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Thoughts on better balancing, and more freedom to mechs weapon options/

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#1
EvilWarLord333333

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As the title says above i think the game "NEEDS" better balencing for matches. serveral TDM matches i've played after being away for 2 or 3 years, that i came back it doesn't feel that its changed much. not only do i think the balancing needs tweaking i also think the game shoud be overhualed. Last night a player some how was an assualt with a breacher loadout ? And was just wiping the entire team. This game is really fun in all honesty but there should be a number of things

 

 

"NEW MAPS"

 

"NEW WEAPONS"

 

"OPTION TO BUY MECH PARTS WITH HC"

 

"BUFFS AND NERFS"

 

"LESS RESTRICTING WEAPON OPTIONS"

 

"CHANGE THE UI LAY OUTS FOR TYPE A'S, B'S, AND C'S SO THEY MATCH THE BODY TYPE'S SHAPE".

 

 

"allow the ability to swap out secondaries"

 

 

mostly in onther words i believe the Hawken maybe due for an over haul at some point in time, i'll let the devs decide.



#2
nepacaka

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ok.

Spoiler

Edited by nepacaka, 17 September 2015 - 04:04 PM.

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Kompotka 3000. 2D ha?ken game: https://community.pl...ve/?hl=kompotka

Interceptor, B-Class mech concept: https://community.pl...itdefence-mech/

Challenger, C-Class mech concept: https://community.pl...ccepted-thread/

G2-Brawler, C-class mech concept: https://community.pl...pacaka-is-here/

Kinetik, B-class mech concept: https://community.pl...ass-shotgunner/

Melter, A-class mech concept: https://community.pl...-class-support/


#3
Silverfire

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Ok.
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#4
Amidatelion

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Ok.
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#5
kaiserschmarrn_

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"new maps"

 

this takes time and effort, things you clearly don't put into your research or posts

 

"new weapons"

 

this also takes time and a complete team

 

"option to buy mech parts with hc"

 

no, the devs need money, this is their only surefire way of gaining it

 

"buffs and nerfs"

 

sure, but the right ones require plenty of time precision, with some mechs needing complete reworks

 

"less restricting weapon options"

 

maybe, given the time, even though they really aren't restricting, and opening them up much further could cause significant balance issues

 

"change the UI layouts for type As, Bs, and Cs so they match the body type's shape"

 

this would take loads of time, and would add literally no depth to the game, besides maybe a tiny bit of insignificant immersion

 

"allow the ability to change out secondaries"

 

again, balance


Edited by Kaiserschmarrn_, 17 September 2015 - 06:01 PM.

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#6
nepacaka

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meat missile ruine it.


Kompotka 3000. 2D ha?ken game: https://community.pl...ve/?hl=kompotka

Interceptor, B-Class mech concept: https://community.pl...itdefence-mech/

Challenger, C-Class mech concept: https://community.pl...ccepted-thread/

G2-Brawler, C-class mech concept: https://community.pl...pacaka-is-here/

Kinetik, B-class mech concept: https://community.pl...ass-shotgunner/

Melter, A-class mech concept: https://community.pl...-class-support/


#7
driedjello

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It's not possible to have any balance when matches look like this:

 

12002116_10204120510447659_3825794763985


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#8
Panzermanathod

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WHHHHYYYYY Did you have to make most of your post in bold, enlarged, underlined font?

 

And why are they all in quotation marks? Do you want new maps or "new maps"?

 

Also Hawken has been placed in the hands of a new dev team that is still getting together after a long while of nothing from the old team, which is the main reason why there looks like there's been no changes. Even though there has been.



#9
Kopra

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And why are they all in quotation marks? Do you want new maps or "new maps"?

 

Some people use quotation marks as a way to emphasize a word like when something is bolded or underlined. Why, that's a good question.

http://www.unnecessa...er-already.html


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#10
comic_sans

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"new maps"

 

G2 Bunker confirmed


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#11
Sylhiri

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If FF14 taught me anything it's that a surprising amount of people will deal with your mechanics if it has some kind of lore reason.

 

>Pick body type (Speed) A class, (Health) C class, (???) B class (Gives lore explaination based on A/B/C chassis)

>Pick ability (Lists abilities, some abilities are greyed out with lore explaination)

>Pick secondary (locked behind body and ability, other secondaries are grayed out after selecting body type and ability)

       "why can't I use Hellfires on speed type?" "Too heavy", "Why can't I use TOW with Stealth" "something, something company lore"

>Pick primary (locked behind body, ability and secondary, other primaries are grayed out after selecting body type, ability and secondary)

      "something something company, world, mech lore"

 

Pretty much the exact system we have now with the illusion of customization covered with a delicious lore topping.


Edited by Sylhiri, 18 September 2015 - 09:19 AM.

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#12
Hyginos

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If FF14 taught me anything it's that a surprising amount of people will deal with your mechanics if it has some kind of lore reason.

 

>Pick body type (Speed) A class, (Health) C class, (???) B class (Gives lore explaination based on A/B/C chassis)

>Pick ability (Lists abilities, some abilities are greyed out with lore explaination)

>Pick secondary (locked behind body and ability, other secondaries are grayed out after selecting body type and ability)

       "why can't I use Hellfires on speed type?" "Too heavy", "Why can't I use TOW with Stealth" "something, something company lore"

>Pick primary (locked behind body, ability and secondary, other primaries are grayed out after selecting body type, ability and secondary)

      "something something company, world, mech lore"

 

Pretty much the exact system we have now with the illusion of customization covered with a delicious lore topping.

 

At first I was all "wow that sounds dumb" but after mulling it over further I think you might be on too something.


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#13
Panzermanathod

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But why can't a set chassis have a specific weapon loadout for lore reasons? It's easier to explain why the Reaper, being a sniper mech, has sniper rifles then trying to explain away why some mech that kinda looks like a Reaper can't equip a TOW. Yes you can put lore behind it but Illusion of depth might not work out in the long run.

 

All this is kinda subjective, though. But  we should look over the concept of having specific mechs having set weapons over the Make-A-Mech Future.



#14
Kopra

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If FF14 taught me anything it's that a surprising amount of people will deal with your mechanics if it has some kind of lore reason.

 

>Pick body type (Speed) A class, (Health) C class, (???) B class (Gives lore explaination based on A/B/C chassis)

>Pick ability (Lists abilities, some abilities are greyed out with lore explaination)

>Pick secondary (locked behind body and ability, other secondaries are grayed out after selecting body type and ability)

       "why can't I use Hellfires on speed type?" "Too heavy", "Why can't I use TOW with Stealth" "something, something company lore"

>Pick primary (locked behind body, ability and secondary, other primaries are grayed out after selecting body type, ability and secondary)

      "something something company, world, mech lore"

 

Pretty much the exact system we have now with the illusion of customization covered with a delicious lore topping.

>Pick body type (B)

>Pick ability (Blitz)

>Pick Secondary (Corsair-KLA)

>Try to pick primary (Breacher is locked)

 

Mouse over Breacher to see lore justification:

 

"Intergalactical laws ban the combination, OP fuzzing bunny."


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#15
DeeRax

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>Pick body type (B)

>Pick ability (Blitz)

>Pick Secondary (Corsair-KLA)

>Try to pick primary (Breacher is locked)

 

Mouse over Breacher to see lore justification:

 

"Intergalactical laws ban the combination, OP fuzzing bunny way too kickass awesome."


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#16
Sylhiri

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At first I was all "wow that sounds dumb" but after mulling it over further I think you might be on too something.

 

That's like everything I say Hyginos, you should know this by now >:0

 


All this is kinda subjective, though. But  we should look over the concept of having specific mechs having set weapons over the Make-A-Mech Future.

 

What like the Generation 2 mechs? Because that was ADH's solution to the hole they dug themselves in after code welding weapons to mechs.


Edited by Sylhiri, 18 September 2015 - 12:03 PM.


#17
nepacaka

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Yes you can put lore behind it but Illusion of depth might not work out in the long run.

 

this game need a lore as well as DooM, or Quake 1-3.

hawken lore - it is a devs mistake.

 

mech weight is 2 tonnes? what? they made from cavr...keiv...cavorit? dafuq?

pocahontas have a better lore than hawken.

 

hawken is a nice looking. without any lore. appearance speaks for itself. look at gigastructure on Prosk. if you shoot in it, metal shraphels will scatter around, and than recover to normal.

what player think if look at it?

 

"hm...this metal can regenerate. hm...and you can't destroy it. hm...and this metal swallowed whole city. wow!"

than player see map backgrounds, and look at that giant massive columns from metal.

 

"hm...this gigastructure... it is grows and consumes all. prbably it is dangerous, and you can't survive without mech"

 

thats all. thats all what you should know about Hawken. Gigastructure. Mechs. War.
 

game starts the player's imagination. is it correct player perception  or not, it does not matter. It may be different for any each players, but it will always be correct. even if player have a different imagination with khang lee, it doesn't matter. because he can have his own version of hawken events. and probably better than original lore.

the story of game may be more better if it start, for example on Earth, in 22## years. who care about illal?



actually, someone interested why Visor, half-cyborg man trying to kill a giant-fukking-eye with legs in a 19th-century castle where floor is lava? no? xD

so, hawken lore it is actually waste a time. it is the same like made a lore for Counter-strike.



what is actually this game needs?
1)ping (done), optimization

2) camos/parts (for MC, for people who spent money)

3) mechs/maps. new Engines! people love buy a strange and badass engines.

4) some system like tuning, but with pros and cons. which allow player to experiment with mech, but not changed mech abilities too much. and it should be available from 1 lvl, to prevent p2w.

5) Gals and Babaji.

6) Probably events to motivate players (i'm not about bot culling :P). yeah, we have some amount of people who competing between each other, but most people not. they need a stimul, a purpose. new content where they can spent their money.

7) i'm not talking about balance, because game like hawken should have minor balance tweak in Every Patch.


Edited by nepacaka, 18 September 2015 - 12:15 PM.

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Kompotka 3000. 2D ha?ken game: https://community.pl...ve/?hl=kompotka

Interceptor, B-Class mech concept: https://community.pl...itdefence-mech/

Challenger, C-Class mech concept: https://community.pl...ccepted-thread/

G2-Brawler, C-class mech concept: https://community.pl...pacaka-is-here/

Kinetik, B-class mech concept: https://community.pl...ass-shotgunner/

Melter, A-class mech concept: https://community.pl...-class-support/


#18
Panzermanathod

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What like the Generation 2 mechs? Because that was ADH's solution to the hole they dug themselves in after code welding weapons to mechs.

I mean Hawken mechs in general. When I say Make-a-Mech, i mean something along the lines of Armored Core or Front Mission, not simply changing weapons.



#19
nepacaka

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I mean Hawken mechs in general. When I say Make-a-Mech, i mean something along the lines of Armored Core or Front Mission, not simply changing weapons.

 

actually, many game with anime-mech exist for this purpose. hawken not another one.
also, it is technically impossible, due to required changes bones, animation and other. more easily make a new game with new engine, than reworked all.

 

here is actually exist "figureheads" (probably this game is still in closed-beta)

 


but actually gameplay is sux if compared with hawked. yes it looking good, but. it just sux.


Edited by nepacaka, 18 September 2015 - 01:02 PM.

Kompotka 3000. 2D ha?ken game: https://community.pl...ve/?hl=kompotka

Interceptor, B-Class mech concept: https://community.pl...itdefence-mech/

Challenger, C-Class mech concept: https://community.pl...ccepted-thread/

G2-Brawler, C-class mech concept: https://community.pl...pacaka-is-here/

Kinetik, B-class mech concept: https://community.pl...ass-shotgunner/

Melter, A-class mech concept: https://community.pl...-class-support/


#20
Sorroritas

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How about giving A/B/C classes a specific amount of base armor and giving weapons a specific amount of hp bonus/penalty (or maybe other stats too?) like either absolute (+50hp for SMC, -20hp for Flak etc etc) or a percentage amount (+5% hp, -5% hp etc etc).

 

That way you could probably allow more weapon choice without making things horribly broken.


Edited by Sorroritas, 18 September 2015 - 02:02 PM.

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#21
Sylhiri

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How about giving A/B/C classes a specific amount of base armor and giving weapons a specific amount of hp bonus/penalty (or maybe other stats too?) like either absolute (+50hp for SMC, -20hp for Flak etc etc) or a percentage amount (+5% hp, -5% hp etc etc).

 

That way you could probably allow more weapon choice without making things horribly broken.

 

It's kinda already like that, sustain mechs generally have more HP then "burst mechs". Sustain peasents don't need hp bonuses >.>



#22
CounterlogicMan

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Would be cool to have an optional private server mod that allows players to put any primary weapon on any mech. For funz.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Really I just want to play with eoc g2 raider.


Edited by CounterlogicMan, 18 September 2015 - 02:43 PM.

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#23
kaiserschmarrn_

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How about giving A/B/C classes a specific amount of base armor and giving weapons a specific amount of hp bonus/penalty (or maybe other stats too?) like either absolute (+50hp for SMC, -20hp for Flak etc etc) or a percentage amount (+5% hp, -5% hp etc etc).

 

That way you could probably allow more weapon choice without making things horribly broken.

This is the worst f*cking idea i have ever heard


Edited by Kaiserschmarrn_, 19 September 2015 - 05:08 AM.

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#24
Panzermanathod

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How about giving A/B/C classes a specific amount of base armor and giving weapons a specific amount of hp bonus/penalty (or maybe other stats too?) like either absolute (+50hp for SMC, -20hp for Flak etc etc) or a percentage amount (+5% hp, -5% hp etc etc).

 

That way you could probably allow more weapon choice without making things horribly broken.

That actually would break things more. Why would equipping weapons alter HP? I mean, this isn't some RPG with enchanted weapons, these are mechs.



#25
Kopra

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That actually would break things more. Why would equipping weapons alter HP? I mean, this isn't some RPG with enchanted weapons, these are mechs.

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#26
StubbornPuppet

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I would like an update that prevents using a font size larger than 14 on the forums.


To be serious for a moment this is just a joke

 


#27
Onstrava

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When you say less weapon restrictions do you mean like doing Alpha when you could choice what weapon you wanted on your mechs primary? I wouldn't mind that in sense of diversity but I think that would be a double edge sword on some mechs if you know what I mean. It also might get rid of some of the "uniqueness" of some the mechs, which isn't a good thing. Maybe if the devs allowed some of the mechs to use more weapons on them by simply expand the weapon range to about five instead of three. More options is always a good thing as long as it isn't anything crazy if you know what I mean.


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