NBShoot_me, on February 12 2013 - 03:04 PM, said:
Calm down. I don't care that much about the subject. Stop trying to insult me. I already say "gg" when I feel it is appropriate. I don't think you realize that I purposefully took an extreme opposite to the OP and some of the later, longer posts in order to draw out certain contradictions; it is quite obvious that "gg" is not always appropriate. I am merely trying to show that in such a situation, trying to talk with the losers or even saying "thanks for the game" instead of "gg" is just as bad as saying "gg". I definitely feel you are much more emotionally invested in this subject than I am. These arguments aren't even meant to "counter" yours, they are for those that feel that "instead of saying gg, other words should be said".
Below is my response to your last post. Feel free to respond, but this time, I make it clear: much of what I post is tailored specifically to contradict, as I find that such contradictions to be very conducive to extensive discussion, which I often enjoy as an exercise in thought and prose. My posts may or may not reflect my own, internal, personal positions on matters.
The example with kendo is pretty much as far of an extreme as I could think of to be reasonable. The point of it was to illustrate that even if a match is completely unbalanced, such a match could easily be used as an opportunity to learn for both parties, hence why it is important to put all of one's effort into a match. However, this point was lost as I had forgotten to write this into my post. The setting of "kendo" is purely to give a concrete example. A more relevant example would be Dota 2 or Heroes of Newerth, where it is much easier to see how 2 uneven teams can take the match well.
Indeed, I think you are trying to misrepresent my example. The matter of teams instead of single pairs of competitors is not relevant - the balance of the game is. A team can be made up of one person, after all. Teams can occur in kendo competitions, although multiple kendoka, kendo practitioners, do not spar at once. However, teams aggregate the points of their members, like in Hawken. The matter of cheating is borderline supportive of my position, since video games are software which have strictly defined, unbreakable rules, outside of hacks and bug exploits, which should be very low considering that Hawken matches are server-side managed and I have seen no reports of any significant bug exploits. However, in a real life event like kendo, cheating is very easy to accomplish and is difficult to undo. Hence, in this regard, "gg" is more valid in Hawken than a real life competition (of any sort) because it can be automatically assumed that no cheating took place in the video game match.
Your point regarding the gaming crowd having no integrity and generally being very nasty only reflects certain, vocal individuals. Trash-talking_ Complete disregard for other players_ I am very, very doubtful that these perspectives reflect reality. Hawken's community definitely is made up of mostly of players like this. I have only come across a few players like this, who may have been vitriolic enough to easily make up for the vast silence or good manners others demonstrate. Money should literally be a non-issue except for professional competitive players who are earning significant winnings.
As for walking away with things: the most that kendo players might walk away from a tournament with, as I have seen and have had the good fortune of also receiving, are medals, trophies, and cloth equipment that are more like token gifts. Kendo players may also walk away with serious injuries analogous with carpal tunnel, like foot injuries, bruises, and so on.
Nothing stops gamers from walking away with token gifts though. Even abstract concepts and/or emotions like "honour" and "character" can be earned from games, just as in kendo. Obviously it is much easier with kendo since it takes place in real life, but what is to say local gamers cannot meet up for events, or that distant gamers cannot hold video conferences_
I would go as far as to say that you are also making a lot of assumptions regarding the general character of a video game player.
Your own example is definitely exteme. If it happened, I would be curious as to why the 1 newbie stayed, and would ask if the newbie decided to say "gg".
Again, I reiterate: I now realize that we have been arguing about different things for some time. I have already adopted the same view as you have: say something when it's reasonable, otherwise, don't say anything at all. However, I would prefer to take the positive route of saying "gg" for good games, instead of "[words of consolation]", which specifically imply an unfair loss and a "bad" game (which I have tried to show previously is subjective and poorly defined) has finished.
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On a side note, I find that the perception that the gaming community is filled with trolls, rude people, and is generally very vitriolic disheartening. I may take to heart the advice of saying words after saying "gg" and being responded with aggression to counter this perception. I hope anyone who manages to read this also tries to counteract this seemingly ubiquitous negative perceptions, as such attitudes (and any attitudes, indeed) can lead to profound effects on a variety of different levels.
Thank you for your time.
Sincerely,
WWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW
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