23 replies to this topic

[Flyingdebris]

aka please good sirs, don't go the straight generic HP route

Idears...

A simple route

BF style health, aka multiplier system.
Shots to a mech's frontal armor deal the least damage, shots to the sides and legs do medium damage,  rear and top do the most damage.

Effect, encourages players to position themselves advantageously in a fight, discourages players from exposing rear armor, making running from a fight risky.  Gameplay still fast n furious, still retains straight HP count, but forces player to aim for weakpoints while guarding own.

A little meatier.

Same as above, but with possible mechanical failures at low health.
i.e. as health decreases odds of getting some kind of critical hit increases.  Critical hits could be from a long list of potential debuffs like weapon jams, faster overheating, your cameras damaged, slower movement, less jumpjet fuel, slower movement, radar messed up, etc etc.  Gameplay still fast, players consider weakpoints, and also have to deal with damaged components when they are messed up, adding urgency and elements of surprise to a fight.  Can still retain single HP count, but requires visual notices of component damage.

Meatier still

Seperate damage locations, legs, arms, with individual health.  Also each location has weaker areas.  Torso-rear/ Legs -joints /arms-the weapons

Each location has its own set of potential crit failures as location health worsens.  Guns jam, get inaccurate, go offline, fire more slowly, etc as they get messed up.  Legs can start dropping in speed as they worsen, landings become harsher, turning becomes more difficult, aiming is affected more, Torso, jump jets can get messed up and lose power, vision is compromised, cockpit readouts go offline, etc.  Technically you only have 3 health bars to keep track of, and just a bunch of things that can go wrong.  Game still mostly  keeps fast pace, but getting mangled in a fight carries a harsh price until you can repair.  Players still forced to jockey for position in a fight, protect their weak areas, and manage their damage, but with more emphasis on aim.

Full blown simmy, aka Filet Mignon aka this mech sim geek's wet dream
Torso has frontal, rear, top, and L/R side armor handled individually.
L/R leg handled individually
L/R arms handled inividually
A central cockpit as the "core" of the unit.
certain pieces of external equipment can get damaged.

Players have to blast all the way through any one of the torso armor faces to get at the juicy pilot center of the mech.  Players are encouraged to try and keep damaged faces away from their opponents in a fight to spread incoming fire around as much as possible.  No generic health other that for the cockpit.  Various critical system failures can happen randomly as parts get more damaged, or as certain pieces of external equipment get blasted off, antennas, sensors, jump jet nozzles. etc.  Combat gets slowed down considerably as peiople have to be a lot more careful, but eh, not like thats necessarily a bad thing.

On a side note

Unlimited ammo = eeeehhhh, what we need is limited ammo and glorious ammo cookoff fires when that ammo eventually gets hit.

[Zephirus]

Flyingdebris said:

A little meatier.

Same as above, but with possible mechanical failures at low health.
i.e. as health decreases odds of getting some kind of critical hit increases.  Critical hits could be from a long list of potential debuffs like weapon jams, faster overheating, your cameras damaged, slower movement, less jumpjet fuel, slower movement, radar messed up, etc etc.  Gameplay still fast, players consider weakpoints, and also have to deal with damaged components when they are messed up, adding urgency and elements of surprise to a fight.  Can still retain single HP count, but requires visual notices of component damage.

I think a neat system would be a combination of having an overall classic HP count with locational based systems failure/recovery.  Basically, you have 100 HP, as you get damaged in battle there's an increasing probability of various systems failing (ideally based on where you're getting hit).  The devs have mentioned in interviews--I think--that they don't like being able to disable parts because it gives a major advantage to the first shooter.  To balance this, then, I propose a recovery system--a la modern shooters--where taking cover allows your mech to repair damage (fire supression, engaging redundant/backup systems, etc.).  Basically, taking cover lets you heal up to full or near-full functionality, but you're HP is still low to reflect the fact that you've taken damage.  Thus the probability of incurring more failures from engaging an enemy is high.  I think it would be a plausible system that would allow for a degree of realism while still not giving a massive first-mover advantage, and encourages people to duck in and out of the fight.

[Flyingdebris]

actually i think self repairs are already in, i think they initiate when you shut down.

[JackDandy]

That idea seems pretty badass. I really like that positional damage thing.

Since the mechs aren't that nimble, it'll be more crucial to the battle.

[psych0black]

Anyone every think of chip/burn damage_ Weapons that inflict damage over a period of time like some kind of burn effect would be awesome and add an interesting element to combat.

[aethernet]

I think that any status effect should be temporary. Like, the overheating. You are effected for a while, but then your systems react and compensate.

[The_Silencer]

I'd be also cool with only temporary penalization events during the battles.

For example, imagine a server with a King of the Hill player which is being visited by players into 1vs1 duels/combats. Would be pretty unfair to have the champion player going wreck as he is fighting Vs. the new players joining in... Do we agree on this_.

[aethernet]

The_Silencer said:

I'd be also cool with only temporary penalization events during the battles.

For example, imagine a server with a King of the Hill player which is being visited by players into 1vs1 duels/combats. Would be pretty unfair to have the champion player going wreck as he is fighting Vs. the new players joining in... Do we agree on this_.

That's just it. I prefer a game where skill determines the winner. I've played one too many games that are pay2win or with terribly overpowered builds.

[deathelm]

Flying-debris' Well well..

A fan of any mech game, I am not surprised to see you on these boards'

You proven a valid point. Perhaps if I shoot one of your guns off with a magnetic bullet you be scree-min differently.

All the same really. I find this game to have very similar boring gameplay melee type as I loved during my Starsiege tribes years back in 1997. Jetbacks Rockets miniguns you name it,

INFACT if you took away this games good graphics, you be left with a Starsiege tribes 1997 Gameplay.

[deathelm]

Not to mention all video games today, have dozens of military vehicles. Aircraft included. I dont know. I honestly think this hawken game dosnt have it together yet. Its still really shallow, As dose how many people are registered on the forum, not very much. So much for publicity.
It would be almost reasonable to actually start advertising online sometime soon, as the market video game economy advances rapidly.

[aethernet]

@deathelm

It's called the software development life cycle. Google it.

[Flyingdebris]

@deathhelm
magnetic bullet_

you lost me  :_

[deathelm]

Aether said:

@deathelm

It's called the software development life cycle. Google it.

then get workin on it champ

[Dahdah]

deathelm said:

Flying-debris' Well well..

A fan of any mech game, I am not surprised to see you on these boards'

You proven a valid point. Perhaps if I shoot one of your guns off with a magnetic bullet you be scree-min differently.

All the same really. I find this game to have very similar boring gameplay melee type as I loved during my Starsiege tribes years back in 1997. Jetbacks Rockets miniguns you name it,

INFACT if you took away this games good graphics, you be left with a Starsiege tribes 1997 Gameplay.

Is there any point to this post other than being critical of an unfinished product_ Apparently you have the uncanny ability to look at 3:00 of youtube footage and predict the ultimate outcome of a new entry into the mech genre. Bravo sir, bravo.

[Dahdah]

deathelm said:

Not to mention all video games today, have dozens of military vehicles. Aircraft included. I dont know. I honestly think this hawken game dosnt have it together yet. Its still really shallow, As dose how many people are registered on the forum, not very much. So much for publicity.
It would be almost reasonable to actually start advertising online sometime soon, as the market video game economy advances rapidly.

Now you're just making yourself look silly. You do realize this is a MECH game, with large robots, right_ Not just another military-style shooter, but a venue for robots to shoot other robots. If that is your definition of 'shallow', I'm guessing you need to just move along to some other game-type, and not bother with the amateur trolling here. Your attempts to sound psuedo-intellectual are not working.

[Dahdah]

Back on point (sorry I hate trolls), as much as I'd love a slice of the OP's juicy filet, I'd settle for a nice T-bone, with some damage infered by graphical elements (cracks/smoke/etc.) and maybe some changes in capabilities (slower speed/rotation/weapon reload). This is a pretty small dev team, and what they have accomplished so far looks pretty nice. I 'd hate to see them get bogged down with details that might delay a release. Gotta save ome upgrades for Hawken II  

Also, I believe I saw in another thread that the dev's are looking at some of the suggestions about both custo's and damage mechanics that are mentioned here and elsewhere. I guess we stay tuned!

[legionwolff1]

Oooh I like this. This would make combat very technical. very nice thoughts. It would also be nice if more expensive parts, devices, or weapons had hit boxes. And it would cost money to repair those parts.

[Jyork]

Ooh! So, along the lines of pinpoint damage.

Say you shoot at your targets legs. This slows them down while you go for the kill. They end up shooting your weapons. Now you can't fire as quickly and you run away. After you're gone, your enemy's legs "borrow" health from their other parts, and, while lowering the total mech hp, allows your enemy to regain their normal mobility.

Ie, temporary effects on specific mech parts/systems.

[Naraklok]

Shooting your targets legs_ Slow them down_ Meh.

[Jyork]

Well, from the videos I've seen, I don't see any reason to put in the selective damage idea. But, if some sort of it was to actually be implemented, I think I'd like to see it having only temporary effects.