowing the bolt to load the chamber simultaneously cocking hammer so yeah, having chamber loaded cocked and ready will net you a speedy second shot compared to standard open bolt receivers (breecher is acting similar to an Autococker paintball gun (closed bolt automatic))

 
I love when people come up with good scientific explanations to justify game bugs. I really think it's a nice feature of the weapon, intended or not, and it still requires you to keep your aim to hit both of the shots, it's not an instant guaranteed damage bonus.

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#27
DeeRax

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A predator who has meticulous breacher aim but can't use the mines in skirmishes won't be doing very good.

^The reason I don't can't play Pred.


Edited by (TDM) DeeRax, 01 March 2016 - 04:55 AM.

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#28
DallasCreeper

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I love when people come up with good scientific explanations to justify game bugs. I really think it's a nice feature of the weapon, intended or not, and it still requires you to keep your aim to hit both of the shots, it's not an instant guaranteed damage bonus.

 

If it's a bug, why give the post-charge reload a special noise compared to the normal reload? I'm pretty sure it was intended. 


 

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#29
Hyginos

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Maybe. I'm on the fence, not arguing one way or another. It's just hard to accept that a mech with an MO like the Pred can have such relevance in a skirmish setting.

 
 
 U0t3AuB.png

This is EOCP vs HEAT.

 

Pred weapons are just backwards. it has a mirv/slug on its left and a HEAT cannon on its right.


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#30
Sokram

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I would like shorter reload and longer charge time.  To make uncharged shots a lil bit more "spammable" for close combat.

 

 

Also, I would prefer if its charged shot were actually a short "burst" of spikes instead of a single pellet.  Because firing animation looks like its a burst and not a single shot.
 

 

But hell, i can live with it as it is. Its not a bad weapon....just hard to use for me sometimes.



#31
DallasCreeper

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I would like shorter reload and longer charge time.  To make uncharged shots a lil bit more "spammable" for close combat.

144 damage... "spammable?"


 

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#32
The_Silencer

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did some homework while exploring a map off-line and, yep, when charged this weapon has excellent accuracy, at least, at short/mid/mid-long range. So my previous impression on it was, more than probably, pretty inconsistent due to lag issues

 

Although I'm not so satisfied with how this weapon behaves in normal mode on the field, at least for now.. it does not overheat much -so you can fire ir many times in normal. However its purpose at close/mid range does not look to me as complete. Maybe it's just me though -up until now again.

 

Additionally, what do you think about the possibility of adding to the pred one new minimalistic zooming function?

 

Edit: And yes, I've had the same feeling too. Sometimes, after you charge it, seems to be working in the wrong way. And seemed to me that it occurs not due to any wrong delay while charging the Breacher.. Hope this helps


Edited by The_Silencer, 01 March 2016 - 05:14 PM.

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The difference between theory and practice is smaller in theory than it is in practice.


#33
WmMoneyFrmMissouri

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The day I realized the breacher could shoot through shields (not very long ago mind you) was like that moment Dirk Diggler realized he won his first award for best actor in a finely made pornographic film.


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#34
Sokram

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144 damage... "spammable?"

 

It does 100 uncharged.  + spread.  

 

Uncharged breacher firerate is 0.5  (Flak cannon - 0.8  Miniflak - 2.5).   I want it to be at least 0.7   .       And longer charge time...like +0.6 second.

 

But thats just my opinion.



#35
DerMax

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It does 100 uncharged.  + spread.  
 
Uncharged breacher firerate is 0.5  (Flak cannon - 0.8  Miniflak - 2.5).   I want it to be at least 0.7   .       And longer charge time...like +0.6 second.
 
But thats just my opinion.

It does not do 100 uncharged.


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#36
n3onfx

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0cV4B0l.png0cV4B0l.png

 

 

Signature badges, the ghetto way to get them anyways haha.

 

Whatever happened to the badges btw, is it that hard to click on a checkbox to enable them or add a couple lines of code to the UI?


Edited by neon, 06 March 2016 - 06:21 AM.

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#37
DerMax

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Signature badges, the ghetto way to get them anyways haha.

 

Whatever happened to the badges btw, is it that hard to click on a checkbox to enable them or add a couple lines of code to the UI?

Apparently, hard enough.


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#38
Chickin

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Badger.


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#39
n3onfx

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SNAAAAAAKE


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#40
DallasCreeper

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It does 100 uncharged.  

 Breacher has the uncharged 144 dmg shotgun, and the 100 dmg charged slug. It doesn't work like the HEAT Cannon or EOCR where the charged shot deals more damage


 

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