53 replies to this topic

[PlagueDoctor]

Its not bursty, It can't be sustainy due to it overheating in 2 seconds (if you're using hellfires) It's supposed to be the high damage, high heat item, which would reward accuracy, but currently, the low damage, low heat weapon manages to do better_ The miniflak heats up slower (While also having higher DPS)_ literally everything about the Vulcan is terrible.

E: doesn't stop me from using it though :3

Edited by PlagueDoctor, November 24 2012 - 09:47 PM.

[Dreizehn]

According to stats, the vulcan already has a DPS advantage over the SMC and AR. Though it loses out on total damage when fired to overheat. In that sense its burstier than the SMC and AR in the more damage in a shorter period of time sense. The vulcan is circumstantially better than the SMC and AR, though these circumstances are far and between and you are generally better off using the SMC.

Now I'm not disagreeing to a buff, but I don't think it should be capable of hosing down heavies like snap.

[Sparkard]

PlagueDoctor, on November 24 2012 - 07:15 PM, said:

The Vulcan definitely needs to be buffed. I was in contact with an enemy c-class, with my Vulcan firing full auto, and I couldn't kill him before overheating. (also I was hoping to get a Miniflak on my bruiser at level 20)

You was in a contact with an enemy c-class or an enemy c-class rocketeer, because till the nerf it is a huge difference. Also you're not supposed to fire it at full auto, you're supposed to fire it for some time, stop, dash behind a cover, dash out and continue wrecking him. if he connects all shots and you too, then you shouldn't be able to kill it faster than he killing you, he has more hp, you should use your speed to your advantage.
I've seen some very good bruisers recently and liked it with vulcan myself. I'd say let's wait for devs to verify what's up with heat reduction not working, then we may think about buffing it more if it is working but still feels too weak.
Also there was something with bruiser's ability not working properly so... .

[PlagueDoctor]

The problem with dashing in and out of cover is that my mech is a b-class, and you run out of fuel really quickly doing that. The spin-up time keeps you from doing hit and runs of that kind as well. Using it as anything but full auto is useless. I typically get mechs (of all sizes) down to near-critical armor, then stick to them with the Vulcan, The problem with that is that I've overheated trying to kill someone at mid range because the thing is a pea-shooter and inaccurate as hell. I'm not talking like I was missing the whole time either, Cross hairs on the enemy always.

Also the C-class I was attacking was repairing. I couldn't out damage his repairing. (it had 3-4 bars when I started attacking him) I wouldn't be complaining if the weapon was balanced, but as of right now its only capable of killing people with a disproportionate skill level (I have to be higher skill than if I was using a different weapon) I'm fine with it not killing c-classes in a 1 to 1 fight where neither of us gets the jump. I'm not fine when I run up to a guy repairing and he heals faster than I can kill him. Keep in mind I also had bullet damage internals.

[Darkbolt]

odd they would use the word "balance" in the naming of this thread when simply that is not the case.

[mech_fury]

I totally agree with plaguedr. I didn't get to use the vulcan in any of the alphas or betas until now. I came into beta 3 very excited to get a vulcan, because it would destroy during the earlier play tests. Seemed like the guy with the vulcan was always doing well in those matches.  Now with the spool, heat, and decreased damage its more of a position give away than a go to gun.  But it could be exactly the same as before.... what did they change this beta_ did it used to spool and heat like crazy_

[DarkPulse]

mech_fury, on November 29 2012 - 04:48 PM, said:

I totally agree with plaguedr. I didn't get to use the vulcan in any of the alphas or betas until now. I came into beta 3 very excited to get a vulcan, because it would destroy during the earlier play tests. Seemed like the guy with the vulcan was always doing well in those matches.  Now with the spool, heat, and decreased damage its more of a position give away than a go to gun.  But it could be exactly the same as before.... what did they change this beta_ did it used to spool and heat like crazy_

Damage got reduced from 14/bullet to 12/bullet, and the heat was increased by some 2/3rds.

Most of us are fine with the damage nerf, it's probably the heat increase that does the real harm, so the quickest answers would be to make it a high-damage, high-heat weapon (in which case, damage needs to go up) or to turn down the heat sharply back to CB2 levels (in which case, it's more of a fast-ROF weapon). AR and (especially) SMC outclass this thing in every way right now.

[Jagdwyre]

DarkPulse, on November 30 2012 - 04:50 AM, said:

mech_fury, on November 29 2012 - 04:48 PM, said:

I totally agree with plaguedr. I didn't get to use the vulcan in any of the alphas or betas until now. I came into beta 3 very excited to get a vulcan, because it would destroy during the earlier play tests. Seemed like the guy with the vulcan was always doing well in those matches.  Now with the spool, heat, and decreased damage its more of a position give away than a go to gun.  But it could be exactly the same as before.... what did they change this beta_ did it used to spool and heat like crazy_

Damage got reduced from 14/bullet to 12/bullet, and the heat was increased by some 2/3rds.

Most of us are fine with the damage nerf, it's probably the heat increase that does the real harm, so the quickest answers would be to make it a high-damage, high-heat weapon (in which case, damage needs to go up) or to turn down the heat sharply back to CB2 levels (in which case, it's more of a fast-ROF weapon). AR and (especially) SMC outclass this thing in every way right now.

I'd rather see it as high damage/high heat to better differentiate it from the SMC in term of how it's used. The problem however is I'm sure that would cause the Assault class mech to be ridiculous with it again. Which then brings up the old discussion of whether or not certain mechs should have these weapons.

[DarkPulse]

Jagdwyre, on December 01 2012 - 12:13 PM, said:

I'd rather see it as high damage/high heat to better differentiate it from the SMC in term of how it's used. The problem however is I'm sure that would cause the Assault class mech to be ridiculous with it again. Which then brings up the old discussion of whether or not certain mechs should have these weapons.

Well, a dev has said it's not supposed to be on the Assault, so I'm kind of stumped as to why it was not removed (presumably it will be starting with OB). Pretty sure it'll get removed from A-Classes, too, as a L20 Berserker with a Vulcan was an absolute monster in CB1/CB2; the sheer amount of damage they could do combined with the difficulty in hitting them made them a very dominant force.

It's fine on the Bruiser since they have no heat-killing ability, but it's part of why Bruisers feel for the most part underpowered now; I rarely fear Bruisers if they got a Vulcan as a result. SMC-using Bruisers, on the other hand... far more dangerous if they can hit consistently.

[SunshineSloth]

Quote

L20 Berserker with a Vulcan was an absolute monster in CB1/CB2

Not so in Beta 3 from my experience. In my lvl 20 Bezerker I run with the SMG because the high heat and wide scatter of the Vulcan combined with my dodgy style of play renders it pretty much useless.

SMG does 2 less damage for ~5 less heat. Bonus: You can actually hit things.

[DarkPulse]

SunshineSloth, on December 02 2012 - 06:22 AM, said:

Not so in Beta 3 from my experience. In my lvl 20 Bezerker I run with the SMG because the high heat and wide scatter of the Vulcan combined with my dodgy style of play renders it pretty much useless.

SMG does 2 less damage for ~5 less heat. Bonus: You can actually hit things.

Yes, and that's because the Vulcan was massively nerfed. Damage got downticked from 14 to 12 and heat gain increased by about 2/3, to the point that even the people who were saying it needed to be nerfed were saying it got too nerfed.

The devs supposedly fixed it on 11/21 (the tooltip updated) but it actually is unchanged. So right now it does about 600-800 damage before overheating, whereas SMC has an effective DPS of 1100+ before it does.

There's a reason I said it was a beast in CB1/CB2, and explicitly did not mention CB3.

Edited by DarkPulse, December 02 2012 - 06:29 AM.

[Deu]

DarkPulse, on November 30 2012 - 04:50 AM, said:

Most of us are fine with the damage nerf, it's probably the heat increase that does the real harm, so the quickest answers would be to make it a high-damage, high-heat weapon (in which case, damage needs to go up) or to turn down the heat sharply back to CB2 levels (in which case, it's more of a fast-ROF weapon). AR and (especially) SMC outclass this thing in every way right now.

Oh look at that, logic.

[The_Silencer]

The Assault rifle needs more punch_

[SamSlade]

Sharpshooter needs hitscan.. never thought I'd argue FOR a hitscan weapon but it's just to cluttered/fast/laggy for accurate leading at range.