65 replies to this topic

[Super_Pickle]

I think the most frustrating thing right now is the A class mechs. There are a few nitpicks with balance, but level 25 scouts and infiltrators are stupidly overpowered if played correctly. The ratio of truly good players of B and C class mechs is relatively low. There are some insanely good players who go with B or C class, but I'm able to match their skill in a 1vs1. In my raider, the direction I approach from, the position of the enemy / cover, and support from our respective teams are usually the deciding factors when I'm against a really good B or C class mech. It's a pretty fair fight, even if they're a little better than me. Meanwhile, when I'm up against a half decent player in a scout or an infiltrator, I can easily get my rear end handed to me on a platter, even when I have a clear advantage at the start of the fight. (I have full HP and they’ve got half, or I’m blitzing in as they’re running, or they’re repairing, ect.)

When you look at the maneuverability and the huge burst damage of the scout/ infiltrator, coupled with the infiltrator bouncing nades around corners and the scout ‘s ability to boost like crazy, they’re pretty much the best mechs available at the higher levels. All of the A class mechs have really good maneuverability, and the top level pilots can abuse that to unreasonable ends. There’s simply more room for improvement when playing light mechs than there is with C class mechs, and there's no easy way to fix that without ruining the mech for the lower levels.

Ironically, I love seeing a A class hovering in mid air. I change to the MIRV and blast them with that and the EOC. I can hit them for a BIG chunk of health because their flight path is extremely predictable and landing all my shots isn’t very difficult. Without a good pilot, a mechs are extremely easy to kill. I can literally kill an A class with one properly placed alpha strike. The problem is landing that strike when there is a good pilot.

Edited by Super_Pickle, August 30 2013 - 11:35 AM.

[Command0Dude]

Everyone knows C class are underpowered due to turret mode sucking. Brawler used to have a useful turret mode until they nerfed it for some stupid reason.

[Alexandus]

Super_Pickle, on August 30 2013 - 11:34 AM, said:

I think the most frustrating thing right now is the A class mechs. There are a few nitpicks with balance, but level 25 scouts and infiltrators are stupidly overpowered if played correctly. The ratio of truly good players of B and C class mechs is relatively low. There are some insanely good players who go with B or C class, but I'm able to match their skill in a 1vs1. In my raider, the direction I approach from, the position of the enemy / cover, and support from our respective teams are usually the deciding factors when I'm against a really good B or C class mech. It's a pretty fair fight, even if they're a little better than me. Meanwhile, when I'm up against a half decent player in a scout or an infiltrator, I can easily get my rear end handed to me on a platter, even when I have a clear advantage at the start of the fight. (I have full HP and they’ve got half, or I’m blitzing in as they’re running, or they’re repairing, ect.)

When you look at the maneuverability and the huge burst damage of the scout/ infiltrator, coupled with the infiltrator bouncing nades around corners and the scout ‘s ability to boost like crazy, they’re pretty much the best mechs available at the higher levels. All of the A class mechs have really good maneuverability, and the top level pilots can abuse that to unreasonable ends. There’s simply more room for improvement when playing light mechs than there is with C class mechs, and there's no easy way to fix that without ruining the mech for the lower levels.

Ironically, I love seeing a A class hovering in mid air. I change to the MIRV and blast them with that and the EOC. I can hit them for a BIG chunk of health because their flight path is extremely predictable and landing all my shots isn’t very difficult. Without a good pilot, a mechs are extremely easy to kill. I can literally kill an A class with one properly placed alpha strike. The problem is landing that strike when there is a good pilot.

These are pretty much my thoughts to a T. Thank you for putting them up here and saving me the time Super_Pickle.

A classes are much too agile (with utilization of boosters) as it is right now. I have played in many Advanced games where the other team is > 75% A class mechs and most of the time, they win.

As I perceive the mobility ratios now (With ratings of A being the highest and C being the slowest):

A Class- "A" Walking Speed, "A" Boost Speed, "A" Fuel Supply
B Class- "B" Walking Speed, "B" Boost Speed, "A" Fuel Supply
C Class- "C" Walking Speed, "C"Boost Speed, "A" Fuel Supply

Again the above is my perception, as is the suggestion below with how I perceive the settings should be:

A Class- "A" Walking Speed, "A" Boost Speed, "C" Fuel Supply (Exception: Scout- "B" Fuel Supply)
B Class- "B" Walking Speed, "B" Boost Speed, "B" Fuel Supply
C Class- "C" Walking Speed, "C"Boost Speed, "A" Fuel Supply

With such a change, the A classes will need to rely more on the timing of their boosts, rather than spamming them to get out of the way.

[Satanasitox]

NO!! no lagg compensation OMG!!

[CommandX3]

It might be interesting to see how the fuel use changes in the new patch, I know that the health of the different mechs are no longer universal, and that movement looks like it could vary, check out what saturnine wrote in his guide. https://community.pl...to-the-classes/

[Kmaleon73]

No, no no, not balanced at all, and I hope that you really deleted, because there is no need and it is proven, and besides I already posted and I have opened a topic about this, swings only when starting the room but if quiedan empty seats, it always swings Sentium team ever, and although those are a SECT Prozk than coming Sentium side, and I can give examples of players who enter hell with other demons on one side than in minutes and have in their account of kills 40-50 deaths, so the car balance never served and do not think I ever will, hoping that with the mega patch this go away and we want to play together our team we can do quietly and enjoy the game lose or win

[CommandX3]

Kmaleon73, on September 05 2013 - 07:38 AM, said:

No, no no, not balanced at all, and I hope that you really deleted, because there is no need and it is proven, and besides I already posted and I have opened a topic about this, swings only when starting the room but if quiedan empty seats, it always swings Sentium team ever, and although those are a SECT Prozk than coming Sentium side, and I can give examples of players who enter hell with other demons on one side than in minutes and have in their account of kills 40-50 deaths, so the car balance never served and do not think I ever will, hoping that with the mega patch this go away and we want to play together our team we can do quietly and enjoy the game lose or win

Please say that again, I totally missed what you are trying to say. Use multiple sentences this time.

[Kmaleon73]

Sorry I use the Google translator to explain.

not balanced at all, just balances the start of the game, started the game after the player enters the level on the side of leaving Sentium Prosk unbalanced side.

I have seen cases where real demons are on one side that are about 30 minutes or 40 deaths, and if the game drags on, easy reach the 80, turning the game into a real butcher.

I have a topic on this subject and I've seen others about it and those who really want to play quality games we did not get into the system inefficient

I hope now if I have explained better

[N0stalgia]

Hawken is inherently unblanaced. It is going in the direction of perfect imbalance as others have previously stated. Look it up sometime.

[The_Silencer]

N0stalgia, on September 05 2013 - 08:45 PM, said:

Hawken is inherently unblanaced. It is going in the direction of perfect imbalance as others have previously stated. Look it up sometime.

1.- Inherently unbalanced_ -> syllogism 1.

2.- Perfect imbalance_ -> syllogism 2.

3.- Look it up sometime_ -> Eh_

- The_Syllencer.

P.S. Bubi

[M4st0d0n]

It's flawed logic.

Perfect imbalance is the title of a Penny Arcade's Extra Credits episode some guys used on the forum to justify their mechs were slightly overpowered. It's six minutes of condensed toughts about gamedesign and induced imbalance in a strategy game to hook up the players.

Funnily, they released another episode named Balance for Skill explaining pretty much the opposite when you have to balance an action game.


Those small anime. You can make them tell everything you want.

Anyway, this thread should beneficiate from the insight of the new patch we could all have this weekend. Rite_

[Septivium]

No. but like any game like this, it should not be balanced.

Balance would make every Mech the same. look at the Sharpshooter and the Raider as an example.

at long range, the sharpshooter is DESIGNED to overpower other mechs. and the Raider is designed by its very nature to overpower opponents at very close range.

That's not balance, based on a situation there is a planned imbalance here...

But isn't that as it should be_ .. that's what makes it fun .. meeting and playing mechs with different abilities, advantages and disadvantages and overcoming them.

(granted some of the mechanics may need a little work, but its a beta, that will come with time)

[Granddaddypurp]

change the freking walk speed an jump accel back to normal this is way to fast paced listen to me!!!

[Odinous]

what do u mean by balanced_how can a game be balanced when 12 players join a game,6 players join each team,when their team start loosing,someone always starting to quit and making a chain reaction,when someone joins,he sees less players in his team,he is loosing,he quits again.Sometimes we have our bad days,ok,sometimes i have them too,but i will not quit,cause i don't get something anyway.I wish i had  fraps or something else to record so many great battles we had and still have when both teams know what to do,without people chasing kills but playing the game as teammates.So on the side of any other mode than deathmatch,it is not the game's fault about so called "balance",but ours.
On 1vs1 i think the game is balanced cause every mech can get the kill,if the player knows what to do.
So i choose that the game is balanced.

Edited by Odinous, February 17 2014 - 05:25 PM.

[Hijinks_The_Turtle]

I feel the mech walk speeds are really slow, I need them to be faster.

[Granddaddypurp]

He'll no! If u obviously played hawken before the last two updates it was perfect the slow stomps mech feel is gone. An if you watch other players they slide! This isn't unreal tourney...... This is hawken. An the turn rate needs to go back to normal too.

[Arcart]

nothing is balanced the only balance is you

[Houruck]

Arcart, on February 23 2014 - 09:28 AM, said:

nothing is balanced the only balance is you

That was deep.