90 replies to this topic

[dontmindme]

foxraven99, on March 30 2014 - 06:08 PM, said:

dontmindme, on March 30 2014 - 03:39 PM, said:

I'm hoping you're just being sarcastic and I failed to catch it...

Sorry thought my sarcasm was pretty clear on that with the "Get over it, accept that they dump and nothing will end up happening to them." comment. As you stated, the developers can't afford to lose players yet, but once the game goes truly live there's a better chance of action being taken. Until that point, which may be severally delayed with EA's travesty of Titanfall launching it's all just a moot point.

LOL, good to know, you had me scratching my head in disbelief there.  As for the not caring about people leaving line you put in there.. there ARE actually people here who would like to dump segments of this community outright as they don’t play Hawken “right” according to them..

All this going on while I watch the consecutive player count trend down to where Hawken is reaching a point close to the pay-gate numbers we had over a month ago.  With patches not having nearly the impact on STEAM (player number wise) that they did pre-STEAM (patching on STEAM is generally a non-event).   I suppose Hawken can make it with 4k to 5k consecutive players give or take, but I don’t see how it’s going to do much better with people getting shamed by the devs and players for throwing their hands in the air and backing out of abysmal match-making and game balance issues that have dogged this game since the initial closed beta.  And while it looks awesome, other F2P games out there have been improving quite a bit leaving Hawken with a little bit of something resembling DNF-syndrome.

Edited by dontmindme, March 30 2014 - 07:10 PM.

[renynzea]

If a player drops a game put them on probation for 10 minutes of in-game time..  While on probation they are used to fill an existing game before players who are not on probation, and in the event of multiple existing games needing player, players on probation get the shortest games.  Basically, they become cannon fodder.  They'll either learn to suck it up, or they'll quit.  Either benefits the player base as a whole.

[dontmindme]

renynzea, on March 31 2014 - 11:38 AM, said:

If a player drops a game put them on probation for 10 minutes of in-game time..  While on probation they are used to fill an existing game before players who are not on probation, and in the event of multiple existing games needing player, players on probation get the shortest games.  Basically, they become cannon fodder.  They'll either learn to suck it up, or they'll quit.  Either benefits the player base as a whole.

So... to get people to "learn to suck it up" you are proposing to put them in not only the same type of circumstances that prompt them to rage-quit in the first place, but you want to exacerbate things by increasing the frequency and intensity of these scenarios_


Why is it that so many people want to run around screaming “Mommy spank!” at others who don’t do things exactly the way they want them done_!   This isn’t time-out or detention, you can’t MAKE people stay for their punishment..  people will eventually start leaving if they’re not having a good time.  Will you people look at the numbers being posted on the STEAM charts… driving people away helps HOW_!


Does critical thinking just not happen around here_

Edited by dontmindme, March 31 2014 - 12:28 PM.

[PlagueDoctor]

Penalizing people for leaving is a horrible way to go about things, instead, we need to give incentives to people who stay. A compensation for keeping with an uneven match, and more HC for the losing team, and perhaps a stacking bonus of HC for each consecutive match in the same lobby.

When you're working with people, the rules are ALWAYS THE SAME. People will work harder for a small bonus than working harder to avoid a penalty.

[renynzea]

dontmindme, on March 31 2014 - 12:28 PM, said:

Why is it that so many people want to run around screaming “Mommy spank!” at others who don’t do things exactly the way they want them done_!   This isn’t time-out or detention, you can’t MAKE people stay for their punishment..  people will eventually start leaving if they’re not having a good time.  Will you people look at the numbers being posted on the STEAM charts… driving people away helps HOW_!

Because for some games a community is all it has.  I can remember playing a lot of MMOs back before cross-server groups got popular.  People used to be very respectful of each other.  The reason is simple:  Consequence.  If they acted like a jerk they got black-listed and they no longer got in guilds, or groups, or raids.  They would have to roll an entirely new character, and sometimes even a new account.

Then they added cross-server groups and most of those communities went down the toilet faster than you can say kung fu panda.

Yes, I realize this is not an MMO, but the social aspect is the same.  You can try to be nice.  You can try to bribe the player.  Ultimately it is fear that keeps a community in line.  It is the most basic of human truths.  We do not always act out of moral obligation; we act because we do not want to be punished, shunned or embarrassed.  Without those consequences a great many people devolve into selfish, boorish monsters.

Case in point, rage quitters.  Rather than offer advice, they insult players who may be doing poorly.  Rather than accept this is a team game and their loan wolf antics aren't working for them, they would rather disparage the entire team and then quit (handicapping their former team for the remainder of the match).  They do so knowing there is little or no penalty if they do.

If those are the kind of players you want to stay, that is your prerogative.  I'd just as soon they leave.

That said, I'd also be happy with the bribe option, posted by PlagueDoctor.  I don't think it will prevent rage quitting, as it doesn't address the reason they quit (they want easy-mode PVP and it ain't happening), but it would be a nice kudos for the team the quitter leaves behind.  *shrug*

Edited by renynzea, April 01 2014 - 01:57 PM.

[dontmindme]

renynzea, on April 01 2014 - 01:56 PM, said:

dontmindme, on March 31 2014 - 12:28 PM, said:

Why is it that so many people want to run around screaming “Mommy spank!” at others who don’t do things exactly the way they want them done_!   This isn’t time-out or detention, you can’t MAKE people stay for their punishment..  people will eventually start leaving if they’re not having a good time.  Will you people look at the numbers being posted on the STEAM charts… driving people away helps HOW_!

Because for some games a community is all it has.  I can remember playing a lot of MMOs back before cross-server groups got popular.  People used to be very respectful of each other.  The reason is simple:  Consequence.  If they acted like a jerk they got black-listed and they no longer got in guilds, or groups, or raids.  They would have to roll an entirely new character, and sometimes even a new account.

Then they added cross-server groups and most of those communities went down the toilet faster than you can say kung fu panda.

Yes, I realize this is not an MMO, but the social aspect is the same.  You can try to be nice.  You can try to bribe the player.  Ultimately it is fear that keeps a community in line.  It is the most basic of human truths.  We do not always act out of moral obligation; we act because we do not want to be punished, shunned or embarrassed.  Without those consequences a great many people devolve into selfish, boorish monsters.

Case in point, rage quitters.  Rather than offer advice, they insult players who may be doing poorly.  Rather than accept this is a team game and their loan wolf antics aren't working for them, they would rather disparage the entire team and then quit (handicapping their former team for the remainder of the match).  They do so knowing there is little or no penalty if they do.

If those are the kind of players you want to stay, that is your prerogative.  I'd just as soon they leave.

That said, I'd also be happy with the bribe option, posted by PlagueDoctor.  I don't think it will prevent rage quitting, as it doesn't address the reason they quit (they want easy-mode PVP and it ain't happening), but it would be a nice kudos for the team the quitter leaves behind.  *shrug*

Hawken as it is doesn't promote any kind of tight-knit community.  It's got your typical MM run PUG style server hopping system in place sending you to various ADH servers without any real admin presence to be seen.  Of course there's no community here beyond a few groups of people floating around.. but I think I've hit on many these points already, and it's really not my job to figure out possible solutions to ADH's problems, that's ADH's  job.

Quote

Case in point, rage quitters.  Rather than offer advice, they insult players who may be doing poorly.  Rather than accept this is a team game and their loan wolf antics aren't working for them, they would rather disparage the entire team and then quit (handicapping their former team for the remainder of the match).  They do so knowing there is little or no penalty if they do.

If those are the kind of players you want to stay, that is your prerogative.  I'd just as soon they leave.

*checks the steam charts*  2,641 people connected right now... trending up with a probable max of ~2800 - 3400 people max concurent... if this problem is as massive as you all scream it is, are you really sure you'd like to see all these people just leave_  Beyond who's going to foot the bill for this game through micro transactions, I don't really care if one group stays over the other provided that there are enough people actually playing to make this game worth my time (or anyone elses) to bother with it.  And to keep people playing and to draw in new people, the problems with Hawken causing rampant rage quitting need to be addressed long before ADH goes into "mommy spank!" mode and punish the daylights out of their paying or not customers.

[Spliff_Craven]

Since the "penalties" rolled out it seems the games have been fuller... Wouldn't you generally agree_
See...
Snap the chain and they fall in line...

[dontmindme]

Spliff_Craven, on April 03 2014 - 10:21 PM, said:

Since the "penalties" rolled out it seems the games have been fuller... Wouldn't you generally agree_
See...
Snap the chain and they fall in line...

I guess time will tell if "snapping the chain" is going to work..

[UrKungFuNoGood]

Well I've given 20 dollars to this game, and have spent almost seventy hours playing. I don't feel like I have gotten my money/time's worth. The only reason I still play is because of my clan mates.
Now, I am forced to stay in a game full of people that are either too dumb, or too lazy to play the game properly if I want my measly 300 HC. And 20 HC for getting switched to the losing team_ Gee, thanks.
I don't care if I lose a hard fought game. But I am a little pissed off that you want me to aggro my way through a twenty minute game of people not even remotely interested in applying themselves.

Edited by UrKungFuNoGood, April 05 2014 - 10:17 PM.

[PimpToad]

renynzea, on April 01 2014 - 01:56 PM, said:

Case in point, rage quitters.  Rather than offer advice, they insult players who may be doing poorly.  Rather than accept this is a team game and their loan wolf antics aren't working for them, they would rather disparage the entire team and then quit (handicapping their former team for the remainder of the match).  They do so knowing there is little or no penalty if they do.

I don't know about you, but it's hard to fix stupid. You can only offer so much advice (can you please stop charging the enemy by yourself_) before you realize that banging your head against the wall isn't very productive. What happens if you're leading the scoreboard and can no longer stand the fact your team is next to useless_

I don't know about you, but I'm no fuzzy bunny. I'm not going to stay in a game that will only bring me a headache. So yeah keep petitioning for harsher penalties. That will not stop me and the multitude of players out there who won't stick around in a round we don't find "fun."

[Spliff_Craven]

UrKungFuNoGood, on April 05 2014 - 10:16 PM, said:

The only reason I still play is because of my clan mates.
Now, I am forced to stay in a game full of people that are either too dumb, or too lazy to play the game properly if I want my measly 300 HC. And 20 HC for getting switched to the losing team_ Gee, thanks.
I don't care if I lose a hard fought game. But I am a little pissed off that you want me to aggro my way through a twenty minute game of people not even remotely interested in applying themselves.

This has been my issue since the Ascension patch.

Since Ascension the game has become hella grindy and the rewards are meagre at best.
Personally I am more inclined to pay for stuff if I am having fun and enjoying the game.
As of the recent "speed patch" I am more inclined to play more often. If they keep moving in a positive direction I will be inclined to pay for more stuff...

As for the current team splitting etc... Gross incompetence and team splitting suck, period...
Bring back the 1-6 man teams. I want to play with my friends not against them. I'm sure that that's preferred for everyone.