25 replies to this topic

[KungfuDojo]

http://youtu.be/l7MBOwTzuW4

It is not my video but exspecially in the second half he holds the point for a very long time in siege mode. And it isn't even so much the damage reduction but rather the passiv repair that makes i viable. Imo if they polish it for that role for all heavies then it can be quite viable and fun. Things I would change/improve on:

• passiv heal being a basic mechanic no matter which heavy (based around 30% - 50% of the repair heal maybe)
  
• both - transformation and movementspeed - should be a tad higher
  
• more damage: no heat generation and 20% decreased cooldown on both weapons

So these changes would make the mode definitely fun but it might be toxic for gameplay in general because it pretty much advertises camping/sitiing on a point spamming your stuff. So this is why it needs a clear way to be countered: Close quarter combat.

• damage reduction seperates between explosions and bullets: 70% vs explosions/30% vs bullets
  
• reduced shooting angle: you can only vertically aim between 45 and -45 degrees. so if someone is flying directly above you for example (90 degrees) you just cannot shoot him. The thing to do would be to attack them from directly above. You can literally stand on them and finish them off.

Your opinions_

[h0B0]

That was enlightening.

I can not comment on your suggestion since i do not play c-class but seeing the pace at which he heals i would have to say the bruisers mode is fine as it is. Coupled with a team that has good communication and cooperation it might be just as effective as a-b class abilities.

But i still would rather play a or b class.

Edit:wait what! that was last nights game........ ima have to watch the whole thing

Edit2: 13:30 i keel jou! 14:50 his point is being capped and he does nothing to stop them. 17:11 i keel jou again!
The entire second game he camped S2 not that it was much of an issue considering my teammates kept dumb rushing S2 but you will notice i am wise to his camping and try to cap S1-3 which were mostly undefended points and have managed to do so quite successfully. i also have very little problem taking him out when the situation arises. He also stood on the 2nd story of the AA while we were under him capping and states " see my radar im in a clusterfudge and they can't do anything to me" we do not need to since you are obviously not stopping us from capping your point. Final scoreboard leaders were AJK, Hugeguts, me. Note: i am playing a lvl 7 AR infiltrator ( not a scout as he mentioned flanked him. )

Thanks for sharing this.

Edited by h0B0, November 26 2012 - 08:00 AM.

[Lithium03]

h0B0, on November 26 2012 - 07:08 AM, said:

That was enlightening.

But i still would rather play a or b class.

Edit:wait what! that was last nights game........ ima have to watch the whole thing

ikr_

[defekt]

I know that making omelettes by cracking the eggs on my forehead can work sometimes but that doesn’t mean it’s the best way to make my breakfast every morning.

[Dreizehn]

I only watched the 13:30 bit and honestly, that is a very situational approach and those guys trying to take him out were a bit silly. Not using EMP on him. Hitting him head on.

I think the Brawler would perform better under the AA platform, flushing enemies in and out with TOW and Flak.

[Crimson_Corsair]

defekt, on November 26 2012 - 07:41 AM, said:

I know that making omelettes by cracking the eggs on my forehead can work sometimes but that doesn’t mean it’s the best way to make my breakfast every morning.

Fact: its the only way to make breakfast.

[defekt]

Crimson_Corsair, on November 26 2012 - 09:11 AM, said:

defekt, on November 26 2012 - 07:41 AM, said:

I know that making omelettes by cracking the eggs on my forehead can work sometimes but that doesn’t mean it’s the best way to make my breakfast every morning.

Fact: its the only way to make breakfast.

Damnit.

[AsianJoyKiller]

That video is probably the worst showcase possible of turret mode being viable. It was a complete steamroll against my team.
There's no way you can argue the viability when one side was working as a team, and the other was 1 guy trying to win constant 3v1s, a newbie and two complete scrubs.

DieselCat is a complete newbie, and while he tried his hardest, there's only so much he could do.

As for QuanZen and Zergbong, after the previous match where I rolled them, they both stacked onto my team.
Actually, ZergBong stated he was going to stop playing for the night at the end of being steamrolled, but then as soon as the next round loaded and there was a spot on my team, he was happy to hop on over and ride my coattails.
QuanZen pulled an even bigger douchebag move, and waited AFK for several minutes letting his teammate fight a 2v1, and then as soon as someone else loaded in and joined his teammate, he immediately switched to my team and only then started playing.

[defekt]

It must be amazing being you.

[AsianJoyKiller]

defekt, on November 26 2012 - 11:55 AM, said:

It must be amazing being you.

Why don't you just sack up and insult me like you mean it_
These little snide comments are amusing, especially as you don't actually add anything constructive to the conversation.

P.S.
I'm still waiting for you to actually prove my alleged hypocrisy in the Battleship thread.

[defekt]

Had it even occurred to you that perhaps those other players were keen to learn from an experienced player, to shadow you for a little while and perhaps pick up a few tips_  Couldn't possibly be could it.  No of course not, they were all "complete scrubs" and "douchebags".  It's a shame because you are an experienced player -- well, you certainly talk a good game -- and I believe that new players could learn a lot from watching you play - if only you could clamber over your own self-importance every once in a while.

[mikelat]

Hey, thanks for posting up my video. I'm doing a class based video series on hawken in hopes that some people who are on the fence about investing time in the game will find a playstyle they like and go for it as it's not immediately evident how each class plays and handles. Don't look into too much the spur-of-the-moment commentary as I am just trying to have fun and relay a bit of useful game information from the perspective of somebody just getting into the game, as I have not invested a lot of gametime in.

I did not actually have high hopes for the turret mode for brawler but I was pleasantly surprised, especially given that the health regeneration is much higher than the description implies (it claims its slow). The disadvantages with the turret mode are obvious lack of items and mobility, which can be countered by proper loadout selection and positional advantage (high ground, in this video). I selected no upgrades or internals for my videos, so the footage you're seeing could be enhanced by somebody maximizing armor/hp in order to be more tanky. I wasn't necessarily raking in the points but I felt that holding the centre point was important, as it separates the two side points and makes it more difficult for the opposing team to have both capped without our team taking one of the sides.

The first match was imbalanced (I didn't realize that two players on the opposing team were rather "new" to the game, I deduced it after the fact when I noticed they had 2 rocketeers but I never remembered once being locked onto), the second match was more balanced and showcases the potential of turret mode on brawler.

I don't think EMP would have helped as the positional advantage I had with vantage point and them requiring about 10 seconds just to get from cover onto the same platform as me. Granted hitting me from the back and using teamwork counters turret mode (they killed me once or twice like this), but a turret brawler shouldn't survive when getting pounded like that anyways.

[AsianJoyKiller]

defekt, on November 26 2012 - 12:13 PM, said:

Had it even occurred to you that perhaps those other players were keen to learn from an experienced player, to shadow you for a little while and perhaps pick up a few tips_  Couldn't possibly be could it.  No of course not, they were all "complete scrubs" and "douchebags".  It's a shame because you are an experienced player -- well, you certainly talk a good game -- and I believe that new players could learn a lot from watching you play - if only you could clamber over your own self-importance every once in a while.

Thank you for saying what you mean. This I can work with. This I can respect.

If they were so keen on learning though, why did they charge off to their deaths alone_ Why didn't they ask questions_ Why didn't they respond when I asked them for help_ Why didn't they indicate at all that they wanted to learn or get better_

EDIT: PM me if you want to keep discussing. Shouldn't drag this off topic any more.

Edited by AsianJoyKiller, November 26 2012 - 12:20 PM.

[Roundlay]

AsianJoyKiller, on November 26 2012 - 12:04 PM, said:

Why don't you just sack up and insult me like you mean it_
These little snide comments are amusing, especially as you don't actually add anything constructive to the conversation.

AsianJoyKiller, on November 26 2012 - 10:38 AM, said:

Another half-baked idea from Omega22 without any consideration for balance or existing gameplay mechanics.
Why am I not surprised...

The irony... it, it hurts...

[AsianJoyKiller]

Roundlay, on November 26 2012 - 12:26 PM, said:

AsianJoyKiller, on November 26 2012 - 12:04 PM, said:

Why don't you just sack up and insult me like you mean it_
These little snide comments are amusing, especially as you don't actually add anything constructive to the conversation.

AsianJoyKiller, on November 26 2012 - 10:38 AM, said:

Another half-baked idea from Omega22 without any consideration for balance or existing gameplay mechanics.
Why am I not surprised...

The irony... it, it hurts...

It's snide, but I do have a point with the "without any consideration for balance or existing gameplay mechanics."
Or are you going to tell me that Omega22's idea fits right in and would have minimal balance issues_

EDIT: For those of you who don't know, Omega22's idea promotes vertical progression and exclusivity of said progression to those more skilled.

Edited by AsianJoyKiller, November 26 2012 - 12:41 PM.

[TheChaffeemancer]

This discussion is fuzzy bunny.

As for turret mode, it can be used, but only in, as said, very narrow situations. Anyone worth half his salt will just throttle you when you activate turret mode. This is not true of any other ability in the game. Increased damage does not increase heat gen, activating weapon coolant in no way affects their performance. Why then, should the heavies get an ability that weakens them when the others only get buffs_

[KungfuDojo]

TheChaffeemancer, on November 26 2012 - 12:48 PM, said:

This discussion is fuzzy bunny.

As for turret mode, it can be used, but only in, as said, very narrow situations. Anyone worth half his salt will just throttle you when you activate turret mode. This is not true of any other ability in the game. Increased damage does not increase heat gen, activating weapon coolant in no way affects their performance. Why then, should the heavies get an ability that weakens them when the others only get buffs_

The idea is to get stronger buffs compared to the other classes for the sake of a downside. It is like that:

A+B: 0 + 5 = 5

C: 0 + 10 - 5 = 5

Atleast that is what it is supposed to be but we didn't reach 10 yet. The passive repairing while turret mode seems like the best approach to me however.

AsianJoyKiller, on November 26 2012 - 11:42 AM, said:

That video is probably the worst showcase possible of turret mode being viable. It was a complete steamroll against my team.
There's no way you can argue the viability when one side was working as a team, and the other was 1 guy trying to win constant 3v1s, a newbie and two complete scrubs.

DieselCat is a complete newbie, and while he tried his hardest, there's only so much he could do.

As for QuanZen and Zergbong, after the previous match where I rolled them, they both stacked onto my team.
Actually, ZergBong stated he was going to stop playing for the night at the end of being steamrolled, but then as soon as the next round loaded and there was a spot on my team, he was happy to hop on over and ride my coattails.
QuanZen pulled an even bigger douchebag move, and waited AFK for several minutes letting his teammate fight a 2v1, and then as soon as someone else loaded in and joined his teammate, he immediately switched to my team and only then started playing.

I think you missunderstood my intentions with this thread a bit. Neither me nore mikelat wanted to showcase the fact "oh look turret mode is totally fine". What the video DID show though (doesn't matter if win or lose) is that the reapair CAN come in handy in specific mentioned situations. It is far from a good state but imo this shows that it might work with the right changes and is not a feature that can never be viable/should be removed.

Edited by KungfuDojo, November 26 2012 - 05:19 PM.

[AsianJoyKiller]

KungfuDojo, on November 26 2012 - 05:10 PM, said:

I think you missunderstood my intentions with this thread a bit. Neither me nore mikelat wanted to showcase the fact "oh look turret mode is totally fine". What the video DID show though (doesn't matter if win or lose) is that the reapair CAN come in handy in specific mentioned situations. It is far from a good state but imo this shows that it might work with the right changes and is not a feature that can never be viable/should be removed.

Ah, alright.
Makes sense.

You did say it was viable, so that's why I was confused.

[HugeGuts]

10/10 video. Would have it rock me to sleep every night. My mech is so huge. I wish I could make it huger. I want the gun mounts to be gun arms instead of gun stumps. Then I could make my arms huge too!

[KungfuDojo]

AsianJoyKiller, on November 26 2012 - 06:08 PM, said:

KungfuDojo, on November 26 2012 - 05:10 PM, said:

I think you missunderstood my intentions with this thread a bit. Neither me nore mikelat wanted to showcase the fact "oh look turret mode is totally fine". What the video DID show though (doesn't matter if win or lose) is that the reapair CAN come in handy in specific mentioned situations. It is far from a good state but imo this shows that it might work with the right changes and is not a feature that can never be viable/should be removed.

Ah, alright.
Makes sense.

You did say it was viable, so that's why I was confused.

Ye I should have written "can be viable" but if I thought it is fine I wouldn't have postet so many change suggestions. Imo it needs to be really fuzzy bunny strong if you don't approach it right. You shouldn't be able to beat it just walking left and right infront of him. If you do that you should be fuzzy bunny annihilated.