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Grenade Glitch!

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#1
PD22

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For the last 2 weeks, my grenades are exploding right after I launch them.  I am not detonating them accidentally.  Affects Vanguard and Infil.  Happens frequently, not every time, and it certainly hurts my game.  Is there a fix?



#2
EM1O

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Only 3 instances i've ever encountered with this.

You are detonating them with a double-click on your mouse (or your mouse is dying)

You are detonating them by hitting it with your primary weapon fire, or an enemy does so.

You have a key meta or hot-key linked via your mouse oem software (or joypad or whatever) to a keyboard key listed for some other effect on the Settings page of the game that makes the game "think" you want to detonate it/are delivering a double-click.

My personal experience was my joypad software had a DPad key linked to "1" for items, and Settings also had that DPadKey linked to Item 1, so every time i launched a Detonator using the joypad key, the game recieved a double-"1" and it immediately exploded. I changed the Settings DPad key to 7, no more problems.

 

Or you may have gremlins in your intertoobz.

 

edited for clarity :P


Edited by em1o, 13 June 2015 - 12:55 PM.

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#:  chown -R us ./base

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"...oh great Itzamna, you shall know Us by the trail of Dead."


#3
Badtings

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As a Grenadier lovin' fuzzy bunny, I have no idea what that would be, however I'm 'bumpin' this :D


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#4
PD22

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Thank you em1o.  First thing I'll do is check my ashtrays and intertoobz.  lol.  Seriously, I think you must have covered the problem here.  My guess is the mouse could be dying.  It appears fine, the buttons feel good, but the other possibilities don't seem to apply in my case.  Unless I assigned a hot key by accident, like w,a,s or d.  Gonna check it now.  Thanks, I'll let you know what I find. 


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#5
EM1O

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Not sure if this is the same: the Vanguards and Scouts in Co-op TDM (usually the Wreckage map) occasionally will Flak-gun my grenades in mid-air. I've never encountered this, to my recollection, while in normal pvp matches. It's sorta one of those "WTF??? GawdDAMM!" throw the mouse at the monitor moments.

YMMV :wallbash:


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#:  chown -R us ./base

nRJ1C9n.png

"...oh great Itzamna, you shall know Us by the trail of Dead."


#6
HepTagoN

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Try using diffrent mouse. Or change detonate button to keyboard, if possible. In both cases if issue will disappear, that means u need new mouse.

Dont forget to post results.


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#7
ticklemyiguana

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It happens with TOWs too. It happens most for me in games where I have severe ping spikes and makes me think that the inconsistent connection is somehow duplicating the data sent, and detonating the weapon. That being said, this often happens right in the barrel, which is at a point where you can't manually detonate it.

tl;dr

I don't know anything.


Edited by ticklemyiguana, 13 June 2015 - 05:21 PM.

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Spoiler

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#8
WmMoneyFrmMissouri

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I was playing against PD when he was having these "issues". It's a good story to try to explain so many deaths at my hands that round... MUAHAHAHA!! ;) 


Edited by WmMoneyFrmMissouri, 13 June 2015 - 01:44 PM.

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#9
The_Silencer

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Perhaps that mouse button has dirt beneath it?

 

Check the others too..


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The difference between theory and practice is smaller in theory than it is in practice.


#10
Hyginos

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I've seen something like this a few times from both ends. My analysis is that a brief server desync can cause the projectile to spawn inside the mech/gun model and instantly explode.


MFW Howken

 

My post count is neat.


#11
PD22

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Possible conclusion here.  I feel a very VERY slight crunchy sensation under the right mouse key.  I will order a new mouse and see if there is a difference.   



#12
PD22

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Wow, thanks for all the responses.  When I figure it all out, I'll post the findings. The crunchiness almost feels like dirt, but could be mechanical, seems more likely.  Will try out the can-o-air.


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#13
_incitatus

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I've had toes and grenades do this too. At first I thought they were hitting some geometry I wasn't seeing, but every now and then they just instantly explode sooner than I could manually detonate them.

#14
Dew

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Yeah, the catch here and what most people aren't taking into account is that it detonates before you could ever possibly do it manually.

 

My guess is that maybe due to server wackiness your TOW/GL collides with your own hitbox.



#15
Flifang

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Certain surfaces will deflect most projectiles and if you shoot an ally mech it sometimes does too. You have to be touching the surface or ally and be parallel to the point of deflection while also aiming at where the shot can bounce off of. I found a spot on bazaar where I could replicate it with every mech and found among things deflected it was grenades, mama bear, saare, seeker, hellfires, Kla grenade, and redox. Tow I'm pretty sure can rickochet but I couldn't do it with the particular surface and eoc just sticks. I'm pretty sure it's something hitbox related because hitboxes can be funky. When the barrier item was first introduced you could trap somebody halfway inside the shield and they would be stuck there. This was fixed afterwards but the first week or so had some hilarious circumstances with this.



#16
JeffMagnum

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What's your ping? I get the instantly exploding issue with TOW/GL progressively more often as my ping increases past 100 or so, and after 400 it's virtually every shot. 

 

Certain surfaces will deflect most projectiles and if you shoot an ally mech it sometimes does too. You have to be touching the surface or ally and be parallel to the point of deflection while also aiming at where the shot can bounce off of. I found a spot on bazaar where I could replicate it with every mech and found among things deflected it was grenades, mama bear, saare, seeker, hellfires, Kla grenade, and redox. Tow I'm pretty sure can rickochet but I couldn't do it with the particular surface and eoc just sticks. I'm pretty sure it's something hitbox related because hitboxes can be funky. When the barrier item was first introduced you could trap somebody halfway inside the shield and they would be stuck there. This was fixed afterwards but the first week or so had some hilarious circumstances with this.

 

You can refract projectiles ~45 degrees by firing them out of a shield while your weapons are poking through the wall but your chassis isn't too. 

 

From before I fixed my OBS sound issue because I don't feel like recording anything right now:

 

Spoiler

Edited by JeffMagnum, 13 June 2015 - 10:17 PM.

d1eZeG3.png


#17
crockrocket

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You can refract projectiles ~45 degrees by firing them out of a shield while your weapons are poking through the wall but your chassis isn't too. 

 

You can do this on most skinny trees in the game. This is most observable on Last Eco, but I have made it happen on Wreckage. Also depending on your aim you can fire it off at nearly any angle. Note: you can make your respective projectile detonate on the tree itself. 


Edited by (TDM)crockrocket, 14 June 2015 - 12:19 AM.

                                                                    JgQjgkx.png

 

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#18
Kopra

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What's your ping? I get the instantly exploding issue with TOW/GL progressively more often as my ping increases past 100 or so, and after 400 it's virtually every shot. 
 

 
You can refract projectiles ~45 degrees by firing them out of a shield while your weapons are poking through the wall but your chassis isn't too. 
 
From before I fixed my OBS sound issue because I don't feel like recording anything right now:
 

Spoiler


That's because of how projectile trajectories are calculated. Your crosshair aims at a surface and a line is drawn from your weapon to that surface. If the projectile flies straight (eoc-p, tow, heat) it will hit that exact pixel you're aiming at.
As the game recognizes a lot of things as surfaces but may not necessarily be one, the projectile flies through the "surface" and is seen as "refracting". That's also a reason why primary projectiles go right, while secondary projectiles go left.

This "automatic aim" feature is annoying as hell and in CQC it has the most effect. You may end up in a situation where you can't hit an enemy dodging, because if you aim straight at the enemy, the projectile will go its own awkward way and miss, and if you lead even just a tiny bit, the difference in angle is too much and the projectile will miss. This feature also means you can't shoot behind walls as you will always need LOS to hit what you're aiming at, while still having to worry about the source of the projectile, giving you the worst of the two worlds.

In comparison, in TF2 and other games where the projectile trajectories are fixed, they will theoretically never hit what you're aiming at, only approach it (makes very little difference at long distance). Fixed trajectories also mean that you can shoot behind walls, as in you're aiming at a wall but your shoulder is peeping out of the corner: the projectile will shoot from the shoulder and go along its fixed path.
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#19
DerMax

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This ^



#20
Pumapaw

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The cat fur stuck in his mouse has finally paid off.  1 for the cats. Mohahahaha


Edited by Pumapaw, 14 June 2015 - 07:56 AM.

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#21
DieselCat

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Possible conclusion here.  I feel a very VERY slight crunchy sensation under the right mouse key.  I will order a new mouse and see if there is a difference.   

 

Need a new mouse ? Order this and you'll be fine.

 

http://www.newegg.co...N82E16826249113

 

*+


Just Relax....and take life one game at a time....

Don't run to your death....walk

 

th_Duckman.jpg   th_82c0a97c-98de-4aac-be47-05e5e099be80.

 

*+

 


#22
The_Silencer

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Wow, thanks for all the responses.  When I figure it all out, I'll post the findings. The crunchiness almost feels like dirt, but could be mechanical, seems more likely.  Will try out the can-o-air.

 

Once you get your new mouse, tell us please how it goes in order to isolate this incidence/s in the best way... or just better..

 

Thanks and good luck.


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The difference between theory and practice is smaller in theory than it is in practice.


#23
ArchMech

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As the game recognizes a lot of things as surfaces but may not necessarily be one, the projectile flies through the "surface" and is seen as "refracting". That's also a reason why primary projectiles go right, while secondary projectiles go left.
 

 

i thought this was because the crosshair is in the middle and your weapons are setup to the sides, so in order for them to actually hit wats in the crosshairs sights it cant go straight or else it would miss every time....

 

 

You are detonating them by hitting it with your primary weapon fire, or an enemy does so.

 

 

i thought this wasnt possible, tows and GL's and the like (i thought) could only be "stopped" when they hit a mech or a deployable item (or a recently killed mechs ragdoll) from what i understood, the only ammo that could be neutralized was the preds mines....

 

Certain surfaces will deflect most projectiles and if you shoot an ally mech it sometimes does too.

 

if you shoot the scout in the "head" from the SIDE it will go through him, if you shoot hellfires through a hologram they all scatter, on some walls if are touching it your weapon can end up INSIDE IT, explosive weapons will explode instantly and do NOTHING

 

id like to see footage of u replicating that bazaar spot you found...

 

 

 

You can refract projectiles ~45 degrees by firing them out of a shield while your weapons are poking through the wall but your chassis isn't too. 

 

 

and the pre game barrier lol

 

 

tl;dr

 

you suck, any1 who says TL;DR sucks at life, prolly would make me want to gut them IRL if they ever tried reading something aloud, i dont even want to know how bad you are at reading, are you drunk? 

 

 

You can do this on most skinny trees in the game. This is most observable on Last Eco, but I have made it happen on Wreckage. Also depending on your aim you can fire it off at nearly any angle. Note: you can make your respective projectile detonate on the tree itself. 

 

go shoot the saare into any small tree on last eco WHILE IN A MATCH (does not work inside explore map) watch as your saare will bounce THROUGH (not bounce OFF) fly in the air AND THEN DETONATE MID AIR


Edited by ArchMech, 14 June 2015 - 08:06 PM.

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don't mind me, i'm just on a crusade against humanity, by the end of my lifespan earth's population will be 8 billion+ trolls


#24
ticklemyiguana

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you suck, any1 who says TL;DR sucks at life, prolly would make me want to gut them IRL if they ever tried reading something aloud, i dont even want to know how bad you are at reading, are you drunk? 

Arch, you fool. I was giving a summary of my own comment.


Spoiler

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#25
Flifang

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I have no recording equipment but you can pm me and I'll show you two places on bazaar where you can do this.

#26
Kopra

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i thought this was because the crosshair is in the middle and your weapons are setup to the sides, so in order for them to actually hit wats in the crosshairs sights it cant go straight or else it would miss every time....

 

 

 

It's exactly for that reason, I think.

 

I would however argue that it's not a very good reason, as you could compensate for the fixed trajectories by aiming a bit to the side without getting all the inconsistent trajectory nonsense (it's more intuitive than it sounds). It's in the game though, has been for a long time, and with 100% probability it's not going to be changed.


Edited by (KDR) Kopra, 15 June 2015 - 01:48 PM.


#27
Meraple

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SA-HAWKINS shots from the upper barrel go down, and lower barrel shoots upwards.
Stupid thing is, the angle at which they get shot varies per distance.

It looks weird as hell.

#28
StubbornPuppet

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This happens to me sometimes.  It happens with Tow's also, but more frequently with grenades.  I've always chalked it up to the same synchronization bug that causes some button presses to be ignored (like when I am pressing my primary fire key and nothing happens, so I have to let go and press it a couple more times before anything actually starts firing.)  I figured that, in the case of the grenade or tow that instantly detonates the moment it leaves the chamber, I had usually already pressed the button just before the reload was finished and that the game had been a little late registering the first press and then registered both the early press and the second press.

 

^Did what I typed make any sense?


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To be serious for a moment this is just a joke

 


#29
MechFighter5e3bf9

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if your using a gaming mouse stubborn perhaps experiment with a macro on grenade button that fires with a safety timer you set say .3-4 seconds as to not insta pop nade 



#30
n3onfx

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I've seen it happen to someone before for a couple games in a row. It wasn't his mouse because the TOWs were detonating early enough to damage him each time, which is not possible to do with mouse clicks.

Only explanation I see is that in this particular scenario the glitch makes it so that the weapon somehow shoots from inside the mech's hitbox.
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t

t

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t

t


#31
MechFighter5e3bf9

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mabey it got fired at just the right time as he is performing a hop/boost that was álso timed correctly giving him an amplified lunge for a split second, or hell mabey hes good at unwittingly shooting them with primary lol

#32
MechFighter5e3bf9

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Also consider that map deco debris anything that can pop is çlient sided, server sees a projectile which is like a player flying over the space but you seen it hit debris server cannot

And if your using more keys than your keyboard supports (á non N Rollover keyboard in hawkén must all have this often) sometimes not only will the stack of keyboard codes have missing or out of order input but sometimes it will send windows an entirely differént key than what was pressed.
Best off with mini ps/2 keyboard unless you can afford the better board


At least i think so

Edited by MechFighter5e3bf9, 22 June 2015 - 10:58 AM.


#33
MechFighter5e3bf9

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I've seen something like this a few times from both ends. My analysis is that a brief server desync can cause the projectile to spawn inside the mech/gun model and instantly explode.

But if for that moment server desyncs wont the server still have the position/rotation momentum of the player and relative projectiles accurately which probly causes those awfull framedrops as server slows traffic down to preserve integrity and data order?

I think

#34
Flifang

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I have had problems where the servers are sending info about the match to me flawlessly but my connection is dropped suddenly. I proceed to play for the afk timer seeing everything happen in real time and moving and doing everything on my own. Anything that happens to me is relaid. Nobody can see anything I do because it was only my end that lost connection. It's odd. Maybe it has something to do with a hiccup and the program getting confused. I know some programs, when not informed on how to deal with things have a default they go to. Maybe if a tow or Gl shot is lost "in the mail," the game default detonates it before it fires completely as it tries to correct itself

#35
StubbornPuppet

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I have had problems where the servers are sending info about the match to me flawlessly but my connection is dropped suddenly. I proceed to play for the afk timer seeing everything happen in real time and moving and doing everything on my own. Anything that happens to me is relaid. Nobody can see anything I do because it was only my end that lost connection. It's odd. Maybe it has something to do with a hiccup and the program getting confused. I know some programs, when not informed on how to deal with things have a default they go to. Maybe if a tow or Gl shot is lost "in the mail," the game default detonates it before it fires completely as it tries to correct itself

Well that explains a lot.  I could never figure out how that giant BattleTurkey of yours suddenly appears in front of me, as if by magic teleportation.  I thought I was just blind and slow (well, I am slow).


To be serious for a moment this is just a joke

 


#36
The_Silencer

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Dunno, some more ideas from the top of my mind on this ..

 

I use to press TAB to check how my ping is going... if it goes crazy then thetere you got it.

 

If a guy is lagging hard then, there you got it too most of the times.

 

Sometimes too, the depth of field value may confuse you as you play with it in your settings... I've seen that happening to many pilots, friends of mine, in the past.

 

"Sudden bottlenecks" for a number of pretty-weird reasons, and even malicious ones?... that should be taken into account as well.

 

et cetera... hoping this helps somehow. Although some of the cases posted above have made me think twice on this matter. Interesting cases; I've to admit that..


.

The difference between theory and practice is smaller in theory than it is in practice.


#37
comic_sans

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I got this bug for the first time with my tow 2 days ago.  Lame stuff.


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#38
PD22

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Hawken bros, thanks for all the interest in this sudden crazy glitch.  Glad to report that a new mouse solved the problem.  Notice faster response all around from the right mouse button which was certainly the culprit.  Grenade glitch solved. Thanks!


Edited by PD22, 01 July 2015 - 08:05 PM.


#39
StubbornPuppet

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Wrong.  Not solved.  Others are seeing this too, like me, and it isn't the mouse.  I actually have two mice (is that right) that I alternate between when my hand gets tired of one and it happens on both.  Also happens from the game controller when using that.

 

I attribute it to the same hiccup that is so prevalent to the Raider's Corsair shots - where you pull the trigger, the animation of the gun firing and reloading visibly happens... yet no actual blast/shot comes out of the gun and no hit is registered on targets that should have definitely been hit.


Edited by StubbornPuppet, 02 July 2015 - 08:05 AM.

To be serious for a moment this is just a joke

 


#40
The_Silencer

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Just as side note..

 

And just curious... anyone has seen something like this we're discussin about with Detonators instead..?


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The difference between theory and practice is smaller in theory than it is in practice.





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