39 replies to this topic

[007eleven]

I have no problem defeating either of them, although I do come across an occasional player who is a pro and destroys everybody.

[SatelliteJack]

Man, all this feedback and discussion is rad, thank you/well done, folks!

[Meraple]

Battlesbreak, on April 28 2014 - 07:25 AM, said:

You haven't heard tactic called falling back away from corners and forcing scout to engage you face to face.

That doesn't ''force'' the Scout in any way.
The Scout can easily poke his head out of cover, shoot a TOW and dodge back into cover.
Rinse and repeat.
Even easier with a HEAT Scout.

Battlesbreak, on April 28 2014 - 07:25 AM, said:

Raider reflak is just every mechs bane.

Lolno.
It's only every mech's bane if the pilots are bad.
Simply due to it's sustained nature.

Battlesbreak, on April 28 2014 - 07:25 AM, said:

Raider has also MIRV weapon mode to blast scout who is behind wall.

Only idiots stand so close to the corner to be hittable by any splash weaponry.

Battlesbreak, on April 28 2014 - 07:25 AM, said:

Heat dispersion when nearly maxed the heat is also good way to say hi Scout who comes around corner.

If the Incin is standing so close to the corner that he can hit Scout with Heat Dispersion,
The Heat Cannon and TOW can hit the Incin as well.



Your thinking that bad players decide what good tactics are amuses me.

[EM1O]

ohfer crapsakes,. i love my scout, and like to play all teh other junk pile i own. canyouplease start a thread i mite be inerestted nin_

Lamer dummasss.

[OmegaNull]

They are fine. In team based games they are very limited in their role and are very hard to play without team support.

[SectionZ]

OmegaNull, on April 29 2014 - 01:52 PM, said:

They are fine. In team based games they are very limited in their role and are very hard to play without team support.

I would find that a bit more believable if you were not a Terminator who has taken up playing Scouts in Hawken to pass the time before judgment day.

I'm not saying they are OP, just that calling them "limited" or "Very hard to play without support" with some of the quality of player you see out there is about as laughable as calling them OP.

EDIT: For some reference when I want a more relaxed day at the mech races, what is a mech or two that is unquestionably not limited, or not very hard to play without team support_

Edited by SectionZ, April 29 2014 - 02:17 PM.

[Battlesbreak]

Meraple, on April 29 2014 - 12:09 AM, said:

Battlesbreak, on April 28 2014 - 07:25 AM, said:

You haven't heard tactic called falling back away from corners and forcing scout to engage you face to face.

That doesn't ''force'' the Scout in any way.
The Scout can easily poke his head out of cover, shoot a TOW and dodge back into cover.
Rinse and repeat.
Even easier with a HEAT Scout.

Battlesbreak, on April 28 2014 - 07:25 AM, said:

Raider reflak is just every mechs bane.

Lolno.
It's only every mech's bane if the pilots are bad.
Simply due to it's sustained nature.

Battlesbreak, on April 28 2014 - 07:25 AM, said:

Raider has also MIRV weapon mode to blast scout who is behind wall.

Only idiots stand so close to the corner to be hittable by any splash weaponry.

Battlesbreak, on April 28 2014 - 07:25 AM, said:

Heat dispersion when nearly maxed the heat is also good way to say hi Scout who comes around corner.

If the Incin is standing so close to the corner that he can hit Scout with Heat Dispersion,
The Heat Cannon and TOW can hit the Incin as well.



Your thinking that bad players decide what good tactics are amuses me.

Thou people has tendency to do stupid things at IRL or battlefield were they drunk or not. I have dominated scout players and Infiltrator players when using Raider and kept them on bay when I wanted so. It is all about knowing your enemy what he is willing to do and outsmarting is my hobby.

[Meraple]

Battlesbreak, on April 29 2014 - 10:32 PM, said:

Meraple, on April 29 2014 - 12:09 AM, said:

Battlesbreak, on April 28 2014 - 07:25 AM, said:

You haven't heard tactic called falling back away from corners and forcing scout to engage you face to face.

Too long to quote for my taste.
Snipped.

Thou people has tendency to do stupid things at IRL or battlefield were they drunk or not. I have dominated scout players and Infiltrator players when using Raider and kept them on bay when I wanted so. It is all about knowing your enemy what he is willing to do and outsmarting is my hobby.

If you're playing Reflak Raider, I'd love to see you try dominating people like Candydoll and AmpliFIRE.
Not saying you're bad, but Reflak Raider is bad by default in higher tier games.

Yes, you can dominate your usual scrub.
Not talking about those.

SectionZ, on April 29 2014 - 02:14 PM, said:

OmegaNull, on April 29 2014 - 01:52 PM, said:

They are fine. In team based games they are very limited in their role and are very hard to play without team support.

I'm not saying they are OP, just that calling them "limited" or "Very hard to play without support" with some of the quality of player you see out there is about as laughable as calling them OP.

They are very limited in their role in higher-tier games. (FLAK Scout, atleast)
Perhaps he was talking about that_

Edited by Meraple, April 30 2014 - 12:04 AM.

[Battlesbreak]

Meraple, on April 30 2014 - 12:02 AM, said:

Battlesbreak, on April 29 2014 - 10:32 PM, said:

Meraple, on April 29 2014 - 12:09 AM, said:

Battlesbreak, on April 28 2014 - 07:25 AM, said:

You haven't heard tactic called falling back away from corners and forcing scout to engage you face to face.

Too long to quote for my taste.
Snipped.

Thou people has tendency to do stupid things at IRL or battlefield were they drunk or not. I have dominated scout players and Infiltrator players when using Raider and kept them on bay when I wanted so. It is all about knowing your enemy what he is willing to do and outsmarting is my hobby.

If you're playing Reflak Raider, I'd love to see you try dominating people like Candydoll and AmpliFIRE.
Not saying you're bad, but Reflak Raider is bad by default in higher tier games.

Yes, you can dominate your usual scrub.
Not talking about those.

SectionZ, on April 29 2014 - 02:14 PM, said:

OmegaNull, on April 29 2014 - 01:52 PM, said:

They are fine. In team based games they are very limited in their role and are very hard to play without team support.

I'm not saying they are OP, just that calling them "limited" or "Very hard to play without support" with some of the quality of player you see out there is about as laughable as calling them OP.

They are very limited in their role in higher-tier games. (FLAK Scout, atleast)
Perhaps he was talking about that_

I will never play ranked. The League of Legends has leaved deep wounds on my from that word. AND I EXPECT YOU TO KNOW ******** WHY!

[SectionZ]

Meraple, on April 30 2014 - 12:02 AM, said:

They are very limited in their role in higher-tier games. (FLAK Scout, atleast)
Perhaps he was talking about that_

Oh, another "Nah man, PROS do it differently!" answer.  Which like many games is true up until somebody decides to win with it anyways and gets popular (See that poor tortured soul above's LoL anguish).

You gonna bite on the second part my quoted post you omitted_  What is a mech or two that is unquestionably not limited, or not very hard to play without team support if Scout, like so many things it seem, is "Only good against bad players/In HIGH TIER, you are only hurting yourself if you use this useless piece of garbage!"

And now for some quote content hypocrisy!  Sweet dancing Fred Bobblehead on a surfboard, you and Battle need to start trimming down your nested quotes of your complete growing argument history stretching the entire thread.  It's going to cause a black hole, and is already starting to feel like looking into a funhouse mirror.  EDIT: Even Battle's snips still involve a novel's worth.

Edit two: Oh I have gone crosseyed, that snip was a Merple snip but see above funhouse mirror effect.

Edited by SectionZ, April 30 2014 - 01:12 AM.

[Mawnkey]

Having finally purchased and outfitted an Infiltrator, I can safely say they're not OP. I fuzzy bunny up, I get splattered. I don't fuzzy bunny up and play like a sneaky bastard, I get super awesome score time. It feels just about right.

Decent and up scouts on the other hand are like decent and up 'zerkers... if you're not having a good day, they will splatter you against a wall. Quickly and without warning.

[Knat]

Mawnkey, on April 30 2014 - 02:14 AM, said:

Having finally purchased and outfitted an Infiltrator, I can safely say they're not OP. I fuzzy bunny up, I get splattered. I don't fuzzy bunny up and play like a sneaky bastard, I get super awesome score time. It feels just about right.

Decent and up scouts on the other hand are like decent and up 'zerkers... if you're not having a good day, they will splatter you against a wall. Quickly and without warning.

I can totally agree to this statement.

[Meraple]

SectionZ, on April 30 2014 - 01:10 AM, said:

Meraple, on April 30 2014 - 12:02 AM, said:

They are very limited in their role in higher-tier games. (FLAK Scout, atleast)
Perhaps he was talking about that_

Oh, another "Nah man, PROS do it differently!" answer.  Which like many games is true up until somebody decides to win with it anyways and gets popular (See that poor tortured soul above's LoL anguish).

You gonna bite on the second part my quoted post you omitted_  What is a mech or two that is unquestionably not limited, or not very hard to play without team support if Scout, like so many things it seem, is "Only good against bad players/In HIGH TIER, you are only hurting yourself if you use this useless piece of garbage!"

And now for some quote content hypocrisy!  Sweet dancing Fred Bobblehead on a surfboard, you and Battle need to start trimming down your nested quotes of your complete growing argument history stretching the entire thread.  It's going to cause a black hole, and is already starting to feel like looking into a funhouse mirror.  EDIT: Even Battle's snips still involve a novel's worth.

Edit two: Oh I have gone crosseyed, that snip was a Merple snip but see above funhouse mirror effect.

...I have no idea what you just asked nor said.
Proper English would be appreciated.

[SectionZ]

Meraple, on April 30 2014 - 03:10 AM, said:

...I have no idea what you just asked nor said.
Proper English would be appreciated.

Okay, I ran the following through google translate first out of consideration.  You did say please after all.

If Scout is so terrible in High Tier team games because they are "Very limited in their role" or "Very hard to play without team support",  What handful of robots do NOT have those problems in High Tier.  I've seen nearly every robot claimed to have the same problems in "High Tier Teamplay", up to and including blanket statements that A and C class in their entirety have those problems from one person or another.  So it has been leaving me curious what mechs are left without such flaws.

[Meraple]

SectionZ, on April 30 2014 - 05:51 PM, said:

Meraple, on April 30 2014 - 03:10 AM, said:

...I have no idea what you just asked nor said.
Proper English would be appreciated.

Okay, I ran the following through google translate first out of consideration.  You did say please after all.

If Scout is so terrible in High Tier team games because they are "Very limited in their role" or "Very hard to play without team support",  What handful of robots do NOT have those problems in High Tier.  I've seen nearly every robot claimed to have the same problems in "High Tier Teamplay", up to and including blanket statements that A and C class in their entirety have those problems from one person or another.  So it has been leaving me curious what mechs are left without such flaws.

Well, FLAK Scout seems alot more handicapped in it's role in higher-tier gameplay IMO.
If you want to corner poke, Brawler can pretty much do the same, but with alot higher HP.

You can't chase after people around a corner as much, as they'll probably lie in wait with a TOW/GL ready to throw into your face.
Especially considering your low HP.

You can't get out into the open, as you'll die in a matter of seconds.

You're simply too fragile to 1v1 as well, as good players will hit almost every shot.


Currently the Incin + Tech combo is just stupid in higher-tier gameplay.
It's just too powerful.


C classes are better then they have ever been before; Vanguard and Incinerator pretty much move as fast as B class mechs.

They're pretty much better in high tier gameplay then A class mechs atm, especially due to the weapon-raise-after-boost delay.

[SectionZ]

Meraple, on May 01 2014 - 12:25 AM, said:

Well, FLAK Scout seems alot more handicapped in it's role in higher-tier gameplay IMO.
If you want to corner poke, Brawler can pretty much do the same, but with alot higher HP.

You can't chase after people around a corner as much, as they'll probably lie in wait with a TOW/GL ready to throw into your face.
Especially considering your low HP.

You can't get out into the open, as you'll die in a matter of seconds.

You're simply too fragile to 1v1 as well, as good players will hit almost every shot.


Currently the Incin + Tech combo is just stupid in higher-tier gameplay.
It's just too powerful.


C classes are better then they have ever been before; Vanguard and Incinerator pretty much move as fast as B class mechs.

They're pretty much better in high tier gameplay then A class mechs atm, especially due to the weapon-raise-after-boost delay.

  Well, that was somewhat informative...  So, which mechs weren't limited in high tier or reliant on teams in all that_  Just the Brawler and Vanguard then_  At least Vanguard is one of my two favorite C classes considering the rest beyond Incinerator feel cripplingly slow, not even getting into turncap.

  Tech+Incinerator seems to have an on/off result in my Above Average At Best experience.  It's been less about how well "I absorb the heat from heal beam" meshes for that combo itself, and more how much your team falls back into "My KDR matters more than anything! He might kill me!" mindsets when faced with that combo.  

My best matches last night, enemy Incin+Tech combo just got crushed over and over.  I died half the time to their incinerator, killed them the other half, and killed his tech 90% of the time either way. We won those hands down.  Still 3,000 to nothing by the time we launched our final ship needed in one case.

  However, suddenly, next match start people on our team start talking about how OP the Tech+incin combo is. Nobody is going to the AA.  It escalates into a pair of Tech+Incin combos on their team, and most of our team switching into Two reapers, two predators, and a sharpshooter struggling to break double digit score on ours never going within spitting distance of the AA, anything it took to not die short of leaving.  Just me and the similarly stubborn vanguard trying for it (and it going as well as expected any mech arrangement of 4-6 vs 2 on the AA would go).  It doesn't matter if I kill both Techs before going down, because bullets and ECO mines from halfway across the map can't capture a point.  Not badmouthing snipers and preds, I've seen plenty ace the AA capture, or fight near enough it they can step on to speed up the capture or hold it longer.

  So if the Incin+Tech is in any way OP, it would those times seeing it makes people just not bother and do anything to preserve their KDR outside of leaving the match entirely.

Edited by SectionZ, May 01 2014 - 03:09 AM.

[GreenEggsAndSamZ]

Bazookagofer, on April 26 2014 - 04:12 AM, said:

I find em bothersome personally, but I got technical issues on my side, here the list :
-blind
-18 FPS
-deaf
-mute
- Lost both my limbs in the Iraq War
-Paralyzed from the hair down

So you see_ Only reason is because I got technical issues, apart from that their fine.

I'm actually deaf irl and I don't find either too hard to deal with. If I lose to them, it's on me. (because I play a raider and I just can't miss my shots... ever)

[Meraple]

SectionZ, on May 01 2014 - 03:06 AM, said:

So, which mechs weren't limited in high tier or reliant on teams in all that_  Just the Brawler and Vanguard then_

All mechs are team-reliant in high-tier, even Predator.
The Predator doesn't need a team to survive; it does need a team in order to kill without dying. (not in pubs)

As for limited, I was saying that FLAK Scout is severely limited in it's role in those matches.
Even more so then most other mechs.


I didn't say anything about being team-reliant before this post, so I have no idea where you got that from.

SectionZ, on May 01 2014 - 03:06 AM, said:

  So if the Incin+Tech is in any way OP, it would those times seeing it makes people just not bother and do anything to preserve their KDR outside of leaving the match entirely.

Don't really know what you said there, but Rasti in an Incinerator + Tech is pretty deadly.

Edited by Meraple, May 01 2014 - 05:14 AM.

[OmegaNull]

Meraple, on April 30 2014 - 12:02 AM, said:

Battlesbreak, on April 29 2014 - 10:32 PM, said:

Meraple, on April 29 2014 - 12:09 AM, said:

Battlesbreak, on April 28 2014 - 07:25 AM, said:

You haven't heard tactic called falling back away from corners and forcing scout to engage you face to face.

Too long to quote for my taste.
Snipped.

Thou people has tendency to do stupid things at IRL or battlefield were they drunk or not. I have dominated scout players and Infiltrator players when using Raider and kept them on bay when I wanted so. It is all about knowing your enemy what he is willing to do and outsmarting is my hobby.

If you're playing Reflak Raider, I'd love to see you try dominating people like Candydoll and AmpliFIRE.
Not saying you're bad, but Reflak Raider is bad by default in higher tier games.

Yes, you can dominate your usual scrub.
Not talking about those.

SectionZ, on April 29 2014 - 02:14 PM, said:

OmegaNull, on April 29 2014 - 01:52 PM, said:

They are fine. In team based games they are very limited in their role and are very hard to play without team support.

I'm not saying they are OP, just that calling them "limited" or "Very hard to play without support" with some of the quality of player you see out there is about as laughable as calling them OP.

They are very limited in their role in higher-tier games. (FLAK Scout, atleast)
Perhaps he was talking about that_

Yep. Sorry. Flak scout is my baby.

[SectionZ]

Meraple, on May 01 2014 - 05:12 AM, said:

All mechs are team-reliant in high-tier, even Predator.
The Predator doesn't need a team to survive; it does need a team in order to kill without dying. (not in pubs)

As for limited, I was saying that FLAK Scout is severely limited in it's role in those matches.
Even more so then most other mechs.


I didn't say anything about being team-reliant before this post, so I have no idea where you got that from.

Oh, you didn't claim such yourself.  That's just been the question I have been asking this entire time since OmegaNull did Regarding (Flak)Scout.

At least I got an answer to that now, even if the answer is apparently "Nope". I can finally shut up, the internet rejoices.