50 replies to this topic

[Provi]

Ashfire908 said:

Fyi, I voted for Valve and it got shifted to Ubisoft when you reordered it. (I revoted though)

Thanks, that's how I hope this will get back on track.

[HardBaller]

I picked Sony (SOE). Yeah ok big horror story right now but nothing that couldn't happen to any other company. And give the size of the company personal experience and all the titles related plus options to go cross platform in the future if you'd ever wanted to i think it's the best choice. Microsoft would also have the crossplatform side but working for them well it's better to keep the forum clean .

I'd never go with valve though. Aside from the big cut they take on every copy sold. If they are ever attacked like for example SOE right now and others in the past you'd have lost a lot more then just some records. Also i know a lot of gamers and mecha fans that still prefer to have a real hardcopy of the games they own. I especially am proud of the collection of games that i own and have collected over the years. No way you can do that if you go steam. (i know valve doesn't have to be steam but in all fearness that's the side they'll push to).

So given the long history, size, net worth and constant growth and innovation. And added to that my personal experience and experiences from other game dev's that i know that have worked for/with them i pick Sony.

edit: fergot to mention that with sony you could do as a dl and boxed. Choice is there that's important.

[NAVY MARCOM]

No clue where you've been but those, ' records' include credit card data, pretty hard to loose more then that. SONY is not concerned with the end user, even now some people are just getting their formal notices about the breech and what has been stolen.  SONY's answer to this as an apology to the customers that now have to change all their account info, change bank account information, change credit cards, get insurance to protect them from identity theft... is to offer one month of free plus service.. So SONY's solution is to give each person effected the virtual, ( as this is something that is not really costing them anything ),  equivalent of $4.16... wow. Valve may have information stored but you can bet your ass that they, along with just about every other online service that stores personal data has been upgrading their security systems ten fold.

[HardBaller]

I've been here. Following SOE every step of the way. hell i've been with SOE for as long as it's been here. My records are among then as well. But that doesn't mean i'll get biast and makes it impossible for me to have a neutral overview.

Like you said they may have ten folded their security. But why did they do that_ Because of what happend to SOE. If they where the ppl attacked you would have said the exact same thing but for SOE instead of valve. But in te interest of keeping this topic for what it's ment i prefer any other personal opinions to what i wrote on that direct to an pm.

As a last note i do want to say that what's been "out there" right now are mere ideas of how sony will handle their costumers after they've dealt with it. Nothing is set in stone yet and most of it is pure speculation. Also a reason why i didn't mention it before when i wrote my post. Speculation and rumors are useless. Also don't forget that there already have been many breaches in steam/valve in the past. There have been many claims from hackers but also victims of this. So don't make them look holy when all you see in a shell and not the reality inside.

[Kaliops]

I wonder what they did with Project Offset.  Was it ever playable, or always an engine.  That's part of what excites me about the Hawken team, I was ready to jump on the Offset project, but then it went on and on and on and blipped out.

[HardBaller]

Kaliops said:

I wonder what they did with Project Offset.  Was it ever playable, or always an engine.  That's part of what excites me about the Hawken team, I was ready to jump on the Offset project, but then it went on and on and on and blipped out.

Intel bought the company in '08 and cancelled the game development of project offset last year. Don't know what the original guys are up to now but they moved to a studio called Fractiv LLC if i'm right.

[NAVY MARCOM]

HardBaller said:

As a last note i do want to say that what's been "out there" right now are mere ideas of how sony will handle their costumers after they've dealt with it. Nothing is set in stone yet and most of it is pure speculation. Also a reason why i didn't mention it before when i wrote my post. Speculation and rumors are useless. Also don't forget that there already have been many breaches in steam/valve in the past. There have been many claims from hackers but also victims of this. So don't make them look holy when all you see in a shell and not the reality inside.

Actually there's weeks so far of how things have been handled and there doesn't seem to be any changes in that even after the UK, US and Can. have all filed class actions against them. There reply; " it was ' insert convenient hacker group who won't let us bully them' fault ". Seriously, they must not watch allot of bad cop drama's because that's just way overplayed and the proof is laughable. I'm biased because I've been playing video games and been around the biz longer then you've been alive. I've seen what SONY and the industry used to be and what they've become; large, arrogant, self involved and money grubbing. Small companies must still be oriented towards the customer, must satisfy the customer to keep them, the Internet D2D companies like steam are so competitive they have to treat the customer, at least somewhat like an individual entity and not a number with money attached to it. This is not to say the Steam is perfect in anyway, their multiplayer anti cheat system is a joke..

[Provi]

Anyone have a perspective on Valve's promotional and advertizing ability_

And how about the other publishers_

[NAVY MARCOM]

Actually there is one publisher that IS very good and has launched the likes of Blizzard, Bioware and Treyarch..  Interplay, they aren't large but they are ethical and fair to both developers and gamers..

[Provi]

NAVY MARCOM said:

Actually there is one publisher that IS very good and has launched the likes of Blizzard, Bioware and Treyarch..  Interplay, they aren't large but they are ethical and fair to both developers and gamers..

I considered adding them, but didn't for that reason.

Anyone second me replacing Sega with Interplay then_

[Porcupine]

HardBaller said:

I'd never go with valve though. Aside from the big cut they take on every copy sold. If they are ever attacked like for example SOE right now and others in the past you'd have lost a lot more then just some records. Also i know a lot of gamers and mecha fans that still prefer to have a real hardcopy of the games they own. I especially am proud of the collection of games that i own and have collected over the years. No way you can do that if you go steam. (i know valve doesn't have to be steam but in all fearness that's the side they'll push to).

I'm a game collector myself and I prefer physical copies too, but I kinda like Steam because I have most of my indie games there, these games usually only come out in digital form, so it's cool to have a place with my indie games all nice and organized with automatic updates, achievements, news and all those details. Also you can get some nice deals from the frequent Steam sales.

[HardBaller]

You know i won't say that i never used steam. I have (CoD:BO) so it's not like i'm just talking about something i've only seen once or twice by accident. I really get what you mean with having one place where you can get your indie games. But you don't need a money grabber like valve for it. EA and Ubi are to me some example that self supported stores also work. As for the discounts. Putting that 1 out of 10 aside that really makes a difference they aren't much cheaper. Just look for example at the witcher 2. 10% discount. I have at least 5 stores where i can buy the boxed premium edition for less then you buy the normal edition at steam. That's inc. delivery chargers if you want to order them instead of getting them.

I'm not say that steam isn't good. I just don't think Valve would be good for a starting company. To many grey area where a big profit making machine like valve could screw them over.

As for interplay. I realy like them but seeing what happend to the companies that grew out of their reach (blizz, bio etc.) it scares me to think that would happen again. But in all fairness they are a great steppingstone.

[NAVY MARCOM]

Allot of companies did survive and flourish beyond interplay as well.. I would suspect that it would come down to how a contract was written up. Unlike the EA/Activision looney-toons hr. most companies do preside by contracts or end up in the national bowling for dullards league, ( like the above mar-oons)..

I miss Microprose and New World computing..

One thing I just remembered, one of the first really big hit sim games was the Wing Commander series, developed by Origin and published by Origin... they did this is a much harder environment as well.. this was back when the internet was using something called mosaic and most people were on 9600k modems dialling up the local BBS to get a portal to the internet. a very non graphical internet at that. their ad work was done via print in gaming magazines, that's it. But the concept and game play was so original and good that it went, at that time, magazine viral.

Today, with the reviews that have been thrown this games way on G4 and on game sites like IGN, a few good viral you tube ads and a really HOT DEMO, I bet they could almost do everything but the actual retail end in volume themselves.

[JackDandy]

I think I'd rather they stay independent.

[LordPorkSword]

If ya can maintain a good cashflow, stay independent and distribute via steam!

Via steam I think games are royalty free until you hit $50k so you can get going without having to pay royalties straight up.  Dunno what % valve take after 50k though.

[OdysseusVA]

Bethesda Softworks

Not on the poll, but gets my vote.

[Provi]

OdysseusVA said:

Bethesda Softworks

Not on the poll, but gets my vote.

So you want ZeniMax Media up there as well_

[NullEleven]

Have to vote for Valve, never been disappointed by them (that I can think of at least).  If Activision hadn't become part of Blizzard I would vote for them because of MechWarrior 2, but Blizzard is the AIDS of publishers.

[Maligkno]

at the end it dosent matter wich publisher we prefer, the developer its gona chose the publisher it serves their interest better, i never ever tough bungie will make a deal whit the evil activision  and evryone was suprised.

[Provi]

Adding EPIC Games.

EPIC is another plausible publisher since Hawken is made from Unreal Development Kit.