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Weapons you dislike, and why

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#41
ecaflip

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REV-GL

Too slow of a projectile speed, can't duel with it at all outside of spamming it down a tight corridore.  Projectile speed is too slow to reward direct hits agaist A class mechs when they don't even have to dodge out of their way, blast radius is too small to offset it's sluggish speed.  The GL part of the REV-GL doesn't live up to it's name, it's more of a grenade pooper than a grenade launcher.

 

Assault rifle

Not good at anything, not bad at anything, but every other mech has a better option than the AR.  Being a generalist in this game isn't rewarding and makes the AR outclassed when you specifically tailer your mech to function in one range and one range only.

 

Seeker

Needs a more leniant lock on range, travels slower than a tow even though the mech designed for it is supposed to be a rockets specialist, buff their exclusive weapon to make it actually worth using them.

 

EOC

Alpha strikes are lame, alpha strikers behind stealth in your face are even lamer.

 

RPR

Assault rifle 2.0, only breifly usable on reaper because it has the speed and accuracy bonus to buff it without getting hit, it's absolutely dead weight on sniper due to the fact that snipers have to play the corner camping game to stay alive since they can't out strafe direct fire



#42
CrimsonKaim

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Because sometimes you need adaptability. Sometimes you need specialization.

 

Also, of course some weapons work better than others in certain situations.

 

Used EOC sicne years on my Infil, never changed. Just like Slug Reaper and Heat Scout. Or Flak Brawler and SMC Vanguard. P4P4 Inci and RPR Tech. EOC Raider, always.

 

The only mech I switch weapons on is the PRedator. The weapons are Breacher and EOC. 

 

And when I switch weapons on the mechs mnetioned first, I only switch because I either got bored and want to try something different or just because ... no, there is no other reason.


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#43
Grollourdo

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Tue Vulcan xt .... And the bolt... You know the one on the pred... I don't find it very usefulll XD

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#44
BaronSaturday

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I know, I know. It just bothers me that it feels like the bids went a little too low. Although I have to admit it's a lot easier to carry all day than most. More ammo for the weight, too.

Everything's a compromise it seems.


Aren't they using the Beretta 92fs now? That's quite a side arm. 17 round mag, all steel frame, low jam rates. Beretta certainly wasn't the lowest bidder on that one. The 1911 is cheaper. Never used an m16 so can't comment there.

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#45
Silverfire

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Aren't they using the Beretta 92fs now? That's quite a side arm. 17 round mag, all steel frame, low jam rates. Beretta certainly wasn't the lowest bidder on that one. The 1911 is cheaper. Never used an m16 so can't comment there.


Beretta doesnt hit nearly as hard as the 1911, 9mm vs .45 ammo. Weight wise I find them somewhat similar. Army is looking into replacing the Beretta now too. I think they're looking into some sort of plastic or some alloy to make it even lighter. I don't know about the caliber for the new proposed sidearm though, might be looking into a stronger caliber than the 9mm.

Edited by Silverfire, 03 May 2015 - 06:44 AM.

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#46
FlamingBeaker

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I'm betting they'll stay with 9mm for logistics reasons (NATO), see the history behind the 6.8 SPC (replacement ammo for M16, 25 rnds/mag, way more effective than 5.56, all you need is an upper swap and new mag/reworked old mag) - people in the field loved them, but not NATO standard and complicates the supply chain (keep it simple = every weapon gets fed, multinational forces use same ammo already in stock, etc.), and funding.

 

If they do ever change the sidearm caliber, it'll probably be .40 S&W since it seems to work so well for law enforcement already, and .45 ACP takes up a lot of room in the magazine/grip if double-stacked/staggered (1911 mags are not double stacked).

 

-----

 

Back OT, I'd like the Tech's prestige weapon more if it did more damage (more bursty). Or maybe lower its heat generation more to make it worth using.



#47
CounterlogicMan

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EOC why you don't fly alittle faster??? It would make a huge difference for flying targets. Right now flying is kryptonite to EOC R

 

Charged Heat your splash radius.....why so huge. 17.29m vs 9m not charged 

 

Charged SAARE why your splash so crazy good? 14m (same as GL...which is huge) with 40 min (80 max) damage so if you are 14m away from the impact you will take 40 damage....with a refire rate of .75 seconds with no fear of overheating/running out of heat.

 

MIRV/KLA fix the damn animation to reflect the reload time! Sometimes in the heat of combat all you have to go off of is if your weapon is raised or not.

 

AM-SAR good weapon...not actually semi auto (can't fire it as fast as you can click). when in scope mode the smoke from the muzzle is pretty distracting imo. 

 

SMC, AR don't sound like mech weapons....their firing doesn't sound or feel like you are shooting giant bullets at robots. Pretty disappointing for me. Take for example the vulcan XT, that weapon sounds so bad ass. I feel SMC should generate a little more heat than it currently does :)

 

TOW/GL best secondaries in the game. Much splash/speed/reload/splash + air det. 

 

Hellfire.....tighten the spread of dumb firing slightly

 

reflak...a shotgun....the unique feature of this weapon is useless in its current state...Other than that this weapon is pretty awesome

 

t-32bolt yet another shotgun

 

miniflak yet another shotgun

 

t-32bolt xt yet another shotgun

 

flak yet another shotgun

 

/rant


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#48
ropefish

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tech prestige 



*SCREECHING* 


#49
Fulano2

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I know that the thread is about WEAPONS. But what I most hate is the EMP. It garantees a free kill for your enemy. And there are the suckers that keep throwing EMP at you and running away, just to provoke and irritate you.



#50
Invader_guy

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the freaking Flak Cannon, it is so slow and it over heats so fast...



#51
Shades998

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AM-SAR: I tried to make this weapon work but it's a really annoying to use. I dislike the stupid smoke and the fact it's sort of semi-auto. If I feel masochistic and want to aggravate my carpal tunnel syndrome, this is without a doubt my weapon of choice on the reaper. 

 

Only weapon in the game that promotes the use of macroing software just to make it preform close to other variants. Just bad design imo.


Edited by Shades998, 07 May 2015 - 08:36 AM.


#52
comic_sans

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Wow, welcome back, eca.  Good to see you.

 

Also, against A classes, try only firing your rev GL when they're on the ground and always pair it with a GL when you can.  It's a lot easier to hit A classes when you only have to focus on getting 2 hits with a rev+gl combo.


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#53
crockrocket

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Hellfires, because I'm bad at timing my dodge to avoid them.

 

EOC, because it sucks

 

Weapons that need to charge up. Heat is okay I guess


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#54
System64

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ReFLAK-35 heat generation is too damn high! And that rebound is basically non-existent.

 

Also the PN-223's alleged 68 DPS is a total lie, and the repair torch needs damage and heal buffed. Also the damage should be the same value as the heal because atm it deals less damage points then heal points, they should be the same.

 

MINI FLAK IS OP!!!11


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#55
n3onfx

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and the repair torch needs damage and heal buffed.

 

Wait is this the Ultimate Bad Ideas Thread?


Edited by n3onfx, 19 May 2015 - 03:32 AM.

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#56
Call_Me_Ishmael

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MINI FLAK IS OP!!!11

 

 

Disagree...  generates so much heat.  Hard to face multiple opponents.


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#57
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Seeker's easy autoguiding and SAARE's infinite BOOM makes me think these weapons are the dumbest of the game.


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#58
System64

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Mini Flak damage easily compensates for the heat, reflak on the other hand doesn't.

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#59
Nov8tr

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Well I didn't get a flame thrower but I did get a Incin, pretty close.........woot. LOVE that thing. I might not win but I make em run like frikin crazy.

 

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#60
System64

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The Corsair-KLA's MIRV blast (not the grenade mode) is also better off being hitscan, since the shots automatically disintegrate at a very short distance. The spread is also wide too, so travel time for the MIRV shots isn't necessary.


Edited by System64, 19 May 2015 - 05:06 PM.

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#61
n3onfx

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The Corsair-KLA's MIRV blast (not the grenade mode) is also better off being hitscan, since the shots automatically disintegrate at a very short distance. The spread is also wide too, so travel time for the MIRV shots isn't necessary.

 

It would be OP if it was hitscan, and I'm saying that while I main Raider.


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#62
dorobo

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Heat cannon. I don't like it's heatball slow travel time uncharged and holding button pressed part.


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#63
System64

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Well, if being hitscan would make it OP, reduce the damage, increase the spread or reduce the range.


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#64
DM30

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Well, if being hitscan would make it OP, reduce the damage, increase the spread or reduce the range.


Or, leave it as is. I like that MIRV is a bit challenging. There are enough easy mode hitscan weapons in the game already.
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#65
n3onfx

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Well, if being hitscan would make it OP, reduce the damage, increase the spread or reduce the range.

 

That would make it a flak cannon. There's no need to remove diversity in the game, MIRV hits really hard but is not easy to aim correctly, challenging weapons are good for the game why want to remove the "challenging" part of "challenging weapons"?


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#66
System64

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At least make the switch times on the KLA faster, it's too slow tbh. ReFLAK also needs damage increased and heat reduced.


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#67
n3onfx

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At least make the switch times on the KLA faster.

 

Completely agree on that, I've always found it way too long.


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#68
Hyginos

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At least make the switch times on the KLA faster, it's too slow tbh. ReFLAK also needs damage increased and heat reduced.

 

I wouldn't mind shortening the delay on the Corsair switch, but reducing the Reflak heat or increasing its damage would make it to strong IMO. Right now there is a meaningful style choice between Reflak, T-32, and EOC, but I fear any meaningful buff to Refalk would make it too strong to consider T-32 over it.


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#69
Hayseed

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I can see where some would feel that the Hellfire's would need a buff but I think that they are fine. There main purpose is to counter those A-class + air compressor jerks that you can barely see much less hit. And for that the damage is fine.

 

I do have to agree with others for their disappointment in the Vulcans though. I am disappointed in them too but not because of the wind up but because of the fire rate.

 

Listen to the audio and you would be reminded of a Gatling gun mounted on the side of a chopper spewing copious amounts of lead down on some unlucky fools in Vietnam....now open your eyes and look at the amount of bullets actually coming out of your weapon...the fact that you can visually distinguish the shots is sad enough but when you realize that the fire rate is about two or three shots per second.....well it just doesn't really feel like a Gatling gun



#70
Meraple

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I can see where some would feel that the Hellfire's would need a buff but I think that they are fine. There main purpose is to counter those A-class + air compressor jerks that you can barely see much less hit. And for that the damage is fine.

Hellfires are easy to evade in A classes, even more so with an Air Compressor equipped.


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#71
kasei

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EOC Repeater, I really like using it, but its projectiles are too slow. Only really use it in co-op.

I find all the different assault rifles and shotguns boring.

Edited by kasei, 22 May 2015 - 03:38 PM.


#72
nepacaka

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you should can detonate EOC-P mines while you use boost.


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#73
Crosau

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I very much dislike the Point- D Vulcan. It is basically the single worst perpetrator of sustained damage being a bit overpowered. As someone who likes to play mechs with weapons like T-32 Bolt, Heat Cannon, EOC etc I find it very frustrating when it is so easy for certain Pilots to buy Air Compressor and take the easy way out with the game. I understand their place as easier weapons to easy new players into the combat but there is a point where they are too dominant. 


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#74
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Vulcan, because it needs to spin for a few second, before we can start rape someone..

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#75
6ixxer

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Back OT, I'd like the Tech's prestige weapon more if it did more damage (more bursty). Or maybe lower its heat generation more to make it worth using.

 

Someone playing my tune. The tech needs a more front-loaded weapon. Heat gen is ok. It should fire 3 slugs that hit more like the flak cannon if they all land. 

Longer pause to keep the DPS about the same. I'd let it add a few DPS over the RPR given its shocking cone of fire bloom when you keep firing. Overall it should rechamber a bit quicker than a flak, and do a bit less damage and then it will have utility whether on a tech or another mech.



#76
6ixxer

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 the repair torch needs damage and heal buffed. Also the damage should be the same value as the heal because atm it deals less damage points then heal points, they should be the same.

 

Wait is this the Ultimate Bad Ideas Thread?

 

To perhaps improve on the first point here:

The Helix should be capable of doing more damage at the expense of lower healing.

Tech should be more vampy so that it doesn't suck solo, and doesn't make a deathball ridiculously hard to kill.

 

It might not take it out of the game, but surely that's an improvement?

 

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#77
GreyFa1con

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Not really a weapon, but I hate Scanners.

You do your best to flank. Get into position. Element of surprise is yours?

Nope, the legal wallhack screwed you over.

Edited by GreyFa1con, 20 October 2015 - 12:26 PM.

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#78
Onstrava

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Hellfires: To put it simple...The lockon indicator. Get rid of that and people will stop complaining about the hellfires being to hard to use, hell even I would consider uses them at that point for my tier. That and increase the the take off flight speed for them. The smallest things can change an entire mech for the better.

 

Reg Vulcan: Does alittle too well with sustained damage, roll it back alittle.

 

Everything else....I don't mind. If you like scanners or any other item or weapon, use them. I can deal with it.


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#79
ticklemyiguana

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Also the EOC.  I remember liking it way more "back in the day", this could be because i was playing lower level and it worked better against easier opponents.  May also be because I played a lot of siege pre TPG-S1.  Now its kinda lame.  Make it fly faster or something.

 

EOC why you don't fly alittle faster??? It would make a huge difference for flying targets. Right now flying is kryptonite to EOC R

 

EOC Repeater, I really like using it, but its projectiles are too slow. Only really use it in co-op.

I find all the different assault rifles and shotguns boring.

 
Sooo, I've been using EOC Infil pretty extensively. My conclusion is that the EOC is actually a very easy weapon to hit with. It's difficult to get a full hit with, but you can hit and do damage with it nonetheless - and in 1v1's, it shines.
 
The problem is that the reason it shines in 1v1's is that time is not an issue. On Test Arena - the designated area for one on ones, there are a million opportunities to stick to cover. It's very densely packed, perhaps moreso than any position on any map, and more importantly - as is the nature of 1v1s, you only need cover from a single direction. In any game that's actually a challenge, including DM, time is of the essence - you never know when unidirectional cover will cease to be effective. Your weapon is not capable of taking out multiple mechs without at the bare minimum, significant distraction or a 500 point difference in MMR.
 
One of the strategies I use - and one of the only effective methods of playing infil - is to get behind enemy lines, gain superior intelligence on enemy position, anticipate a moment of weakness, and strike, whereby the first time the enemy is aware of your presence is when you strike. (if you have a team pushing in at the same time, all the better.)
 
However, more often than not, that moment of weakness occurs in the open, and in this case sustained runs the show. Here's where we run into a problem.
 
The maximum fire rate of the EOC R is once every 1.5 seconds. If you're lucky, and the weakness falls on a technician, a scout, or another infiltrator, AND you happen to have a Det or HE charge, AND you land every single shot from your fully charged EOC, as well as landing a direct shot with both your Det and your nade (that's 100% accuracy with all three weapons that you are firing) AND you manage to do this from a distance in which three weapons that deal splash damage won't hurt you - then you'll probably live. (it's a 1 shot kill)
 
Playing EOC infil is fun.
 
However, if you are unlucky enough to be standing in front of ANYTHING with more health than an infiltrator, there's a big chance you'll die.
 
1.) It's difficult to land every shot. It's rare to catch someone repairing or standing still at the exact moment you fire. You usually miss 1 or 2 pucks regardless. Add in the pressure of it being pretty much necessary to pull off if you want to live, and that difficulty can multiply. But, difficulty is one of the reasons Hawken can be so rewarding. My only real gripe with this is that one of those weapons pretty much has to be an item.
 
2.) This is the important one. 1.5 seconds until your next shot - and that shot is going to net you a maximum of 76 damage. It is in most scenarios better to keep on charging through that 1.5 seconds to 3 seconds in the hopes of getting a shot off for 152. Yes, that's correct, the charged and uncharged variants do the same DPS.
However, in 1.5 seconds,
 
a)both the AM SAR and slug reaper without scoping in can do 174 damage to you (181 for the AM SAR), and 195 scoped in (196 for AM SAR). The RPR will net a max of 215 damage in 1.5 seconds - 200 if the reaper does not scope in. This is literally the only mech that after getting a full alpha including an item off you actually want to push.
 
b)a berserker using an assault rifle can do 263 damage to you without the ability. With the ability it can do 303 damage, and that means if you've taken any self damage, you are dead before you can finish the job. Obviously it gets worse with the other primaries.
 
Now those are the mechs that are going to actually be at a DPS disadvantage after you land that initial alpha - and that's conditional on the berserker having an assault rifle and you not taking almost any self damage at all. Those are the mechs that after 1.5 seconds, you will be able to kill them.
Spoiler
 
c) The slug SS is debatable. While you will not be able to kill a fully alpha'd SS in 1.5 seconds, you can kill them in three - while they cannot do the same.
 
On other mechs the damage that can be done in 1.5 seconds varies, but at this point it does not matter - your next shot at 1.5 seconds will never kill them. At 2.5 seconds for the grenade launcher or 3 for the charged EOC, your options grow a little, but almost every competitive mech in the game has a DPS at or above 130, and that's all they need to kill you before you're even able to fire another grenade (lets not forget that if you die before your grenade makes contact with something, it will disappear, soooo there's that  - and all of this is again conditional on a charged EOC or grenade being what you need to finish them off - so seriously - forget about C classes completely if you're in any danger of another enemy engaging during your fight [and of course if survival is imperative].)
 
The EOC puck's speed is not what debilitates it. It's that in combination with the grenade launcher which does 125 damage per direct hit every 2.5 seconds for a total mech DPS of 102 (up from the 2.25 seconds and equivalent damage of the TOW), it is just numerically improbable that you will win your fight against almost every mech. After that initial alpha, chances are you're already short on fuel due to the fuel draining ability and it's frequent necessity of use to get into position, (and while playing a burst mech, mobility is critical) and if you have a maximum of 102 DPS - accessible only after a significant period of time, after your alpha drops, you are caught with your pants down, hard.
Super run on sentence.
 
Speed is not what debilitates it - it is sheer DPS.
 
I can't speak for either the raider or the predator, as I've never been particularly talented with the raider, and the predator has a much more fun accessible primary, and the rocketeer is just derp regardless, but on the infil, using the EOC is like chopping off your hand. In a fun way.
 
EOC needs greater DPS. Period. Preferably in the form of a decrease in reload time - though an increase in shot damage might also work.
 
 
 

 

EOC

Alpha strikes are lame, alpha strikers behind stealth in your face are even lamer.

You sir, are an uncultured donkey.


Edited by ticklemyiguana, 21 October 2015 - 01:52 AM.

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#80
EliteShooter

EliteShooter

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Hellfires.

 

'Nuff said.






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