191 replies to this topic

[ReachH]

Some people think that DoF adds to immersion as a sniper, and adds an extra dimension to long range play. I don't know who these people are, but I would never look one in the eye. Some people just play the game, and don't care what people do with their own settings. According to the Geneva Convention and Universal Declaration of Human rights, we need more servers so as not to discriminate against the weirdos.

We also need special servers for people who want to play with cars on/off, with Ambient Occulsion on/off, with bloom on/off, and camera shake, oh and of course for the colour blind as well.

Meteor needs to provide us with 2^6=64 variations of servers.

Those are the pressing issues. Some other ones include : CQC mech only servers (e.g. no SS/Reap), Floaty servers (no dodge), also man-mode servers (if you run away from a battle you spontaneously ignite and take damage until you are taking damage from someones weapons again.)

Kind Regards,

ReachH

[Gagzila]

ReachH, on February 16 2013 - 03:05 AM, said:

Some people think that DoF adds to immersion as a sniper, and adds an extra dimension to long range play. I don't know who these people are, but I would never look one in the eye. Some people just play the game, and don't care what people do with their own settings. According to the Geneva Convention and Universal Declaration of Human rights, we need more servers so as not to discriminate against the weirdos.

We also need special servers for people who want to play with cars on/off, with Ambient Occulsion on/off, with bloom on/off, and camera shake, oh and of course for the colour blind as well.

Meteor needs to provide us with 2^6=64 variations of servers.

Those are the pressing issues. Some other ones include : CQC mech only servers (e.g. no SS/Reap), Floaty servers (no dodge), also man-mode servers (if you run away from a battle you spontaneously ignite and take damage until you are taking damage from someones weapons again.)

Kind Regards,

ReachH

Nice jug of sarcasm you have there.

You can stop being an ass now...



Cheers,

Gagzila

[ReachH]

I'm sorry I couldn't resist.

[Tomino_sama]

I have EVERYTHING on. (that matters)

I disabled Camera Shake as I do in all games.

It causes Migraines. I experienced this personally from my 28th Birthday onwards, No problem until then, plain an simple. Do not force me to endure 5 hours of agonizing pain focused behind my Right Eye. If you want other Players to develop a sensitivity to this kind of thing, please do make this option MANDATORY.

ye gads man! Think of the CHILDREN

Edited by Tomino_sama, February 16 2013 - 06:30 AM.

[Puredeath]

First background info about me:
1 i play with about 7-8fps on min graphics.
2: i run min cockpit shake becuase as is when i get shot in the face with hail fire rockets i drop to 1 fps at best adding shake witch would bring me down to  most likely 5fps best just walking and 0 fps when i get shot.

PLEASE MAKE IT MANDATORY so that this game will gang fuzzy bunny my gpu even more.

[Gagzila]

Tomino_sama, on February 16 2013 - 06:28 AM, said:

If you want other Players to develop a sensitivity to this kind of thing, please do make this option MANDATORY.

Puredeath, on February 21 2013 - 12:18 PM, said:

PLEASE MAKE IT MANDATORY so that this game will gang fuzzy bunny my gpu even more.

PLEASE MAKE IT MANDATORY that you both go back and read the thread properly and continue to do so for other threads...no where is anyone asking for screen shake to be mandatory for all players.

Get it right or GTFO!

Cheers,

Gagzila

[Nept]

I'm not sure why there's so much hostility toward the original poster and their suggestion.  If anyone's over 20 and has competitive experience with FPS games, they'll recognize that "hardcore" servers have been commonplace for years.  Perhaps the detractors fear a fracturing of an already small community; perhaps they're worried that this mode would require significant development time; or perhaps we're just experiencing the ever-popular bandwagon effect and its interaction with internet anonymity.

Personally, I'm not fussed either way: implementing this mode would require minimal development effort, and would result in a simple toggle when setting up servers.  If you're not interested in immersion, you needn't join such servers.  Pretty simple.  On the other hand, I'm not particularly interested in "hardcore" modes myself.  In the past, my team's typically joined "hardcore" leagues only after taking the regular ladders/leagues.  Sometimes it's an interesting and worthwhile experience, though.

TL;DNR
Stop being d0uchenozzles.

[AsianJoyKiller]

I took the liberty of moving this to the proper thread.

Gagzila, on February 21 2013 - 04:36 PM, said:

AsianJoyKiller, on February 21 2013 - 04:31 PM, said:

Oh nonono, my friend.
You are the one pushing for change. You're the one who needs to bring the proof.

If you are going to debate my arguments, you must also back them with fact and proof otherwise you're wasting your breath. I've already stated as others have where the proof lies for our side of the argument...you ignoring it doesn't make it any less valid.

Cheers,

Gagzila

Shifting the burden of proof to those who are providing criticism of the argument is a logical fallacy known as "appealing to ignorance", in other words, saying something must be true because it hasn't been proven false.

You made the claim that screen shake creates a disadvantage. That means the burden of proof false on you to provide evidence that your claim holds true, especially since your claimed "disadvantage" from an optional immersion feature is what you believe is something worth fracturing the population over.

Edited by AsianJoyKiller, February 21 2013 - 05:14 PM.

[Puredeath]

gagzila it was in response to everyone elses suggestion i read the entire thread and op. including the 2 pages on the meaning of less than. now please grow up, and dont point out others flaws if you have some (what i feel) are major ones of your own. The cuurent game has camera shake as is i dont see why this hasent been closed. and if anyone wants to comment on my poor use of english, does all a favor and take your computer to your shower, drop kick it in and turn the shower on. I am in a fowl mood becuase of Gagzila's almost constant contradiction and apperent need to have the last say.

[Puredeath]

gagzila it was in response to everyone elses suggestion i read the entire thread and op. including the 2 pages on the meaning of less than. now please grow up, and dont point out others flaws if you have some (what i feel) are major ones of your own. The cuurent game has camera shake as is i dont see why this hasent been closed. and if anyone wants to comment on my poor use of english, does all a favor and take your computer to your shower, drop kick it in and turn the shower on. I am in a fowl mood becuase of Gagzila's almost constant contradiction and apperent need to have the last say.

[Puredeath]

asianjoykiller there is a diffrence between camera shake on and off. want proof go to settings. want to say that someone cant make opinion without data on hand to back it up_ when its as simple as more or less do you like regular milk or chocolate milk_ (yes i know were talking about camera shake). please stop bickering over stuff that has no reason to even be bickered about just for the sake of getting more posts.
Now i would like to end this on a constructive note. I feel camera shake should not be mandatory becuase as i said before it hurts fps performance serverly. My evidence: normal is arnound 7-8 fps with it on minimal camera shake, with it on max im luck to get past 5. making it mandatory would make this beyond playable on the fps side alone, and that much camera shake, as many before me have said cuases ill-health effects. I find this game very entertaining for the 5hrs i spend playing pc games every week day, and would have to find a diffrent game to play that most likely wont be a FPS.

[Gagzila]

AsianJoyKiller, on February 21 2013 - 05:13 PM, said:

Shifting the burden of proof to those who are providing criticism of the argument is a logical fallacy known as "appealing to ignorance", in other words, saying something must be true because it hasn't been proven false.

You made the claim that screen shake creates a disadvantage. That means the burden of proof false on you to provide evidence that your claim holds true, especially since your claimed "disadvantage" from an optional immersion feature is what you believe is something worth fracturing the population over.

Call it whatever you want and again, proof has been provided in previous posts.

Yes it is worth fracturing the population over, not at this point in time but once it gets big enough and there are enough other features to warrant a host of server side options to cater for various play styles and tastes.

Puredeath, on February 21 2013 - 07:08 PM, said:

gagzila it was in response to everyone elses suggestion i read the entire thread and op. including the 2 pages on the meaning of less than. now please grow up, and dont point out others flaws if you have some (what i feel) are major ones of your own. The cuurent game has camera shake as is i dont see why this hasent been closed. and if anyone wants to comment on my poor use of english, does all a favor and take your computer to your shower, drop kick it in and turn the shower on. I am in a fowl mood becuase of Gagzila's almost constant contradiction and apperent need to have the last say.

Puredeath, on February 21 2013 - 07:25 PM, said:

asianjoykiller there is a diffrence between camera shake on and off. want proof go to settings. want to say that someone cant make opinion without data on hand to back it up_ when its as simple as more or less do you like regular milk or chocolate milk_ (yes i know were talking about camera shake). please stop bickering over stuff that has no reason to even be bickered about just for the sake of getting more posts.
Now i would like to end this on a constructive note. I feel camera shake should not be mandatory becuase as i said before it hurts fps performance serverly. My evidence: normal is arnound 7-8 fps with it on minimal camera shake, with it on max im luck to get past 5. making it mandatory would make this beyond playable on the fps side alone, and that much camera shake, as many before me have said cuases ill-health effects. I find this game very entertaining for the 5hrs i spend playing pc games every week day, and would have to find a diffrent game to play that most likely wont be a FPS.

If you don't have a good grasp on english (is that the reason for the poor use of it_) then you should read even more carefully before posting. Anyone arguing in this thread for this "option" have never said they want it to be mandatory for all players. I have not contradicted myself once and AJK is against this and clearly knows the difference between camera shake on and off from his various responses...this clearly indicates you have either A. not read all the posts in this thread before replying to them or B. do not understand the posts.

Cheers,

Gagzila

[AsianJoyKiller]

Gagzila, on February 21 2013 - 07:40 PM, said:

Call it whatever you want and again, proof has been provided in previous posts.

http://en.wikipedia....cdotal_evidence

Give me something concrete to work with.

[Puredeath]

Gagzila, on February 21 2013 - 07:40 PM, said:

AsianJoyKiller, on February 21 2013 - 05:13 PM, said:

Shifting the burden of proof to those who are providing criticism of the argument is a logical fallacy known as "appealing to ignorance", in other words, saying something must be true because it hasn't been proven false.

You made the claim that screen shake creates a disadvantage. That means the burden of proof false on you to provide evidence that your claim holds true, especially since your claimed "disadvantage" from an optional immersion feature is what you believe is something worth fracturing the population over.

Call it whatever you want and again, proof has been provided in previous posts.

Yes it is worth fracturing the population over, not at this point in time but once it gets big enough and there are enough other features to warrant a host of server side options to cater for various play styles and tastes.

Puredeath, on February 21 2013 - 07:08 PM, said:

gagzila it was in response to everyone elses suggestion i read the entire thread and op. including the 2 pages on the meaning of less than. now please grow up, and dont point out others flaws if you have some (what i feel) are major ones of your own. The cuurent game has camera shake as is i dont see why this hasent been closed. and if anyone wants to comment on my poor use of english, does all a favor and take your computer to your shower, drop kick it in and turn the shower on. I am in a fowl mood becuase of Gagzila's almost constant contradiction and apperent need to have the last say.

Puredeath, on February 21 2013 - 07:25 PM, said:

asianjoykiller there is a diffrence between camera shake on and off. want proof go to settings. want to say that someone cant make opinion without data on hand to back it up_ when its as simple as more or less do you like regular milk or chocolate milk_ (yes i know were talking about camera shake). please stop bickering over stuff that has no reason to even be bickered about just for the sake of getting more posts.
Now i would like to end this on a constructive note. I feel camera shake should not be mandatory becuase as i said before it hurts fps performance serverly. My evidence: normal is arnound 7-8 fps with it on minimal camera shake, with it on max im luck to get past 5. making it mandatory would make this beyond playable on the fps side alone, and that much camera shake, as many before me have said cuases ill-health effects. I find this game very entertaining for the 5hrs i spend playing pc games every week day, and would have to find a diffrent game to play that most likely wont be a FPS.

If you don't have a good grasp on english (is that the reason for the poor use of it_) then you should read even more carefully before posting. Anyone arguing in this thread for this "option" have never said they want it to be mandatory for all players. I have not contradicted myself once and AJK is against this and clearly knows the difference between camera shake on and off from his various responses...this clearly indicates you have either A. not read all the posts in this thread before replying to them or B. do not understand the posts.

Cheers,

Gagzila

Name of thread "Make Camera Shake _Mandatory_"... That must mean that this thread is REALLY about making it an option witch it ALL READY is. Next time read the thread name. Also in Op "So, my suggestion, initially, was to make Camera Shake settings Mandatory." and I was commenting on original reason for this thread.

Edited by Puredeath, February 22 2013 - 06:38 PM.

[NBShoot_me]

AsianJoyKiller, on February 21 2013 - 07:54 PM, said:

Gagzila, on February 21 2013 - 07:40 PM, said:

Call it whatever you want and again, proof has been provided in previous posts.

http://en.wikipedia....cdotal_evidence

Give me something concrete to work with.

How about bacon.  That stuff is awesome.  This thread on the other hand..... uuugggghhhhhh.....

[Gagzila]

Puredeath, on February 22 2013 - 06:34 PM, said:

Name of thread "Make Camera Shake _Mandatory_"... That must mean that this thread is REALLY about making it an option witch it ALL READY is. Next time read the thread name. Also in Op "So, my suggestion, initially, was to make Camera Shake settings Mandatory." and I was commenting on original reason for this thread.

AGAIN, read the OP!! Maybe if you read it properly, you would realise the title was simply designed to grab attention to the topic after which he reveals that he realises it cannot be mandatory and so would like to discuss the option of having it as a match maker preference and the rest of the thread goes on to talk about the same thing - having it as a server side option. You even quoted the part yourself where he says it was his initial suggestion, indicating that this is no longer the case!...Sheesshh!!

Calaban619, on January 31 2013 - 03:45 PM, said:

So, my suggestion, initially, was to make Camera Shake settings Mandatory. But then I realized some people out there with little fuzzy bunny bellies might get motion sickness or something, So rather than make it mandatory, instead have a Matchup preference that can be checked before finding a match...

So get your act straight and when you want to discuss the actual current topic of making forced camera shake a server side option, come back and post in context to what has already been said by everyone else. Anything else and you're just trolling.

Cheers,

Gagzila

Edited by Gagzila, February 25 2013 - 08:38 PM.

[Gagzila]

Hey AJK,

I would just like to point out this poll in relation to this topic and that 90 people actually voted to "keep camera shake the way it is" and for others to "just deal with it" versus only 68 people that voted the other way - to have an option to disable it. I was one of those 68.

Gagzila, on February 14 2013 - 06:05 PM, said:

I voted to have the option to remove it (which I think you can now anyway or at least turn it down to low) since it causes some people to be physically sick but there needs to be a third poll option - "Have the option to remove it and a server side option to force it on - everyone wins!"

Having the option to disable camera shake is very similar to having different view perspective options and games that have these kind of options have server side enforcement options so as to cater for those that want to play with a certain view and know that everyone else is the same and therefore promoting a level playing field.

You can see that there was a majority FOR camera shake and the minority that voted to have it optional would likely be the majority of the group of people who can't play with it on.

So I think it is obvious that I am not the one advocating for the exclusion of anyone, but rather the opposite while simply asking for the option to continue playing the game as I want to experience it without having to cop a disadvantage, if you can't play with this option on them I am sorry but it's not my problem and I shouldn't be penalised for it. Vice versa, you shouldn't be penalised either and the devs have recognised this by allowing the option to be disabled for someone such as yourself.

And you want proof_ What more proof do I need than the obvious fact from such an example as: you are driving a car, I am sitting behind on the rear seat with my hands on your head and shaking it to the extent that it is causing your vision to jar. Your ability to drive with accurateness is significantly less than if you had stable and smooth vision.

Would you say it is fair to go to a race course like this and race against other people who don't have someone shaking their head around_ Off course not. At least Hawken allows you to turn camera shake off, let us have our race track in the next paddock where everyone has someone shaking their head and you can continue racing against everyone else that either also have tossed out their head shaker or don't care how much their head is being shaken while competing against you. That is off course once there are enough "racers" to open up more "paddocks"

You may not relate with the example but you can apply the principle to any scenario and still reach the obvious conclusion that if your vision is blurred / shaken then it affects your performance on many different levels. Asking for "hard proof" is redundant beside the obvious fact that it does not need proving - it's already a given.

Cheers,

Gagzila

Edited by Gagzila, February 25 2013 - 08:36 PM.

[AsianJoyKiller]

ITT: Gagzilla equates being physically shaken violently in real life to a visual effect in a virtual world and calls it accurate.
Nice invalid analogy.

Seriously man. You need to stop it. You're embarrassing yourself.

[Gagzila]

AsianJoyKiller, on February 25 2013 - 08:36 PM, said:

ITT: Gagzilla equates being physically shaken violently in real life to a visual effect in a virtual world and calls it accurate.
Nice invalid analogy.

Seriously man. You need to stop it. You're embarrassing yourself.

No, you just need to grow up and learn how to speak with other adults instead of always reverting to "your argument is invalid"...that in itself invalidates nothing. I must actually be hitting pretty close to the mark if that's all you can come back with.

Your inability to reasonably concede to any extent on any given point shows what an egotistic and immature person you are. All I am doing is trying to help you see it from my perspective...I've already acknowledged your's and accepted it.

Good luck getting through life with an attitude like yours.

Cheers,

Gagzila

Edited by Gagzila, February 25 2013 - 08:51 PM.

[AsianJoyKiller]

Gagzila, on February 25 2013 - 08:51 PM, said:

AsianJoyKiller, on February 25 2013 - 08:36 PM, said:

ITT: Gagzilla equates being physically shaken violently in real life to a visual effect in a virtual world and calls it accurate.
Nice invalid analogy.

Seriously man. You need to stop it. You're embarrassing yourself.

No, you just need to grow up and learn how to speak with other adults instead of always reverting to "your argument is invalid"...that in itself invalidates nothing. I must actually be hitting pretty close to the mark if that's all you can come back with.

I'm sorry you don't like it, but it is an invalid analogy.
While they share the superficial aspect of being types of "shakes" the function very differently.
You can not claim that having someone grab you by the head and shaking you in real life is functionally similar to simulated screen shake that you have the option to turn down or off.
I honestly don't know how you can't see the major differences that separate the two.

Quote

Your inability to reasonably concede to any extent on any given point shows what an egotistic and immature person you are. All I am doing is trying to help you see it from my perspective...I've already acknowledged your's and accepted it.

I'd except your points if they were logical and you didn't try to pervert facts into something they aren't.
And if you've accepted my position, then why are you still arguing_

Quote

Good luck getting through life with an attitude like yours.

Right back at ya buddy.

Edited by AsianJoyKiller, February 25 2013 - 09:08 PM.