14 replies to this topic

[draco7891]

The thought occurred to me while replying to the other thread, but it doesn't really belong in that discussion.

A great deal of the utility that burst weapons enjoy is promulgated not just on their DPS and range, but also on their ability for AoE damage (especially HEAT and EOC and most secondaries).

So, why are there no sustain weapons with measurably useful AoE_ The closest than I can think of now is the Rev-GL, but that's really much more about the burst. Such an addition might provide some relief from any aiming issues some might have, as well as providing sustain with some additional utility/suppression capabilities to help deal with corner play.

Most probably any weapon so equipped should have a relatively small splash radius, leaving large AoE the domain of burst weapons.

Draco

[Sylhiri]

Most sustain weapons are hitscan, I'm guessing that is a big factor in why they don't have AoE.

Edited by Sylhiri, December 13 2013 - 11:15 AM.

[Nvain]

draco7891, on December 13 2013 - 11:05 AM, said:

Such an addition might provide some relief from any aiming issues some might have, as well as providing sustain with some additional utility/suppression capabilities to help deal with corner play.

A hitscan sustained-fire weapon with AOE_ No thank you Aiming issues should typically arise more often with burst weapons as you can't adapt aiming while you fire, like you can, for example, with the Vulcan or SMG.
I think that sustained fire weapons could perhaps have a little less spread overall, that's it. The Vulcan could also use a little less spin-up time and be reworked so that it doesn't start spinning-up every time you click the fire button - but that's a bit off-topic.
Sustained-fire AOE would be too powerful in my opinion.

[Leonhardt]

A mini-gun that shoots explosive projectiles with tiny AoE_ Could be interesting depending on how it works. Almost like a mini-heat cannon except no charging and the projectiles move at slow speed_

Idk ideas like that are always interesting I have no idea how it would play out in game.

[Super_Pickle]

I'd much rather trade in the vulcan for a AoE sustain weapon on my bezerker. Even if it has less dps and is more difficult to hit, it'd still be better. Splash is like easy mode. You don't have to be perfect with your aim to hit targets. That means you're doing a lot more dps than a sustain weapon that misses half the shots.

I support this idea. It would be nice to have an AoE sustain weapon. There are already way too many classes with assult rifle sub machine gun and vulcan. We need some better alternatives.

[draco7891]

Sylhiri, on December 13 2013 - 11:15 AM, said:

Most sustain weapons are hitscan, I'm guessing that is a big factor in why they don't have AoE.

Granted, but being hitscan doesn't obviate a weapon from using AoE. It's not a disproof of the idea.

The game already has an extremely rapid-projectile  AoE weapon in the HEAT Cannon. Uncharged, the projectile moves at 200m/s (and charged is twice as fast at 400m/s). For reference, most encounters take place well under 100m. Velocity, then, does not break AoE. AoE in Hawken isn't balanced by the difficulty of aiming/lead, but by the size of the radius and the minimum damage/feathering.

If it's not the velocity of the shot, and it's not requiring lead, then I don't see why AoE should remain the exclusive realm of burst weapons.

Plus, there's nothing in the book that says a sustain weapon has to be hitscan, either. We're breaking down all the traditions today.

Draco

[OmegaNull]

I would be down for a AOE sustained weapon. Maybe a weapon like the EOC, however, more like a M242 with explosive rounds.

[Frenotx]

Isn't the Rev-GL essentially sustained AoE_

[Xacius]

The closest thing we have to sustained AOE is the Technician's Redox.

[StruttingStray]

draco7891, on December 13 2013 - 11:05 AM, said:

Most probably any weapon so equipped should have a relatively small splash radius, leaving large AoE the domain of burst weapons.

Leonhardt, on December 13 2013 - 11:35 AM, said:

Almost like a mini-heat cannon except no charging and the projectiles move at slow speed_

You guys beat me to it, I was actually writting up a suggestion to a weapon exactly like this. Sort of the lovechild of the AM-SAR and Heat canon.

[Silverfire]

Rev-GL is sustained and it has AoE. It spits out grenades at a very decent fire rate.  Still would like to see more, regardless.

[HubbaBubba9849]

Xacius, on December 15 2013 - 04:31 PM, said:

The closest thing we have to sustained AOE is the Technician's Redox.

Thank you Xacius. I was just about to say the same thing.

[MrWilpon]

draco7891, on December 13 2013 - 11:05 AM, said:

The closest than I can think of now is the Rev-GL, but that's really much more about the burst.

The Rev-GL is not a burst weapon, it is indeed a sustained AoE weapon.

As you can read on the official game guide:
"Halt enemy progress with a steady barrage of heavy artillery"

I played several hours with my Grenadier and I confirm this is true.In fact, the main concept of the Grenadier is to cause sustained aoe damage.

[HugeGuts]

In addition to the Rev-GL and Redox, one of the Fire Fighter's primaries will have a small AoE with a heat generation debuff if the in game files are accurate.

Edited by HugeGuts, January 11 2014 - 03:35 PM.

[Greenvalv]

Wouldn't it be interesting if we got an automatic EOC-esque weapon that acted like a Torgue assault rifle from Borderlands 2_  Explosive sustain with very poor accuracy (no mine action, the EOC reference is for the projectile looks).