HAWKEN servers are up and our latest minor update is live!
Forgot Password_ SUPPORT REDEEM CODE

Jump to content


I need to hear from the EOC experts among us


  • Please log in to reply
38 replies to this topic

#21 phed

phed

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 722 posts
  • LocationSouthern California

Posted September 19 2014 - 08:17 AM

 SwompKreetcher, on September 18 2014 - 06:55 PM, said:

EOC Infil (i love this little twerp): I'd settle for just a little bit more time to make the trap-laying/hell-pit creation more fun. say, pucks stick for a full 2 minutes.
no other changes. just make it so the EOC is more than an annoying cqc spam weapon at times.

who are you_
smurf_  very young account to have an opinion on the eoc inf...

i found your avatar, i like it.  i only ask cause i use to hang with a dude we called swampcreature, never did find out his actual name, though at the time it didn't really matter...




crafty, i eoc on inf, rocketerer, and pred, but haven't got any time in with it on the raider.  

been playing alot more eoc inf lately and having a blast with it.  

i love the versatility of this weapon, as it allows you to attack across the map where the gl (or klamp) can't reach - for easy assists, play point defense with mines and secondary splash - awesome on the aa or s2 most maps, or even for goomba stomping slags and jomping on heds.  the main thing is for cqc, altitude is key... i bait high flyers into corner humps.

on the subject of charge vs. not charged:  i always charge for corner humping, mine laying, and snipes; but for cqc i will mix it up to keep the opponent guessing and depending on position.  like when on the ground doing a reverse L (where it's dodge/boost/turn i'll blindside them with an uncharged shot to deal damage in that small window where there isn't enough time to charge a shot before they react.  and as a finishing blow, i don't bother to charge of course.

Edited by phed, September 19 2014 - 08:29 AM.


#22 Kopra

Kopra

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 275 posts
  • LocationTurku, Finland

Posted September 19 2014 - 09:12 AM

My, an EOC Raider thread! :D

EOC Raider is by no means bad, but it's highly situational and could be categorized more into the support role. To get the hang of the EOC, I suggest playing a lot of Infiltrator (another favorite of mine) because of its more forgiving secondary and most of all, faster overall movement. The Raider is overall slower but the higher armor and momentary off-the-socks Blitz movement makes it better in many situations, especially in the push/escape department.

Movement is the lifeblood of an EOC user, the instant you stop moving, you DIE (applies to everyone but especially EOC users, people can just swarm and DPS you down without you being able to do anything about it).
Map knowledge is key and you should be able to navigate into cover by just backpedaling/dodging. EOC users either kill their enemies instantly or slowly because of the weapon's discrete nature. You will have to move a lot to stay alive, to finally get into the situations where you actually can kill your enemies with one (or two) strike(s). A positive thing about slow reloading weapons is that you can afford to move more without losing much damage.

When you pick the EOC, you should look at your enemies' mechs and your own. The EOC Raider is especially good at harassing Technicians and slow ground based mechs and pairs well with sustained hitscan frontline mechs. Flanking Reapers are awesome teammates in semi-open maps and you can cover up eachothers' weaknesses.
The EOC Raider is not a good idea if your opposition is keen on flying and going ADHD with the AC (it's a matter of practice to hit midair targets but it will always make it more unreliable), or if you are expected to carry your team. EOC Raider is not a carry mech that you can slap a Technician behind and call it a day. :D

Look at the map. If you think you will have plenty of access to high ground with an escape route or just a lot of cover in general, go for it. Good maps are Wreckage, Uptown and Origin because of their chokepointy nature and/or access to higher elevations, and to a lesser extent Front Line, Facility and Prosk. Do not play EOC in Last Eco or Bunker unless you are way better than your opposition.

You should try to approach enemies from their side, as the EOC is brutal against unaware. The similar projectile speeds of the EOC and Corsair is a nifty feature that you should take advantage of; save your mental calculations for your movement.
Harass and destroy the Technician. Cripple the slow mechs for easy finishing. When pursued, apply escape plans and evasive corner play. Keep your distance until you have enough advantage and finish off, using Blitz as the situation calls for it.

As for internals, I use:

Deflectors, as correctly used they will extend your life to over 640 armor. As you will be moving and boosting a lot in between strikes and especially during Blitz, you will benefit a lot from this internal.

Failsafe, because you can't avoid the CQC forever, and sometimes to finish off an enemy you have to be at a hugging distance.

Basic Fuel Converter, as you will need fuel the most when you are getting attacked. Synergistic with the Failsafe as well, as after finishing off at CQC you get a nice plop of fuel to make your escape.

Air-180, this would need its own thread. In short, it's an awesome cheap internal that makes traversing maps fluid like water, fighting while escaping possible, CQC maneuvers, chasing over ledges, and many more.

You can also try setups like AC/Deflectors/BFC if you don't like the idea of Failsafe or Air-180, or Deflectors/Failsafe/Fuel Converter if you don't like Air-180. I personally don't like AC on this mech because while it's great for corner play and CQC dancing, it takes away from your evasion capability. You can get many of AC's features from Air-180 for just one third the slots.

For items, you can't go wrong with the Shield, EMP or Repair Orb (or if you are being cheeky, Portable Scanner). I use EMP Mk2 and Shield Mk2, as the EMP is by itself an awesome item that can make or break a push and seriously cripples C-classes, and the Shield is a great on-the-spot cover and a getaway card, plus correctly placed it can isolate an enemy from the others, letting you finish off an enemy in peace. Repair orbs are nice when you have to support your teammates or need to bombard extensively while expecting to take at least some damage; you'll be ready to push in with full armor.

So in summary, to be successful as an EOC Raider you have to have the correct map, correct teammates and enemies, and move a lot.

Also, practice, practice and practice! EOC Raider is ungodly amounts of fun and reward, and you will recognize the situations where you should roll it once you have played it enough. Keep in mind that it's still a sidegrade to Reflak/T32, so in the maps where the EOC is good, those are also good for T32 and Reflak. (Again, look at the team composition and see what the team might need).

Edited by Kopra, September 19 2014 - 10:27 AM.


#23 EliteShooter

EliteShooter

    Mr Splash Man

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3,888 posts
  • LocationTunisia

Posted September 19 2014 - 12:06 PM

Kopra, hands down the best EOC raider player ever.













After me ofc ... :P

Posted Image


#24 craftydus

craftydus

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 937 posts
  • LocationIn The Uterus of Love

Posted September 19 2014 - 04:25 PM

The admonishment to not use this combo in a dm or on last eco or bunker, insures that I will be concentrating on playing DM and playing it on Last Eco and Bunker.

But honestly, this stuff is gold.
Thank You for taking some time to share what you know about it!

I don't think a lot of people realize how hard this thing is to survive in and meaningfully contribute toward a team's bottomline with.
Most difficult mech/combo I've played.

#25 M4st0d0n

M4st0d0n

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 770 posts
  • LocationBelgium

Posted September 19 2014 - 06:03 PM

Funny title because I sometimes dont hear EOC being shot or charged at all with this build of the game. Dont know if its bugged or some max channels limit I set.

#26 bad_wolf2013

bad_wolf2013

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 150 posts
  • LocationIndia

Posted September 19 2014 - 09:27 PM

 craftydus, on September 19 2014 - 04:25 PM, said:

The admonishment to not use this combo in a dm or on last eco or bunker, insures that I will be concentrating on playing DM and playing it on Last Eco and Bunker.
I  manage to use it well In dm on bunker, maybe cuz I just stop caring about how I play and go in like a madman.
It's just stupid fun at that time.


#27 bad_wolf2013

bad_wolf2013

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 150 posts
  • LocationIndia

Posted September 19 2014 - 09:57 PM

 M4st0d0n, on September 19 2014 - 06:03 PM, said:

Funny title because I sometimes dont hear EOC being shot or charged at all with this build of the game. Dont know if its bugged or some max channels limit I set.
Yeah its really weird when the PHBBLLT sound doesn't come.

#28 MechFighter5e3bf9

MechFighter5e3bf9

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 272 posts

Posted September 20 2014 - 01:10 AM

eoc raider was first mech/loadout i used in hawken cause i read its highest burst at the time lol i wanted that blam ninja assasin feel, it still can do alphas but you mainly wanna use it standoff distance with corsair in nade mode and when in cqc lay a carpet for them when i used it it was very effective at destroying turret mode mechs not sure if it tears through shield the same anymore

Edited by MechFighter5e3bf9, September 20 2014 - 01:11 AM.

i don't mean any of it

#29 EliteShooter

EliteShooter

    Mr Splash Man

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3,888 posts
  • LocationTunisia

Posted September 20 2014 - 10:52 AM

My infil looks better. And darker ...


Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image

Posted Image


#30 Sylhiri

Sylhiri

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3,135 posts

Posted September 20 2014 - 11:06 AM

 EliteShooter, on September 20 2014 - 10:52 AM, said:

My infil looks better. And darker ...

Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image

Dude, take your cloak off :0

[13:14] <nonsiccus_work> uh oh

there's gravy in my keyboard

----------------------------------------------------------------------

[11:18] <+shosca> if you wanna play ar, go play zerker
[11:18] <Hyginos> and if you want to play zerker, go smc
[11:19] <someone> if you want to play sustain, please go and die in hell


#31 EliteShooter

EliteShooter

    Mr Splash Man

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3,888 posts
  • LocationTunisia

Posted September 20 2014 - 11:44 AM

 Sylhiri, on September 20 2014 - 11:06 AM, said:

 EliteShooter, on September 20 2014 - 10:52 AM, said:

My infil looks better. And darker ...

Posted Image
Posted Image
Posted Image

Dude, take your cloak off :0

ADMIT IT. IT LOOKS ABSOLUTELY AMAZING!

Posted Image


#32 Sylhiri

Sylhiri

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3,135 posts

Posted September 20 2014 - 12:15 PM

Yes... our time with come when the devs finally nerf the RoF of the Flak and Heat Cannon. When that day comes the EOC will rise up and few will be spared :0

[13:14] <nonsiccus_work> uh oh

there's gravy in my keyboard

----------------------------------------------------------------------

[11:18] <+shosca> if you wanna play ar, go play zerker
[11:18] <Hyginos> and if you want to play zerker, go smc
[11:19] <someone> if you want to play sustain, please go and die in hell


#33 Source_Mystic

Source_Mystic

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 74 posts

Posted October 13 2014 - 07:03 PM

Eoc repeater is a awesome weapon but it has the  steepest learning curves in the game. To be effictive with it I  would sugest a few things.

1 Use predator ...  eoc weapons complement each other you want burst dammage. He is king of burst dammage

2 Learn coner play or peek a boo stratages these work best with burst weapons ... do it well and you will take little or no damage.

3 When somone is in chasing you do not flee unless nessacary back up and spam mines in front of them as they advance they will kill themselfs before you die if you doge a bit.

4 Predators heat vision makes conerplay easer as well as when you are not activally using coner play you can use it to flank with impuinity and get the added dammage to c class fluffy back side

5 Sit back and mine escape routes of the other team when they turn arount to flee the advancing team they back up or turn an boom. In a  panic if they try to take to the air to go over detanate the mines blast goes up.  

6 Flank flank flank , eoc weapons are the best nasty suprise in the game when used with skill.

7  Never aim at a target unless they are stationary or boosting straight in one direction ..... always aim for where they will go next ...   aim at feet or hip level.

8 Get airborn , eoc repeater and eoc pred acualy benefit from the added hight ... but by no means stay there long as this will mean certen death for any mech this is best used with the AC and when you enemy is not facing you. use with descression.

9 Get a sheild and make sheild traps with eoc repeater and eoc preditor ... drop 8 eoc stand in the sheild untill the try to enter drop 6 eoc repeater mins befor you exit detante.

10 plan plan plan .... I can not stress this enought .... you need to acess position of mechs and where  they will go next otherwise you are just wasting mines and heat and giving away your position.

11 . ( side note mines can be used for early detection and alarms when repairing or setting up more complex traps.)


Note when setting up traps always start with eoc predator then repeater ... trust me

I hope this helps you get the most out of the eoc repeater

Edited by Source_Mystic, October 13 2014 - 07:17 PM.


#34 ReachH

ReachH

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 2,459 posts
  • LocationUK

Posted October 14 2014 - 09:24 AM

View PostKopra, on September 19 2014 - 09:12 AM, said:

Air-180, this would need its own thread. In short, it's an awesome cheap internal that makes traversing maps fluid like water, fighting while escaping possible, CQC maneuvers, chasing over ledges, and many more.
what_ Did I miss something about how it works_ How does spinning in the air accomplish any of these things_

View Post[HWK]HUGHES, on October 23 2013 - 06:01 PM, said:

Development happens.


Posted Image


#35 Kopra

Kopra

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 275 posts
  • LocationTurku, Finland

Posted October 14 2014 - 09:52 AM

View PostReachH, on October 14 2014 - 09:24 AM, said:

View PostKopra, on September 19 2014 - 09:12 AM, said:

Air-180, this would need its own thread. In short, it's an awesome cheap internal that makes traversing maps fluid like water, fighting while escaping possible, CQC maneuvers, chasing over ledges, and many more.
what_ Did I miss something about how it works_ How does spinning in the air accomplish any of these things_

1. You conserve your momentum in the air while you spin.
2. The spin is 2.5 times faster than the turnrate cap.
3. Canceling "scripted" movement like jump pad parables.

It's not just spinning, it's about combining the features 1 & 2, while 3 is a really nice extra. The internal works best on mechs that have high boost speed and/or high air speed and preferably burst weaponry.

Traversing maps fluid like water comes from all those points, as you can look behind you while still moving forwards. Check your flank, check your teammates, without stopping and for minimal time.

Fighting while escaping comes from being able to boost, jump, air-180, fire, air-180, continue on your escape.

CQC maneuevers come from utilizing the 2.5 faster turn rate speed along with conservation of motion. Boost past an opponent to create distance or save time for your secondary to reload for a finishing shot.

Chasing over ledges is about having your opponent at your crosshairs faster when chasing in a situation where an opponent has fled into a location below you. If directly below, conservation of motion brings the enemy back into the crosshairs.

#36 TwentyFirstPilot

TwentyFirstPilot

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 963 posts
  • LocationCanterstomp, Mechquestria

Posted October 14 2014 - 10:29 AM

View PostKopra, on October 14 2014 - 09:52 AM, said:

View PostReachH, on October 14 2014 - 09:24 AM, said:

View PostKopra, on September 19 2014 - 09:12 AM, said:

Air-180, this would need its own thread. In short, it's an awesome cheap internal that makes traversing maps fluid like water, fighting while escaping possible, CQC maneuvers, chasing over ledges, and many more.
what_ Did I miss something about how it works_ How does spinning in the air accomplish any of these things_

1. You conserve your momentum in the air while you spin.
2. The spin is 2.5 times faster than the turnrate cap.
3. Canceling "scripted" movement like jump pad parables.

It's not just spinning, it's about combining the features 1 & 2, while 3 is a really nice extra. The internal works best on mechs that have high boost speed and/or high air speed and preferably burst weaponry.

Traversing maps fluid like water comes from all those points, as you can look behind you while still moving forwards. Check your flank, check your teammates, without stopping and for minimal time.

Fighting while escaping comes from being able to boost, jump, air-180, fire, air-180, continue on your escape.

CQC maneuevers come from utilizing the 2.5 faster turn rate speed along with conservation of motion. Boost past an opponent to create distance or save time for your secondary to reload for a finishing shot.

Chasing over ledges is about having your opponent at your crosshairs faster when chasing in a situation where an opponent has fled into a location below you. If directly below, conservation of motion brings the enemy back into the crosshairs.

I've heard you praise the air 180 internal quite a few times. I'm now interested. Do you have a montage/match recording of you using it to its fullest potential_ I'd like to see that.

Aspiring Professional Yolodriver


View PostAmidatelion, on May 24 2014 - 01:36 AM, said:

Yeah, but dude, we are at 1750. As much as we would like to be Professional Yolodrivers like you [Meraple] and Lightangel112, we're not there yet. It's something to aspire to, sure, but there's a lot of ground to cover.

View PostEliteShooter, on September 20 2014 - 08:51 PM, said:

I eat cats too. Does that interest you_

#37 Kopra

Kopra

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 275 posts
  • LocationTurku, Finland

Posted October 15 2014 - 06:12 AM

View PostTwentyFirstPilot, on October 14 2014 - 10:29 AM, said:


I've heard you praise the air 180 internal quite a few times. I'm now interested. Do you have a montage/match recording of you using it to its fullest potential_ I'd like to see that.

Will try to see if I can muster up a crude montage of examples.

#38 SoldierHobbes11

SoldierHobbes11

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 564 posts
  • LocationSouthern California

Posted October 26 2014 - 07:48 PM

One main thing to remember about the Repeater is that it's not a single projectile. Might seem obvious but it's something that you need to keep in mind. You can't simply click once and not need to keep your aim aligned. You have to actually keep your aim steady and tracking your target until all the pucks fire. That tends to be the hardest thing to do when using the EOC. It's not just leading the target, it's having to lead the target and track it perfectly for the duration the weapon is firing. If you have trouble doing this, sweep the weapon like a sword in the direction your target is moving. After a while, you'll start to get a good feel of the projectile speed and be able to clean your shots up. That's how I learned to use it. Oh yeah, and there's a little bit of vertical recoil for every puck that's fired. So take note of that when using it at mid to long rages.
Need help with Hawken_ Click here for my Handy Hawken Handbook!

#39 Sylhiri

Sylhiri

    Advanced Member

  • Full Members
  • PipPipPip
  • 3,135 posts

Posted October 27 2014 - 07:04 PM

If your going to sweep the weapon you'll have to get used to the differences in distance and speed of the target. Chances are you'll never hit every puck on a moving target (unless point blank) because the EOC fires fast (time between pucks), if the target is far away then the amount of mouse movement is quite small while the spread is quite wide. Almost the opposite with close range, the amount of movement you need for the mouse is large and the turn speed screws you over.

It's best to aim for the ground at long range, if you overextend your aim you can still get them with pucks but if your dead on then you can hit the hitbox for full damage. Just need to practice to accurately judge between A/B/C walk and boost speeds (including Raider/G2 Raider, Scout and Infil speed boosts) as well as air speed. Then you have to judge the distance for how much you need to lead. You're generally a sitting duck for a second or two while you line up your shots so avoid doing it mid battle, once you get used to the speed you automatically adjust your aim so it does make long shots easier and faster over time. It's the same for Heat Cannon but you need to worry about more then one projectile.

Edited by Sylhiri, October 27 2014 - 07:06 PM.

[13:14] <nonsiccus_work> uh oh

there's gravy in my keyboard

----------------------------------------------------------------------

[11:18] <+shosca> if you wanna play ar, go play zerker
[11:18] <Hyginos> and if you want to play zerker, go smc
[11:19] <someone> if you want to play sustain, please go and die in hell





1 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 1 guests, 0 anonymous users