85 replies to this topic

[Karaipantsu]

It makes sense that a large explosion would knock your mech around.  I don't think it should be present on Hellfires or Seeker missiles, though, nor on the Rev-GL.  The HEAT's kind of iffy, as well.  The only weapons that pack enough punch to allow concussive forces like that should be the TOW and Grenades, in my opinion.  It's a neat mechanic, and it makes logical sense to have it in the game, but not all explosions are equal.

[AsianJoyKiller]

A major problem with the knock back is that it only zeroes your movement. It doesn't actually push you in any direction.
In fact, you could be boosting away from someone, and if they hit you in the back, it stops you.
Yeah. That's right.
Getting hit in the back with an explosive while running away makes you stop.

[Eamonn]

AsianJoyKiller, on December 14 2012 - 12:30 PM, said:

Makina, on December 14 2012 - 12:27 PM, said:

I know this is a real pain, but I like that it does that, feels more natural to me

But is it good gameplay_
Feelings are subjective. Can you show me why explosive stuns are a good mechanic with reason_

As you said, it's all about good positioning, and movement, there's even a dodge mechanic. Explosives should definitely stagger, because it's not as though you don't have the ability to avoid them. Obviously, in certain circumstances it's unavoidable, such as being ambushed etc. But these are things that you have to adapt to as a player. I'm up for leaving it in.

[FenixStryk]

I think a snare on the EOC Repeater is okay considering the limitations of the weapon, but I'm not sure if it should exist elsewhere.

[Elix]

I'm not sure that I agree with removing it, but lessening the effect (so that it might slow you or take a bite out of your momentum) might be a workable alternative.

[Urvanis]

Well while I hate it, because it will often cancel out my maneuvers because my ping is high. ( If I side dodge a tow missile before someone who is closer to the server than I am fires it, I'll warp back to my old position and be stunned and damaged). I don't think its a bad mechanic, it is just fuzzy bunny netcode.

Explosives should have impact, they generate a significant force. I'd like them to influence movement rather than negate. for example. taking a TOW from behind while boosting forward should boost you rather than stop you. given I can understand thrusters shutting down. but your inertia shouldn't be canceled.

I absolutely love how mid air explosive impacts typically force people downward or in off directions when they hit jump pads.

[TwiceDead]

I felt it more than once, and exploited it more than once. It works both ways, what the enemy can do to you, you can do to them. I find it a nice addition that the heavier mechs aren't as affected by this as the lighter ones, a nice trade-off for heightened/lessened mobility if you ask me.

In short: I like it. Makes it feel like explosives hurt, and should be dodged at all cost.

[ReachH]

So I've played more against good RevGL users, and I think that because of the stun lock effect, explosive primary weapons need to have their Rate of Fire carefully considered (*hint*hint*RevGL RoF Nerf).

Also with how laggy the servers are currently, it's extra-jarring when you are stunlocked, because it snaps you back to where you were hit.
(The more I think of it, the more it seems to me that this is an unintentional mechanic.)

The stunlock doesn't work as well vs. forward boosts, so that is a better option when facing the spammy explosive classes. I often chain dodges and diagonal forward boosts when I move, sometimes dropping a TOW/Sabot+Slug in between. Playing around with the pattern a bit more may give a good meta way of fighting stunlock.

[Karaipantsu]

AsianJoyKiller, on December 15 2012 - 04:00 AM, said:

Getting hit in the back with an explosive while running away makes you stop.

Haven't experienced that, but yeah, that's pretty messed up if it's common.

[AsianJoyKiller]

Karaipantsu, on December 15 2012 - 10:57 AM, said:

AsianJoyKiller, on December 15 2012 - 04:00 AM, said:

Getting hit in the back with an explosive while running away makes you stop.

Haven't experienced that, but yeah, that's pretty messed up if it's common.

It happens a lot. In fact, while fight Crayyon on his Grenadier, it would happen multiple times within the span of a few seconds. I would try to run, but the REV would repeated knock me out of boosting and stop me.

[Sylhiri]

I can kind of see stopping in place if I get a direct missile to the face but why should I be planted on the ground afterwards_ Why can't I dodge to the side right after_

[Beefsweat]

No stunlock. What is this, dark souls_ It's an utterly terrible mechanic in this game.

Edited by Beefsweat, December 15 2012 - 11:04 AM.

[Karaipantsu]

AsianJoyKiller, on December 15 2012 - 10:59 AM, said:

It happens a lot. In fact, while fight Crayyon on his Grenadier, it would happen multiple times within the span of a few seconds. I would try to run, but the REV would repeated knock me out of boosting and stop me.

Haven't fought many grenadiers yet.  I'll keep a look out for one and see how bad it is.

[AsianJoyKiller]

Karaipantsu, on December 15 2012 - 11:26 AM, said:

AsianJoyKiller, on December 15 2012 - 10:59 AM, said:

It happens a lot. In fact, while fight Crayyon on his Grenadier, it would happen multiple times within the span of a few seconds. I would try to run, but the REV would repeated knock me out of boosting and stop me.

Haven't fought many grenadiers yet.  I'll keep a look out for one and see how bad it is.

They are the worst offenders.



I should probably clarify something here. I'm not against the idea of explosives pushing mechs around, and the sort of gameplay depth that would come with things like strategically knocking a person around or maybe getting a little extra height with a rocket jump.

What I do have a problem with is how explosives currently just stun you. They don't knock you in any particular direction, unless you're in the air, and just stop you. You can interrupt a dodge, or slow someone down who's running away from you, even if logically the explosives should push them away, not stop them dead.

[Karaipantsu]

Ok, ran into both circumstances tonite, and yes, the Grenadier's ability to lock you up is wicked awful.  Rev-GL is bonkers.  I also got Hellfired in the butt on the way out of an engagement and stopped dead.  Pretty annoying.

[z121231211]

Agree. It feels frustrating to try to dodge and not end up anywhere. I think they should have little effect to you one the ground, in the air I really don't have a problem.

[HugeGuts]

It's a huge pain in the butt as an A class. It nerfs the one thing they're supposed to excel at.

[AussieGrimm]

Is there an effective counter _ Losing control of your character in any game is a frustrating experience, but if I could do something to prevent it (mount something to stop this effect at the cost of something else) it would be better.

If the only counter is "not getting hit," then it sounds like a bit of a broken mechanic.

AussieGrimm

[Makina]

well a shield could help, but not much

[AussieGrimm]

Sounds like a problematic effect then, to me, but then I've only played a couple rounds so far. Generally speaking though, if you don't have a reason not to use a particular attack, and it can't be effectively countered, then it tends to dominate in competitive play.

What are the reasons you wouldn't use an explosive weapon at the moment _ Is there an opportunity cost I'm missing here _ Do they stun , but do relatively little damage compared to all other weapons _