2 replies to this topic

[ShadowWarg]

Silverfire made me think about tuning after reading his resent post.

Spoiler

Silverfire, on January 16 2014 - 06:25 PM, said:

Doesn't get rid of the problem of optimal builds.  It doesn't matter if you have all 30 points to deal with, some tuning options are simply either absolutely too important to ignore or just advantageous over other options.

This is why you don't see Grenadiers without maxed Cooling Units, or Raiders without maxed Boost Thrusters. It just doesn't make any sense but to max these out when these are clearly more advantageous than say, Heatsinks or Radar.  These optimal builds often lead to stale, pointless customization among higher tier players.  Wacky builds just simply don't grant anyone any remote advantage over someone who is using particular optimal builds.  People will always fiddle around with the values and decide on the best statistically optimal build for particular mechs, meaning other builds will not nearly be as effective as it could be; mechs will not be living up to their potential any other way.  It's not even about point differentials in levels in my opinion. It's about making customization meaningful and purposeful, and this means removing one that was hardly effective.

This is just a thought, but maybe one of the reasons why these "optimal builds" are so much more effective rather than being flexible and allowing for more verity for player developed sub classes of the mechs, is because the tuning options are directly connected to the mech's key stats such as armor, hydraulics, weapon's loader, etc. Meaning that the current turning system can negate many of drawbacks that are built into a class by design.

Maybe if tuning effected some flat arbitrary, universal or unique, aspect of the mech, that was more of a side grade function rather than an upgrade, maybe tuning could be reintroduced in a different way. Kind of like how a driver can tune a car so the gas, brake, steering, mirrors, and so on feel just right for them and them alone (I know there are deeper things that get tuned but I don't feel like looking them up). Or how a gunman tweaks the trigger or can swap it out for something lighter or heavier. Although these might be extremely bad examples.

Spoiler

If I had to choose an in game example of how this could work it would be the GL. There is a small time frame in which manual detonation is overwritten by firing even though the first grenade fired hasn't been detonated yet. Tuning for this would be changing how long before that firing override actives, giving you the option of more control over your manual detonation without actually changing the default fire rate or the time it takes for the grenade to detonate on its own.

In general models of a particular machine are all the same, but when you get a machine you like to tweak how it feels so it is most comfortable to you (much like changing the mouse sensitivity). If those elements could be isolated and applied to mechs individually maybe that is what tuning could be. Not about performance but about feeling of control.

Anyway, that is my random thought.

[Cannonaire]

I do think that removing tuning points is the best decision at this point. That said, I can't stand playing my bruiser without my specific tuning options. I doubt they are optimal, but I have 8 in Weapons Loader, 10 in Heatsinks, and 6 each in Generator and Air Dynamics. I made this build almost exclusively for guarding AA in siege, but I just hate how the thing feels without this very specific setup. This sounds like what you're talking about.

[HugeGuts]

At this point, I think tuning would only work for secondary class features like items and internals. Weapon tuning is technically coming out with the Fire Fighter. It has one primary weapon, but multiple pre tuned versions. Its primary weapon also "tunes" secondary weapon performance. I expect every class will eventually be similar.

As for item and internal tuning, it would require many changes. Rather than having multiple slot strength versions of the same equipment, slot sizes would indicate how big of an effect on game play the item or internal has. Here are examples, including examples of tuning options:

Items
1 slot - Stationary deployables. Strength vs. area of effect.
2 slots - Instant launch. Strength vs. cool down.
3 slots - Mobile deployables. Strength vs. simultaneous deployments.

Internals
1 slot - Passive stat boost. Base stat boost has no downsides. Increasing the base stat boost puts a decrease on another stat - i.e. armor vs. speed.
2 slots - Conditional stat boost. Base stat boost has no downsides. Increasing the base stat boost puts a limited use on the effect - i.e. increased damage deflection while boosting vs. not having an effect timer and cool down on deflection.
3 slots - Ability. Strength vs. effect timer.

Edited by HugeGuts, January 17 2014 - 09:07 PM.