63 replies to this topic

[HeroGhost]

I find the technician class sucks the fun out of the game. If I wanted to play tf2, i'd go play tf2. Having a constantly healing enemy is just obnoxious.

[Saturnine]

Sorry, the developers have stated in several places that they have no intention of removing the Technician for the game - there is no way it will ever happen.

What they will be doing is changing the balancing of the Technician, and quite likely how it works, in places.

[N0stalgia]

Where's ropefish and his Jim Carrey "and here we go" meme_

[Bazookagofer]

Edited by Bazookagofer, June 06 2013 - 01:43 PM.

[Bazookagofer]

THE MESSAGE MUST LIVE ON (srry for double post but i can never figure out how to put words and a picture together. I will keep the flame burning!!!

[Beemann]

Technician needs to be changed, not removed. Also game needs more support classes (real support, not "it doesn't do much damage, so it must be support")

[Starrphy]

Play the Tech as an A-class attacker. fun guaranteed. Oh and occasionally heal YOURSELF with the beam >:3


What does need changing to the tech_ I like it.. Healing people_ NTY, i heal if I can save a teammate but I'm not a nurse. ;p

[GodsHolyMember]

In a prior thread of mine, I suggested changing the Tech's repair function to where the player must enter a fortification-like mode and aims at a target where their repair drones fly over to repair a friendly.  As a compromise from losing most mobility and advanced maneuvering, the Technician would be able to repair up to 3-mechs simultaneously as long as they were within range and all within the crosshairs, but for every additional mech being repaired at a time, the rate would slow by 1/3.

In general, I think the Technician has an important role in Hawken, I don't think it should be removed, but I do think that it needs to be fixed given that unlike in TF2 which has a similar mechanic with its Medic, the tradeoff is that the medic cannot also fire its offensive weapons while healing a teammate, and second, that snipers can kill a medic or his companion with a single headshot.

[Akrium]

Beemann, on June 06 2013 - 01:44 PM, said:

Technician needs to be changed, not removed. Also game needs more support classes (real support, not "it doesn't do much damage, so it must be support")

I think you meant to say "It does so much healing it can't also do so much damage."

[Skrill]

the problem with that ^ is you now have a very stationary a class. you would never get enough healing done because a scout or infiltrator will just come out and insta gib you. at least that's how i would solve the stationary healer problem. at mid to high levels of play a non moving mech is very dead very quickly. i like the multiple heal idea though it would need to be a very light handed heal to stay balanced.

[Beemann]

Akrium, on June 06 2013 - 02:17 PM, said:

Beemann, on June 06 2013 - 01:44 PM, said:

Technician needs to be changed, not removed. Also game needs more support classes (real support, not "it doesn't do much damage, so it must be support")

I think you meant to say "It does so much healing it can't also do so much damage."

No, I mean the Bruiser, Rocketeer and Reaper are not support just because they are/have been underpowered. The Technician is a support class, just a badly designed one (though to be fair, it's at least a popular bad design)

@GodsHolyMember
The TF2 medic actually causes a few balance/pacing problems at high end, The lack of offensive capabilty and the ease with which a class can kill it (worth noting, raider+shield+det+EOC+explosive munitions = instagibbed tech) hasn't fixed those issues.

[Akrium]

Beemann, on June 06 2013 - 02:25 PM, said:

Akrium, on June 06 2013 - 02:17 PM, said:

Beemann, on June 06 2013 - 01:44 PM, said:

Technician needs to be changed, not removed. Also game needs more support classes (real support, not "it doesn't do much damage, so it must be support")

I think you meant to say "It does so much healing it can't also do so much damage."

No, I mean the Bruiser, Rocketeer and Reaper are not support just because they are/have been underpowered. The Technician is a support class, just a badly designed one (though to be fair, it's at least a popular bad design)

Ahhh was confused since you were talking about the tech. But still.. they did outright say they are making some mechs to be easier to use, not necessarily the best option to use for competitive play. Also the reaper isn't that bad of a mech. I've seen enough ppl doing exceptionally well with it against good players to believe it isn't as gimped as some ppl think.

[Beemann]

Akrium, on June 06 2013 - 02:30 PM, said:

Beemann, on June 06 2013 - 02:25 PM, said:

Akrium, on June 06 2013 - 02:17 PM, said:

Beemann, on June 06 2013 - 01:44 PM, said:

Technician needs to be changed, not removed. Also game needs more support classes (real support, not "it doesn't do much damage, so it must be support")

I think you meant to say "It does so much healing it can't also do so much damage."

No, I mean the Bruiser, Rocketeer and Reaper are not support just because they are/have been underpowered. The Technician is a support class, just a badly designed one (though to be fair, it's at least a popular bad design)

Ahhh was confused since you were talking about the tech. But still.. they did outright say they are making some mechs to be easier to use, not necessarily the best option to use for competitive play. Also the reaper isn't that bad of a mech. I've seen enough ppl doing exceptionally well with it against good players to believe it isn't as gimped as some ppl think.

Reaper had a good buff, and is almost not just a slightly inferior SS. Additionally, the "easier mechs" that they're making are being put in some pretty vital roles (like healing!)

[AsianJoyKiller]

Akrium, on June 06 2013 - 02:30 PM, said:

Ahhh was confused since you were talking about the tech. But still.. they did outright say they are making some mechs to be easier to use, not necessarily the best option to use for competitive play. Also the reaper isn't that bad of a mech. I've seen enough ppl doing exceptionally well with it against good players to believe it isn't as gimped as some ppl think.

It's just annoying when people go "it's not as good at killing, so it's obviously support".

[Akrium]

Beemann, on June 06 2013 - 02:33 PM, said:

Akrium, on June 06 2013 - 02:30 PM, said:

Beemann, on June 06 2013 - 02:25 PM, said:

Akrium, on June 06 2013 - 02:17 PM, said:

Beemann, on June 06 2013 - 01:44 PM, said:

Technician needs to be changed, not removed. Also game needs more support classes (real support, not "it doesn't do much damage, so it must be support")

I think you meant to say "It does so much healing it can't also do so much damage."

No, I mean the Bruiser, Rocketeer and Reaper are not support just because they are/have been underpowered. The Technician is a support class, just a badly designed one (though to be fair, it's at least a popular bad design)

Ahhh was confused since you were talking about the tech. But still.. they did outright say they are making some mechs to be easier to use, not necessarily the best option to use for competitive play. Also the reaper isn't that bad of a mech. I've seen enough ppl doing exceptionally well with it against good players to believe it isn't as gimped as some ppl think.

Reaper had a good buff, and is almost not just a slightly inferior SS. Additionally, the "easier mechs" that they're making are being put in some pretty vital roles (like healing!)

True.. but they also said more are to come. Maybe the easy one was made first... we are getting a lot more mechs yet. We don't know what all is coming. Maybe we will get a buff mech that can with high skill outperform the tech. Who knows...

It's still a bit of a ride we are going through yet obviously.

[Akrium]

AsianJoyKiller, on June 06 2013 - 02:36 PM, said:

Akrium, on June 06 2013 - 02:30 PM, said:

Ahhh was confused since you were talking about the tech. But still.. they did outright say they are making some mechs to be easier to use, not necessarily the best option to use for competitive play. Also the reaper isn't that bad of a mech. I've seen enough ppl doing exceptionally well with it against good players to believe it isn't as gimped as some ppl think.

It's just annoying when people go "it's not as good at killing, so it's obviously support".

I looked at it more like, the rocketeer is a back line mech... so it is support. The bruiser is a hybrid assault/support.. as it is going to sit closer than the rocketeer would. But ultimately I don't look at it from a dmg output point of view, but the mechanic of playing the mech in the form that suits it.

[Beemann]

Akrium, on June 06 2013 - 02:38 PM, said:

True.. but they also said more are to come. Maybe the easy one was made first... we are getting a lot more mechs yet. We don't know what all is coming. Maybe we will get a buff mech that can with high skill outperform the tech. Who knows...

It's still a bit of a ride we are going through yet obviously.

You'd have to make something pretty OP to counter an immensely easy to use source of heals, and again, the technician doesn't need to be removed... it just has to be reworked so that it doesn't become the center of attention

I also don't really trust this whole "something else will fix that" after the EMP (and countermeasures) and the addition of the Raider

Akrium, on June 06 2013 - 02:40 PM, said:

I looked at it more like, the rocketeer is a back line mech... so it is support. The bruiser is a hybrid assault/support.. as it is going to sit closer than the rocketeer would. But ultimately I don't look at it from a dmg output point of view, but the mechanic of playing the mech in the form that suits it.

So is TF2's sniper a support_ Cuz I'd define it as a long range offensive class. Same would go for the Rocketeer.

Edited by Beemann, June 06 2013 - 02:42 PM.

[AsianJoyKiller]

Akrium, on June 06 2013 - 02:40 PM, said:

AsianJoyKiller, on June 06 2013 - 02:36 PM, said:

Akrium, on June 06 2013 - 02:30 PM, said:

Ahhh was confused since you were talking about the tech. But still.. they did outright say they are making some mechs to be easier to use, not necessarily the best option to use for competitive play. Also the reaper isn't that bad of a mech. I've seen enough ppl doing exceptionally well with it against good players to believe it isn't as gimped as some ppl think.

It's just annoying when people go "it's not as good at killing, so it's obviously support".

I looked at it more like, the rocketeer is a back line mech... so it is support. The bruiser is a hybrid assault/support.. as it is going to sit closer than the rocketeer would. But ultimately I don't look at it from a dmg output point of view, but the mechanic of playing the mech in the form that suits it.

"Fire support" is not a role in Hawken. Anything a "fire support" mech can do, an "attacker" mech can do just as well, while being better at other tasks too.

[Akrium]

AsianJoyKiller, on June 06 2013 - 02:42 PM, said:

"Fire support" is not a role in Hawken. Anything a "fire support" mech can do, an "attacker" mech can do just as well, while being better at other tasks too.

Yes and anything an "attacker" mech can do, the support can do as well, while being better at other tasks too!

It works both ways obviously when you ignore the fact both are better at the opposite things. The support mechs don't fail at life by doing either role. They just do better if you play them in the support role. And the same is said of the Attacker mechs.

I am talking the general playstyle of the mech, not the fact it can shoot someone far away.

Also yes, I would consider the tf2 sniper a support role, as it is meant to dwindle forces down for the more forward group. Granted he is stronger in tf2 than hawken and can 1 shot kill people(and if that is a good mechanic or not I won't get into). But everything aside, he is playing a support role. He isn't bum rushing the flag/points solo unless he knows he has some advantage. And that advantage usually is teammates leading the way in some form while he is in the backline picking off ppl as they pop out. Just hoping he doesn't get flanked and melted. Thus... a support class.

[Beemann]

Akrium, on June 06 2013 - 03:01 PM, said:

while being better at other tasks too!

Like_

Akrium, on June 06 2013 - 03:01 PM, said:

Also yes, I would consider the tf2 sniper a support role, as it is meant to dwindle forces down for the more forward group. Granted he is stronger in tf2 than hawken and can 1 shot kill people(and if that is a good mechanic or not I won't get into). But everything aside, he is playing a support role. He isn't bum rushing the flag/points solo unless he knows he has some advantage. And that advantage usually is teammates leading the way in some form while he is in the backline picking off ppl as they pop out. Just hoping he doesn't get flanked and melted. Thus... a support class.

Can you explain what you define as a support role when just straight-up killing people can be a support role_ Is the scout a support class too_ The scout's primary role in higher level matches is to get rid of key targets, just like the Sniper