24 replies to this topic

[Xacius]

Since the patch, I've been confused about why the TOW has a 0.25s faster refire rate than the Grenade Launcher.  

In recent play sessions, I've found the TOW much easier to use.  The explosives feathering hit the GL hard, and it seems that the speed on the TOW makes direct hits easier.  

Why, then, is the TOW cooldown timer 2.25s compared to the GL cooldown timer of 2.5s_   The TOW reload animation doesn't even match its 2.25s timer, making me believe that it's either an oversight or just a bug.  

IMO, since they both do the same damage, the cooldowns should be similar.

[Sylhiri]

The GL has more utility, being able to bounce it off walls and arc your shots makes the slightly higher CD a good tradeoff. I prefer the GL over the TOW for this reason.

[Xacius]

Travel time is a huge factor, especially in open engagements.  TOW is better in general.

If the GL was a bit faster, I could see the longer cooldown being ok.

[DerMax]

Sylhiri, on February 13 2014 - 01:16 AM, said:

The GL has more utility, being able to bounce it off walls and arc your shots makes the slightly higher CD a good tradeoff. I prefer the GL over the TOW for this reason.

No. It is much more difficult to hit opponents with a grenade because of its projectile speed. I think the TOW is significantly more powerful than the GL atm.

[FenixStryk]

I wouldn't mind similar CDs, although I will admit I got very used to the GL being the faster reload, slower projectile with arc, bounce and a touch more splash. I'm not sure what they were driving at with the changes by making it reload slower, and with my current perspective on the game and the temporal proximity of the Incinerator it is not entirely likely that I will try relearning the TOW by dropping GL habits any time soon.

I am a big fan of the arc and bounce on this weapon, but with TTKs as they are I am left to wonder exactly how much influence that extra 0.25s has. If I didn't know any better, I would say it is adding 0.25s to every kill compared to TOW equivs -- or, around an 8% increase.

[EliteShooter]

GL is fine IMHO ... LUV IT !

[Umbre]

I'd like the TOW to have a slower reload time for the sake of making it less spammy.

[Nept]

I know you're comparing current numbers with your experiences in earlier builds, but I have a hard time calling anything with a 2.25 second cooldown "spammy" - especially in a faster-paced shooter.

[DerMax]

I personally would like to see the GL's projectile speed increased by ~15% + cooldown decreased to 2.40 seconds.

[Sylhiri]

DerMax, on February 13 2014 - 01:41 AM, said:

No. It is much more difficult to hit opponents with a grenade because of its projectile speed. I think the TOW is significantly more powerful than the GL atm.

I never had a problem, most likely because I use the GL a lot more then the TOW. TOW has been overshadowed by the GL in the recent patches, this is their attempt at trying to differentiate between the two.

[HugeGuts]

Speaking of cool downs, what's up with even shorter secondary weapon cool downs_ Before, primary weapons did most of the work while secondary weapons worked as softeners and finishers. With the new TTK and shorter cool down, it's the other way around. Also, with current movement speeds, 2.25 seconds is enough to spam and lockdown corridors. I'm sure the easiest area denial the game has seen contributes to the camping/sniper increase.

Edited by HugeGuts, February 14 2014 - 01:14 AM.

[Muffintrumpet]

TOW is better than the GL now in all situations bar corner-humping
(and even then the difference is minimal)

TOW & GL seemed to be in a good place, relative to each other, pre-Feb
I'm not sure why the devs thought it was wise to start mucking about with what wasn't broken at such a late stage

[v009]

I don't know why they did this either. Although the GL has differences as people have mentioned already, they do same damage. More than that there are other secondaries that need to be looked into more. cough.. Corsair K... cough

[_war]

The GL moves slower and fires at an arch. Why do they (devs) think this is adequate_

[Elladan]

as for my current experience I'm doing much better with a nades (GL) thatn TOW - maybe that's somekind of issue of mech atached to it

but atm I repsect the rule "best nade is nade into a face" and as I already want to go lose with hostile TOW looses their advantages to me....  btw nades are good when fighting with a turreted guy - with a little of well using You can launch nade in a way that it actually hit guy in his back so it will do much more dmg then that TOW in face


(and you can bump nade to hit a guy that is around corner without going into his line of sight

[Muffintrumpet]

corner-humping is still the preserve of the GL but the TOW is no slouch at this either
the TOW is a secondary with no weaknesses whereas now the GL is just downright inferior in all instances bar corner-humping, and even then the differences are marginal

it's just as easy to score rear hits on fail^h^h^h^hturret mode heavies from the front with airburst TOWs

[Elladan]

Muffintrumpet, on February 17 2014 - 05:03 AM, said:

corner-humping is still the preserve of the GL but the TOW is no slouch at this either
the TOW is a secondary with no weaknesses whereas now the GL is just downright inferior in all instances bar corner-humping, and even then the differences are marginal

it's just as easy to score rear hits on fail^h^h^h^hturret mode heavies from the front with airburst TOWs

doing it with a tow would require you to fly well aim well while flying and yet having some wall behind the c-class but not to close....

or just much more skill than "as easy"

I still like gl more

[Muffintrumpet]

you don't need to fly, just aim a tad high
and the aiming and airburst timing requirement are the same as with the GL
you don't need walls

honestly, if you see someone in Turret mode they deserve to be taught the error of their ways

the GL lost a lot of effectiveness in the unique selling point areas vs the TOW in this patch, and I still don't understand why - the TOW was already the easiest secondary in the game and it didn't need to be further improved
(relatively speaking)

[Elladan]

Muffintrumpet, on February 18 2014 - 09:05 AM, said:

you don't need to fly, just aim a tad high
and the aiming and airburst timing requirement are the same as with the GL
you don't need walls

honestly, if you see someone in Turret mode they deserve to be taught the error of their ways

lol with turette vanguard being they teacher

btw I've seen some folks who tried to get TOW hits marked on my backs when I was turretted (actually on my vanguard I'm turetted most the time) mybe distance was an issue or sth but they've got....

actualy those were wasted TOWs

maybe my opinion would differs alot if vanguard had TOW instead of GL cause atm I haven't yet TOW with good mech for me attached to it

[Muffintrumpet]

airbursting TOWs behind Turrets from the front is something that any half-way proficient TOW user will be able to accomplish regularly