58 replies to this topic

[Akrium]

I dont think we need a clan ranking system for tournies, but instead we just need more clans to participate. This way we can split up the clans into smaller 3-6 clan groups and have those groups play round robin style. You keep track of how many points the winner wins by and then use that as the tie breaker if it is needed. The top 2 or 3 from each group then gets to fight in the tourny just like we held the last one.

This makes there no need for ranking as all teams have to fight to get into the tourny to begin with. This also allows more game play and slight meta because you will be revealing your strats before you even get into the tourny itself. Do you keep the good one for last_ or do you not care and just use it each time hoping no one finds a counter. (yes i know there wouldn't be much of this now, but down the road w/ better balanced items and a better spectator option this could happen).

Eve Online has been doing this for years and it works very well. Granted their whole staffing gets involved and they do a huge production around it. It is a very good watch and it is very interesting each year. I've not played the game in 4 or 5 years and I still love watching it. Usually takes 3 days to complete, but it is quite epic.

[h0B0]

Added a demo system.
added the obligatory Teamwork>skill

Akrium, on January 02 2013 - 04:45 AM, said:

idea

Not necessarily against this idea. However having a ladder in the game would be a good experience for all.

Zeshi, on January 02 2013 - 12:43 AM, said:

Whats really shocking when u look at it is i believe two people accounted for 10 out of the total 12 infil uses (myself and redsdead) 0.0.
Really expected it to be more widespread given its ability to fight so efficiently in the outer missile silos.

NotKjell used it aswell. Lets not forget Heat scout.

BeelzeBuff, on January 01 2013 - 06:48 PM, said:

About the mechs themselves, it was pretty boring to see nonstop TOWs and hitscan weapons. Boring to watch, very little variety.

as its been said previously this will change with the balance fixes to some weapons (revGL and EOC) and more mechs/weapons will add variety. also read my reply concerning the heat.

Zeshi, on January 01 2013 - 05:22 PM, said:

I learned that it is probably not going to be necessary to restrict the amount of each weight class in future tournaments. I feared a world where teams would roll all A class or all CRT Recruit but thankfully that didn't happen

Memory might be a bit foggy but i'm pretty sure the 1-2 times i saw an all A team, it lost. Not sure if due to the fact they were all A.

BeefC4ke, on January 01 2013 - 05:12 PM, said:

The problem I noticed with SS is that it is too dependent on the player's ping making it pretty useless in comp play if your ping is above 90.

I was surprised to not see more HEAT cannon use. I may have just missed it but I only really remember seeing like 3 mechs really using HEAT.

The SS is far from optimal on Origin/MA. Concidering the game mode requires you to stand on a point to be effective it kind of puts the SS in a bad position most of the time. Furthermore the SS requires a lot of support from your team and skill. I think although a lot of participants were very skilled, the skill level of players/teams right now is relatively low. In time with more maps better teamwork and different modes we might eventually get to see the SS show its true potential.

About the heat. So were we. However i think once again it comes back to the overall skill level of participating teams not being anywhere near the skill ceiling of the game is. The scout has a similar burst on a hitscan weapon and TOW. Which makes it easier to use. The berserker has its ability, some players might believe 15% increased damage gives them an advantage and opted for that instead. No offense to the teams participating. We intended to run 2 a-class heat users, but due to skill/practice restriction only had 1.

[Rei]

I wish I could've made it to this tournament, but out of town. I would like to cast an event some time.

[Cpt_Kill_Jack]

One thing to note about the CRT stats. The spectators are listed as using CRT mechs. So 2 x every match would lead you to a misnomer for those stats. Just thought I would point that out as it was an observation i took during the tournament.

Extra points. The spectator and Private server features are not complete yet. Chances are that this is why the team switch did not work when spectators were in. In the future I bet that they will be on a separate team for spectators and wont interfere with the teams.

Edited by Cpt_Kill_Jack, January 02 2013 - 01:05 PM.

[ReachH]

We learnt that selective use of Class Cs wins tourneys.

[ApoC_101]

Yep I counted lots of Brawlers during the event, and bought one the next day... it quickly became my new favourite... and also pushed me to play with my Cupcake more often, which I also now really love. And then I got the Infiltrator finally... so now I'm totally stoked from more variety in my play style.

end result, in 3 days flat I seriously upped my overall game and doubled my mech mastery... yea baby

Edited by ApoC_101, January 02 2013 - 01:17 PM.

[ReachH]

And that I am the best SS in the world.

BURRRNNNNNNN

[ApoC_101]

ReachH, on January 02 2013 - 01:20 PM, said:

And that I am the best SS in the world.

BURRRNNNNNNN

Damn you... I was so looking forward to making some kills with mine, didn't expect anyone else to seriously try SS'ing in that tourney... either way I failed

[h0B0]

Cpt_Kill_Jack, on January 02 2013 - 12:53 PM, said:

One thing to note about the CRT stats. The spectators are listed as using CRT mechs. So 2 x every match would lead you to a misnomer for those stats. Just thought I would point that out as it was an observation i took during the tournament.

Extra points. The spectator and Private server features are not complete yet. Chances are that this is why the team switch did not work when spectators were in. In the future I bet that they will be on a separate team for spectators and wont interfere with the teams.

I counted those stats personally and made sure not to take into account Xacius or observers.

i am sure a few things i have mentioned were on their radar, but there is no harm in pointing things out, who knows they might forget a thing here and there.

[Raygin]

For the next tournament, I'd suggest a class and type of mech restriction, along with bumping up the number of mechs per team to six.

For example, a team could consist of:

1 Bruiser
1 Rocketeer
1 Assault
1 Sharpshooter
1 Scout
1 Infiltrator

While another could consist of

1 Grenader
1 Rocketeer
1 Bruiser
1 Assault
1 Infiltrator
1 berserker

This would promote team diversity, along with different compositions and allowing for a metagame to grow rather than go for a specific standard of what seems to be the most powerful mech in each class. It also allows for a wide range of tactics and compositions to be used rather than diliberate restrictions that promote the stagnation of tactics.

Edited by Raygin, January 02 2013 - 02:19 PM.

[FenixStryk]

Raygin, on January 02 2013 - 02:18 PM, said:

For the next tournament, I'd suggest a class and type of mech restriction, along with bumping up the number of mechs per team to six.

I'd be most interested in listening to the planning phase for each clan participating in this hypothetical tournament. Would the CRT and Assault count as different Mechs_ Would the Vanguard or CRT be banned_ What would stop teams from simply stacking the "good" Mechs, read: 1 Brawler, 1 Grenadier, 1 CRT, 1 Scout, 1 Berserker and 1 Infiltrator (possibly switching out one of the A's for an Assault or Bruiser)_

I see this kind of restriction reaching stagnation sooner than a No Restrictions tournament, simply because it boils down to a choice of "don't use the 3 fuzziest Mechs in the game". There aren't anyas many offbeat gimmick strategies you can form around this.

Edited by FenixStryk, January 02 2013 - 02:50 PM.

[Epistrophe]

As far as spectating goes I think there should be something automated in the ui to show mech switches on respawn and a more visually streamlined way to check what everyone's running and the scores than the current tab system (at least lower opacity or something).

[Vulix]

Why not just ban the CRT from future tournaments_ It seems like it would be a good move if you're wanting people to use different mechs. I would ban the Vanguard too as it's not accessible to everyone, and I predict eventually a tournament participant will cry about it a lot one day because they can't use the mech but their enemy can (of course someone will complain about this, this is an online game afterall =P)

[Rei]

Vulix, on January 02 2013 - 03:27 PM, said:

Why not just ban the CRT from future tournaments_ It seems like it would be a good move if you're wanting people to use different mechs. I would ban the Vanguard too as it's not accessible to everyone, and I predict eventually a tournament participant will cry about it a lot one day because they can't use the mech but their enemy can (of course someone will complain about this, this is an online game afterall =P)

But no one wants to buy the assault D:. Banning recruit internals shouldn't be a problem. That can be coded in pretty easily. Just gotta have a flag for no recruit equip and it checks before you join saying "so-and-so has recruit equipment attached. You will not be able to use this mech in this mode. Continue Anyway_"

[Raygin]

Rei, on January 02 2013 - 03:38 PM, said:

Vulix, on January 02 2013 - 03:27 PM, said:

Why not just ban the CRT from future tournaments_ It seems like it would be a good move if you're wanting people to use different mechs. I would ban the Vanguard too as it's not accessible to everyone, and I predict eventually a tournament participant will cry about it a lot one day because they can't use the mech but their enemy can (of course someone will complain about this, this is an online game afterall =P)

But no one wants to buy the assault D:. Banning recruit internals shouldn't be a problem. That can be coded in pretty easily. Just gotta have a flag for no recruit equip and it checks before you join saying "so-and-so has recruit equipment attached. You will not be able to use this mech in this mode. Continue Anyway_"

Or just adding the downsides in tournament games.

[h0B0]

Not sure restricting mech usage is very good for the competitive scene.
It could however be entertaining for scriming and balance testing.

[Akrium]

h0B0, on January 02 2013 - 06:42 PM, said:

Not sure restricting mech usage is very good for the competitive scene.
It could however be entertaining for scriming and balance testing.

actually there was a league in tfc days called Highlander and it's only different rule from normal league gaming was that there could only be 1 of any said class. And it was extremely fun.

It did bring a lot of diversity to the play.

[Raygin]

Akrium, on January 02 2013 - 07:03 PM, said:

h0B0, on January 02 2013 - 06:42 PM, said:

Not sure restricting mech usage is very good for the competitive scene.
It could however be entertaining for scriming and balance testing.

actually there was a league in tfc days called Highlander and it's only different rule from normal league gaming was that there could only be 1 of any said class. And it was extremely fun.

It did bring a lot of diversity to the play.

It's in TF2 as well, and I completely agree with that diversity statement.

[BeefC4ke]

FenixStryk, on January 02 2013 - 02:49 PM, said:

Raygin, on January 02 2013 - 02:18 PM, said:

For the next tournament, I'd suggest a class and type of mech restriction, along with bumping up the number of mechs per team to six.

I'd be most interested in listening to the planning phase for each clan participating in this hypothetical tournament. Would the CRT and Assault count as different Mechs_ Would the Vanguard or CRT be banned_ What would stop teams from simply stacking the "good" Mechs, read: 1 Brawler, 1 Grenadier, 1 CRT, 1 Scout, 1 Berserker and 1 Infiltrator (possibly switching out one of the A's for an Assault or Bruiser)_

I see this kind of restriction reaching stagnation sooner than a No Restrictions tournament, simply because it boils down to a choice of "don't use the 3 fuzziest Mechs in the game". There aren't anyas many offbeat gimmick strategies you can form around this.

You could add a clause that says a mech like the Rocketeer, bruiser, SS, or any other mech considered to not be as good, has to be included in the team comp while allowing the other slots to be filled as they please. I don't know how fun it would be or even if I would support it, but it would add variety and force some interesting teamwork.

[h0B0]

Akrium, on January 02 2013 - 07:03 PM, said:

h0B0, on January 02 2013 - 06:42 PM, said:

Not sure restricting mech usage is very good for the competitive scene.
It could however be entertaining for scriming and balance testing.

actually there was a league in tfc days called Highlander and it's only different rule from normal league gaming was that there could only be 1 of any said class. And it was extremely fun.

It did bring a lot of diversity to the play.

i guess this only goes to show how little i know about competitive play.
Diversity is always good in my opinion.