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A request from Kaotic_Beaver and his dad

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#1
harmless_kittens

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As many of you know, Kaotic is my 14 yr old son IRL.  He's gotten quite good at the game (over 2100 MMR now), and he plays it every day for at least one hour.  Unlike most of us, he has never really complained about anything about the game itself (he just gets frustrated at other players sometimes).

 

Anyway, I have been keeping him posted on what is happening on the consoles right now and what is being discussed in the forums about the future of the PC game.  He is very worried about his favorite PC game being changed into something worse, and his request is a simple one.  He asks that they either not change anything for the PC version, OR leave the OPTION to play it the old way (which I told him is probably impossible).

 

Since he isn't on the forums (household rules), I thought I'd just throw this "out there" to whomever might be listening and in control.  There are a handful of players like myself and my son who already enjoy the game "as is", even if its technically "unfinished", and will flat out reject any major changes that might require us to "start over".

 

For me personally, I'd like to see some more balancing happen, and new mechs are always great.  But if I have to choose between new mechs but also starting over and losing everything we've spent money on, versus the "incomplete" product that we have right now, I personally vote for leaving everything as it is.  My main concern is that we just need more players, for more balanced matches, which might just require better marketing, rather than a whole "start over" approach.

 

Anyway, just thought I'd pass this request from my son on, since he can't do so himself.


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#2
Silverfire

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I think we want the game to change for the better.  Who wouldn't, right? New mechs, new maps, good balance changes, etc.  I think we all want that, and I think the devs want that as well.  As for the "good" both sides have their own ideas.

 

 

And yeah, basically nobody wants another stat reset, which what I'm guessing you're referring to.  I really hope it doesn't come down to that, even if they refund us for everything we bought and everything, because I like everything I have.  Keeping legacy mechs and everything.

 

 

But I understand.  You and your perspective and your son's point of view.  I get it. :)


Edited by Silverfire, 18 August 2016 - 08:28 AM.

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#3
TheButtSatisfier

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For me personally, I'd like to see some more balancing happen, and new mechs are always great.  But if I have to choose between new mechs but also starting over and losing everything we've spent money on, versus the "incomplete" product that we have right now, I personally vote for leaving everything as it is.  My main concern is that we just need more players, for more balanced matches, which might just require better marketing, rather than a whole "start over" approach.

 

The devs have recently posted that they're interested in grandfathering our mechs when the PC patch is released. Now, "grandfathering" can mean a wide spectrum of things. Whether they plan to leave all of the existing functionality with our mechs, like customization, the weapon loadouts, customizable items and internals, etc. is all up to speculation.

 

Fortunately / unfortunately, Reloaded hasn't indicated that they're rushing to release the PC patch. That's fortunate because that may mean that they're taking their time to make sure the release is done right, and it's unfortunate because it's possible that the reason why they're in no rush is that they view the PC market as being weak. Again, all speculation.

 

Regardless, I agree that I'd rather have Reloaded leave PC Hawken the way it is over implementing the current Howken changes. Some of the new mechs look intriguing, but none of it interests me enough to lose the ability to customize the functionality of my mechs.

 

I've waited a long time for a good update to Hawken, and I don't mind waiting longer to avoid taking a step backwards. I want Reloaded to feel comfortable with experimenting on those console peasants to get things right so they can bring the best of what they've learned to us.


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#4
StubbornPuppet

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I'm less worried about the customization (because I get a true feeling that they are working on that and didn't ever actually want it gone), and much more worried about what I see that indicates a strong leaning towards a Pay2Win strategy.

 

For example:

The G2 mech model in the console version is, to me, appalling.  They should NOT be better or have an advantage over G1's (which they are and do in many ways).  If anything, they should be more challenging to use properly - kind of a "now that you've mastered that G1 mech, you should prove you are worthy by attempting to master its finicky, nuanced G2 version that compromises "X" in exchange for "Y".  Are you good enough to take advantage of the edge you can get if you master it?"  That is what made the G2 Raider so much fun.  And I had really looked forward to more like that - not this BS of giving it more health, more speed and room for more and improved internals and items.

 

Yes, I realize you don't HAVE to pay for those with money... but the grind to get to them - a grind you have to go through at a disadvantage - is extremely steep.


Edited by StubbornPuppet, 18 August 2016 - 12:49 PM.

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#5
TheButtSatisfier

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The G2 mech model in the console version is, to me, appalling.  They should NOT be better or have an advantage over G1's (which they are and do in many ways).  If anything, they should be more challenging to use properly - kind of a "now that you've mastered that G1 mech, you should prove you are worthy by attempting to master its finicky, nuanced G2 version that compromises "X" in exchange for "Y".  Are you good enough to take advantage of the edge you can get if you master it?"  That is what made the G2 Raider so much fun.  And I had really looked forward to more like that - not this BS of giving it more health, more speed and room for more and improved internals and items.

 

When I first heard of Howken G2 mechs, that's what I thought they were going to do. I remember seeing in one of the Q&A threads where they talked about the G2 Pred, and they said, "Emphasizing on the "Predator" style of the Patrick Mech, engineers stacked the G2 line with premium quality gears and suspensions. The G2 Predators can now stalk the jungles more efficiently with faster movements while keeping their stealth properties."

 

Now stupid me, I'm thought, "Oh, that's cool, maybe they reduced the armor of the mech, increased the walk and run speed, and fiddled with Pred's ability to also grant a small speed boost." I thought that was a cool idea. The G1 mech would be something akin to what we're used to, and the G2 mech is a close but distinct variant of the G1. Maybe the G2 has a different weapon loadout from the G1; it'd make sense for a mech like a Brawler where a Flak Brawler (G1?) should have more armor whereas a Hawkins Brawler (G2?) should have less armor and a wee bit more speed. Not as wide of a change as the current Raider vs. G2 Raider, but enough of a tweak to be compelling. It made sense. Hell, they could just take the current three mech weapon loadouts for each mech, split them into individual G1 - G3 variants, and then balance each of the mech stats around the weapon loadouts.

 

But instead, they decided that the G2 mech should be a direct fuzzy bunnyng upgrade to the G1 in every respect. There's no trade-off when you go to a G2, it's literally an upgrade. No downgrade. It's the laziest thing the developers could have done, and they did it. How they missed such an obvious opportunity to diversify and easily balance the mech landscape by a country mile bewilders me, and it's the single most compelling piece of evidence of their developmental disarray that I've seen.


Edited by TheButtSatisfier, 18 August 2016 - 01:07 PM.

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#6
Flifang

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I'm less worried about the customization (because I get a true feeling that they are working on that and didn't ever actually want it gone), and much more worried about what I see that indicates a strong leaning towards a Pay2Win strategy.

 

For example:

The G2 mech model in the console version is, to me, appalling.  They should NOT be better or have an advantage over G1's (which they are and do in many ways).  If anything, they should be more challenging to use properly - kind of a "now that you've mastered that G1 mech, you should prove you are worthy by attempting to master its finicky, nuanced G2 version that compromises "X" in exchange for "Y".  Are you good enough to take advantage of the edge you can get if you master it?"  That is what made the G2 Raider so much fun.  And I had really looked forward to more like that - not this BS of giving it more health, more speed and room for more and improved internals and items.

 

Yes, I realize you don't HAVE to pay for those with money... but the grind to get to them - a grind you have to go through at a disadvantage - is extremely steep.

You know, this is a very good idea that I wish I had come up with myself. I would give this its own thread in suggestions and ideas.

I think this hits the old dev's goal of the G2 mechs more closely because those other ones offered more variety, but increased difficulty.



#7
ATX22

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These two things, as more time passes with the PC version of Hawken staying the same appear to be becoming more and more mutually exclusive:

 

"I personally vote for leaving everything as it is"

 

"My main concern is that we just need more players,"



#8
teeth_03

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That is not really a "simple" request really...

#9
ARCH3TYP3

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 if I have to choose between new mechs but also starting over and losing everything we've spent money on, versus the "incomplete" product that we have right now, I personally vote for leaving everything as it is.  My main concern is that we just need more players, for more balanced matches, which might just require better marketing, rather than a whole "start over" approach.

I agree...and I posted a similar sentiment back in April.


Edited by ARCH3TYP3, 18 August 2016 - 06:46 PM.

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#10
EM1O

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customization in chassis, weps, items/internals, and PC game's visually stunning effects all are things which are mentioned by consolers that have DLd PC Hawken, and either say this in twitch streams or pop up as noobs in the PC chat.

i'm not sure what could be done, if anything, that wouldn't be more that a crippling smack with a busted nerf hammer, if it went the way of Howken.

(btw: is that pronounced "HOW-ken" or "HOE-ken"?)


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#11
Call_Me_Ishmael

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(btw: is that pronounced "HOW-ken" or "HOE-ken"?)

 

 

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