35 replies to this topic

[LordofNosgoth]

RedVan, on November 24 2012 - 11:29 AM, said:

The_Eldritch_Abomination, on November 24 2012 - 01:27 AM, said:

Well, you can't really say that Adhesive are idiots for "nerfing" the Sharpshooter. They're just gearing it towards it's intended role- as a SNIPER, and not a CQC combatant. One is meant to stay out of the fray and shoot from afar, making heat rate not too much of a problem. In the first 2 CBE, people were running around with the Sharpshooter and using it at close range like the present day Brawler and Scout. It was a f****ing mess.

Yes, people used it close range, and it should be able to be used close range.  However, only good people used it successfully close range.  That is why you rarely see SS with good KDs, and why you don't see many SS in games in general.

From a sniping perspective, it's far too easy for your enemy to get away once they've been hit.  They can just go around a corner and heal up.  If a sniper wanted to chase them, they'd be healed by the time the sniper got close, and/or the sniper would get intercepted.  Essentially, if played like this, the SS would be a strictly KS class, as there is no way you would get any kills against even just mediocre players.

Nobody wants to play a ks class.  That's why the SS needs the ability to hold its own close range.  Which is exactly how it was balanced in CBE2.

^^^ This. ^^^

[Beemann]

LordofNosgoth, on November 24 2012 - 10:55 PM, said:

I'll take you on in any game outside this one as a sniper.

SMNC_ You can be a sniper, and I'll play the clearly much faster assassin, and we'll see how good you are at kiting in a game where snipers are balanced and don't have range+speed

Also, if you should be able to hold your own in a CQC fight AND if you should be able to escape from any fight, isn't that kinda broken as fuzzy bunny_

[LordofNosgoth]

Beemann, on November 24 2012 - 11:16 PM, said:

LordofNosgoth, on November 24 2012 - 10:55 PM, said:

I'll take you on in any game outside this one as a sniper.

SMNC_ You can be a sniper, and I'll play the clearly much faster assassin, and we'll see how good you are at kiting in a game where snipers are balanced and don't have range+speed

Also, if you should be able to hold your own in a CQC fight AND if you should be able to escape from any fight, isn't that kinda broken as fuzzy bunny_

Actually, I never argued for being able to hold one's own in a CQC fight and kite. I'd rather have the kiting with CQC being reliant on aim and skill. Most of the games I play with sniper class are one or the other; having one balances the missing ability of the other.

In this situation, assume that the sniper has the ability to kite, but only has slow firing, high damage per shot weapons. Each and every shot needs to land with incredible accuracy or the sniper dies. The obvious answer to even the most skilled snipers is to arrange an assault on their position so that one or more players can force this to come to pass. If the sniper still somehow survives, hats off to his/her skill; since that most likely won't happen if the numbers are in your favor, kudos go out for your teamwork.

As it stands now, SS doesn't do enough damage per shot nor can move fast enough to be a threat of any kind. In point of fact, they're easy kills. It shouldn't be that way. Ever.

And bring your assassins on. It's gonna be mighty hard to sneak a guy who can pop you in the face from the map distance with scary accuracy. But hey, bring it brother. Good times are sure to ensue.

[Beemann]

You..... you've never played SMNC have you

[LordofNosgoth]

Beemann, on November 24 2012 - 11:41 PM, said:

You..... you've never played SMNC have you

Super Monday Night Combat_ Beyond briefly testing it before the official release_ F*** no. A buddy tried to get me into it, so we quickly demo'd it, but it's pretty trashy IMHO. I never liked it.

Sorry, didn't see you listed SMNC in your OG post. Negative Ghost Writer. Pick a different game.

[Beemann]

LordofNosgoth, on November 24 2012 - 11:46 PM, said:

Beemann, on November 24 2012 - 11:41 PM, said:

You..... you've never played SMNC have you

Super Monday Night Combat_ Beyond briefly testing it before the official release_ F*** no. A buddy tried to get me into it, so we quickly demo'd it, but it's pretty trashy IMHO. I never liked it.

Sorry, didn't see you listed SMNC in your OG post. Negative Ghost Writer. Pick a different game.

Sniper isn't best at everything_ Must be trash

[AsianJoyKiller]

LordofNosgoth, on November 24 2012 - 10:55 PM, said:

So, I'll tell you what: I'll take you on in any game outside this one as a sniper.

LordofNosgoth, on November 24 2012 - 11:46 PM, said:

Pick a different game.

Excuse me while I die from laughter.

[145154151164145]

Dude.... the way you are talking and explaining the short comings of the SS point to you not being able to play the class well.  The patch fixed alot of the problems the original debuff caused.  It is VERY possible to cqc (though not as effectively as before) B and C classes.  A is still a bit of a problem when used by skilled players, but SS still has more than enough mobility to last in cqc.  I've taken rocketeers, bruisers, even brawlers in point blank toe to toe duels. Trick is to get right in their face and just keep dancing around.  Predict their movements and scope and shoot where they will dodge. In fact, the sabot is now more accurate unscoped so using it in cqc is possible now compared to only point blank shots. Using advanced shield tactics helps too, make them try to enter the shield with you, dodge sideways, forward, 180 ,and back in and shoot em in the back.  They will probably have unwittingly just stepped out of the shield and now they will have to repeat trying to get you or get shot to death (which will happen if played well anyway) I think you just need more practice with the class before judging it so harshly.

also

LordofNosgoth, on November 24 2012 - 05:10 AM, said:

1) QS'ing is not a CoD thing; it actually started in CS:S and was perfected in other games (but certainly not CoD; it's always been trash in CoD).

Source_ its been around since, like, the earliest iteration of counter strike...  And quick scoping in this game is not needed as much because mechs are very slow to change direction, so unless your target already sees you and knows that you plan to pop out so they can escape, the slight scope delay is a minor inconvenience.

Edited by 145154151164145, November 25 2012 - 12:17 AM.

[Beemann]

It depends on what you consider quickscoping

I mean, I'm pretty sure Starsiege was cool with scoping in and shooting instantly, and it's probably not the only 90's game with scopes, long range rifles, and the ability to make use of both as fast as humanly possibke
it's just that nobody really cared until later

[145154151164145]

Yea, maybe I should say CS coined the term "quick scope" more than invented the tactic.  Well at least I never hear it used in other games before that.

[LordofNosgoth]

Beemann, on November 24 2012 - 11:55 PM, said:

Sniper isn't best at everything_ Must be trash

Negative. In most games Sniper is generally the worst class unless your aim is beyond outstanding. Mine generally is, so I tend to do pretty well. Excuse me if I disdain games where Sniper's not even remotely viable as an option.

I didn't like SMNC because it didn't appeal to me as a whole. Class balance had nothing to do with it. I said pick another game mostly because I don't have that one and have no intention of getting it anytime soon... or ever.

CS:S was the first iteration of the series I played. Prior to that, I was - I must sadly admit - a console kiddie like the rest. That being the case, CSS was my first introduction to QS'ing (taught to me by other players). When CoD:MW was released, I enjoyed it like the rest but found QS'ing to be kinda terribad. I didn't start disliking CoD games until each new one released was just a carbon-copy clone of the last. It left a bad taste in my mouth for the series.

Generally, I like running assault missions with teammates; I tend to be agressive as a player. But if the situation calls for it, playing Sniper support isn't beyond my skill-set. I've made the argument before, and I suppose I'll have to make it again: Snipers support their team by one-shotting anything in their line of sight. In an instance where the target is too heavily armored to one-shot, even at range, the damage output should be high enough to make them back off and/or take cover. With the current incarnation of SS, this isn't the case. Snipers should also either be able to handle CQC with some viability or kite like a fuzzy bunny (certainly not both).

@ AJK: 'Tis better to die from laughter than from boredom or frustration, which is what the current version of this game inspires. You've started enough posts about similar balance issues that clearly show you feel the same.

[AsianJoyKiller]

LordofNosgoth, on November 25 2012 - 12:31 AM, said:

I said pick another game mostly because I don't have that one and have no intention of getting it anytime soon... or ever.

It's free.
Unless you're ridiculously low on hard drive space, there's no reason you can't pick it up, at least temporarily.

[NBShoot_me]

LordofNosgoth, on November 24 2012 - 07:06 AM, said:

Fantus_Longhorn, on November 24 2012 - 06:58 AM, said:

LordofNosgoth, on November 23 2012 - 11:48 PM, said:

3) After it getting posted by me 3 times and dozens of times by others, the f***ing game will still fail to launch if there's more than one monitor detected. It fails to create D3D9 device. Every. Single. Time. What_ Did you just ignore it_

Edited for tone by author.

I've got two monitors and have not had any issues at all. Since you haven't posted anything regarding your specs there's nothing anyone can even begin to suggest for you.
A good start would be to run 'dxdiag' and attach the results as a .txt file to your post so that people can have a look at what you're running.

You should read the other posts by the same title. I've posted my specs more than once. And since 'dxdiag' is good for exactly squat outside of a hardware fault, your suggestion is not precisely useful.

i7 3770K @ Stock Clocks
Z77X Chipset
2X RadeonHD 7850's in CFX @ Stock Clocks
16GB RAM @ 1333MHz
2X 64GB SATA III in RAID 0
2X Acer 23" 100,000,000:1 DCR (Primary Monitor in DVI; secondary in Mini-Display port)
1X Polaroid 32" 720p HDTV via HDMI
2TB WD HDD
1TGB WD HDD
3X 250GB WD HDD
Samsung Superwrite DVD-RW+DL Lightscribe
LITEON BD ROM
Antec 900W PSU

Average CPU Temp: 32*C; Load 48-53* C
Average Sys Temp: 83* F

Every other game, rendering algorithm, 3D Editor, compiler, Photo/Video editor or program of any kind runs just fine. I don't have this problem with even HMS's bug-ridden, poorly designed games. This issue only comes up with this game.

Now that we've eliminated the "possibility" that it's a hardware fault, let's try actually looking at the programming, shall we_

Hmm.. I've got an older gaming setup with an AMD Phenom CPU and Geforce 260 card using a dual monitor setup.  Not saying it's your box, but I've not had this problem.  I wonder Hawken doesn't like a crossfire setup, or one with an intel CPU present_  Bah, that's probably something only the devs can find let alone solve.

[LordofNosgoth]

Everyone who's responded experiencing the same issue is also running SLI or CFX with multi-monitor setups. I'm guessing the culprit is found within that particular kind of configuration.

And yes, it would be a conundrum for the devs to figure out.

[NBShoot_me]

Yeah, sounds like it, I only have a single dual head card.  I wonder if people with the dual GPU, single card setups are also affected.  I don’t even experience the crash to desktop problem, which, I wonder if that could also be related.

[ReachH]

Dreizehn, on November 24 2012 - 05:54 PM, said:

Sharpshooters are deadly with close ranged partners watching out for them. Keep the hair off your back, pursue unfinished jobs. Get your share in both assists and kills.

People need to stop putting the SS in some kind of ideal 1v1 scenario.

THIS SO FVCKING HARD. Thank god there are still some experienced players to stem the tide of SSnerf QQ. The SS is still the most godly mech with one of the best skill ceilings, simply just for the fact that they are the only class able do guaranteed burst damage while kiting behind cover - even at medium range. ​Add to this the ability to take long range shots-of-opportunity and you have an amazing killer in the right hands.