60 replies to this topic

[Syn_]

Immie, i'm sorry, but i disagree. F2P players makes a BIG chunk of the playerbase of a, well, f2p shooters. If they feel they cannot be bothered to stay because the f2p rewards are too hard to get, then they will leave, leaving an unpopulated game.
the tribes ascend model was a good one, stuff was easy to get, and only very special, super rare items were kind of expensive, but not much. You could unlock a class every couple of matches, keeping the game fresh and not feeling lagging behind becaouse you didnt cough up. It is the only f2p game i have ever paid money for.

I think as it stands, the xp rate makes the game too big of a grind. I played for about 3 hours or so, to make less than 10% of what i need to unlock a new class. No, thank you. I know i'll be leaving this in the shelf for a while now, it felt grindy. During the first alphas, i loved having 3 or 4 classes to play with, and i know i played a lot more then.

In any case, thats what the beta is for! hope they wise up.

[Cyberpunk]

Leveling up to fast is no good for nothing

[Prodygy]

The great thing about this game (from my point of view) is that even without the tech points, the items, and the different mechs types, a skilled player can still do quite well. The game can be enjoyed whether you are level 1 or level 20.

Sure, maybe the rate at which hawken points are awarded should be increased, but I don't think the integrity of the game is sacrificed in either case.

[RadimentriX]

hawken points HAVE TO be pushed. right now it's a ridiculous small amount. i mean: 96 points for 1 hour playing_ 4 deathmatches á 15 minutes. that means i have to play for 100 hours just to buy another mech_ o_O no, not really. this looks too much like pay to win and i will not support that. and even with the booster it would be 50 hours to get a mech. still not acceptable imo. i think it'd be good if the upgrades and mechs are cheap in the beginning but the more you buy, the more you have to pay (for example 500 points for the first, 750 for the second, 1000 for the 3rd, 1500 for the 4th...)

but i'm sure there will be some changes until release

Edited by RadimentriX, October 29 2012 - 10:49 AM.

[AsianJoyKiller]

The rate seems pretty glacial at the moment.
I'd like to see it knocked up a small percentage.

20% would be at my absolute extreme, maximum, holy-fuzzy-bunnies-that's-a-lot-of-points range.

Edited by AsianJoyKiller, October 29 2012 - 11:00 AM.

[Crimson_Corsair]

I have a suspicion that the slow rate is to encourage testing of the boost system.

[Korriban87]

I would to say I'm up fot a little boost,

BUT

Since I had problems logging in so many games during beta, I have to take into account that I could have earned at least 30% HP more of what I actually earned. Considering the lenght of a game I can say that is in line with other f2p games like LoL (a 25-30 min average match  grants you 90 points) what i would like to see is a "first win of the day" boost League of legends style, if you played you know what i mean.

[ThePirateKing]

Building up HP is so slow that this model is really pushing "pay to win" territory. Tread lightly, Hawken dev team. Keeping this fair and balanced is what will determine if people repeatedly come back to you with their cash. My vote is still for purely cosmetic upgrades.

[Hadraziel]

Immie, on October 26 2012 - 07:39 PM, said:

Hawken point earnings are based off exactly three things, no more, no less:

• Win or loss
  
  
• Match duration
  
  
• Rank on scoreboard

The second having the most weight. Since siege mode typically lasts the longest, it tends to award the highest amount; around 100 per game, +/- some depending on match time and whether you won/lost. A 30 minute match (fairly short) that I won/placed first in gave me a little over 120 HP. Doubled to 240 with boost, it seems fast enough to me... there is a strange sense of entitlement among non-paying players, who seem to expect to get the whole game for free with absolutely no drawbacks. If there wasn't any incentive to buy stuff, the game wouldn't make any money.

So you can get 120 pts per 30minutes match while winning and being first, let's take a basis of 100pts per game on average, since you can't win every match.
From here, this is 200 pts per hour, that is 1000 pts every 5 hours, 46 hours for a new mech, 7h30 for an upgrade/item you need to unlock 6 for a full set. This gives us 91 hours of grind for a fully equipped mech if you don't pay.

I don't think it is fair to call the people who complain about this "entitled", there is a fair amount of bullsh*t with the way the game is currently designed. The way the game is now almost forces the purchase of meteor points.

Sure other f2p games such as League of Legends have a lot of grinding involved, but in League of Legends, you ultimately only need a set of runes to be competitive, which can be obtained very quickly (about 1-3 runes lvl2 per game). In Hawken, you don't have the option to just get cheap upgrades that you can use on any mech, you have to get the naked mech first, and then get the precious upgrades.

[Tezkat]

I'd like to see income:price ratios be much higher, personally.

Take the prices of items and internals, for instance. Those things cost 1550 HP each. I've been averaging maybe 200 HP/hour this weekend without the HP boost. So... upwards of 8 hours of play to purchase each piece of equipment on a mech. Grinding out a full set would represent a good week of play for even a dedicated gamer... and easily span months for a casual one. And that doesn't even consider having extras for changing your options.

Way too expensive. Even paying for the boost, it would still be a huge time commitment. As it is, buying an income booster seems inferior overall to simply purchasing the items outright. And casual non-paying gamers will be running around with mostly naked mechs.

[BernardWiseman]

I want to play Hawken because it's a fun and enjoyable game, not because I have goodies to unlock.

[DarkPulse]

Well, in a "Freemium" game like this, you either "pay" with time or with money. Obviously, they want to incentivize the money half of that.

However, I do agree that the point gain is rather low. Double, perhaps triple it, but no more. In the game of Siege Sahara I recorded, I only got 112 Hawken points for the thing, and 224 after the doubler.

Any higher than 3x its current rate and people will just stick it out for Hawken Points unless they really lack the time or the price-per-points value on Meteor Points is sufficiently low enough to make them more lucrative. At 3x, we'd be looking at 336 * 2 = 772 Hawken Points for that same Siege match with a booster - which means I could buy an upgrade essentially almost every few matches.

[Demonocolips]

basically you should be able to get hawken points when you get exp. mostly kills and assists, captures and other things any time you do something that makes your team closer to winning you should be paid for.

[Hadraziel]

Maybe they could take the same approach as Smite, where players get a substantial amount of points (1000+) on each level up

[RedleAruel]

Earning the points is a slow but I guess it might be alright since if you gained say 200-300 per round everyone would be getting upgrades, defensive and offensive items. Tho I see the point of it being used to make people spend cash on meteor points.

[Ninjaman999]

I thought I would just say, that Ive been playing a ton over the weekend and landing in the top 3 almost every match and Ive only accumulated 1056 hawken points as of 20 minutes ago. I have also never aquired above 80 points in one shot. This makes NO sense...

Edited by Ninjaman999, October 29 2012 - 03:15 PM.

[RadimentriX]

Hadraziel, on October 29 2012 - 11:48 AM, said:

Immie, on October 26 2012 - 07:39 PM, said:

Hawken point earnings are based off exactly three things, no more, no less:

• Win or loss
  
  
• Match duration
  
  
• Rank on scoreboard

The second having the most weight. Since siege mode typically lasts the longest, it tends to award the highest amount; around 100 per game, +/- some depending on match time and whether you won/lost. A 30 minute match (fairly short) that I won/placed first in gave me a little over 120 HP. Doubled to 240 with boost, it seems fast enough to me... there is a strange sense of entitlement among non-paying players, who seem to expect to get the whole game for free with absolutely no drawbacks. If there wasn't any incentive to buy stuff, the game wouldn't make any money.

So you can get 120 pts per 30minutes match while winning and being first, let's take a basis of 100pts per game on average, since you can't win every match.
From here, this is 200 pts per hour, that is 1000 pts every 5 hours, 46 hours for a new mech, 7h30 for an upgrade/item you need to unlock 6 for a full set. This gives us 91 hours of grind for a fully equipped mech if you don't pay.

I don't think it is fair to call the people who complain about this "entitled", there is a fair amount of bullsh*t with the way the game is currently designed. The way the game is now almost forces the purchase of meteor points.

Sure other f2p games such as League of Legends have a lot of grinding involved, but in League of Legends, you ultimately only need a set of runes to be competitive, which can be obtained very quickly (about 1-3 runes lvl2 per game). In Hawken, you don't have the option to just get cheap upgrades that you can use on any mech, you have to get the naked mech first, and then get the precious upgrades.

what for matches do you have_ o_O i was in the midfield in the 4 matches and just got 96 points for 1 hour playing. is this game for 24/7-playing uber-1337-fuzzy bunny-fps-addicts only_

€: and wtf is "h.4.x.0.r" a badword_ o_O it's not insulting and nothing ô.o

Edited by RadimentriX, October 30 2012 - 08:08 AM.

[patlasmat]

I was okey to pay a premium game price for hawken. now this f2p thing irritates me. As it's i'll dull my excitement without paying anything and playing time to time. I was in alpha too and i love the game but sure i'l get bored after playing the same mech again and again. highest points i accumulated in a game was about 120 and it was after a very long siege game. I want to win my goodies developing/showing skills and playing not 'earning' money points. Cant u set a base price for us that'l give permanent boost and access to at least 3 full geared mechs_ i'l never pay  for time boost or a hand grenade pay to progress or pay to win, same for me. Hats you said... now u poke the stick (

[thepeopleselbow]

I'm new here.  My son and I share this beta acct.  I'm 35, he's 16, so yes, I'm dragging his k/d/a numbers down.  Progression feels slow to both of us.

Here's us so far: Team Wins: 10, Team Losses: 10, Kills: 225, Deaths: 216, Assist: 198.  We've upgraded the starter mech and bought both the brawler and sharpshooter to try.  We're 140/117 k/d in the sharpshooter, that's what we're best with so far.

Basically with 2 of us playing the game for the last 5 days, we've earned enough to buy 1 upgrade.  Not a lot to show for having 2 people playing it probably 2 hrs / day each.

Love the game.

Just our 2 cents.

Edit: we have earned 56,812 exp and 1487 hawken points so far.

Edited by thepeopleselbow, October 30 2012 - 11:22 AM.

[NotKjell]

I'm going to point to my sig and say I got over 10,000 Exp in that game, but only 131 hawken points. And people are right to say the game is too slow, I liked the term someone used "Pay or Suffer" instead of pay2win. The thing I do like though is I remember seeing some post (I can't remember where) that the devs realized this/the version we see now is by no means the final one. Still various ideas for improvements.

• A multiplier for amount of HP earned. Something like double the current amount or something. The nicest part about the current system is that it's not favored towards the top players, pretty much everyone earns HP evenly. The current system is just super fuucking slow.
  
• Have HP be based of a % of EXP. This would likely be more 'fair', and faster depending on the chosen %. The downside is it will be very punishing to new players, while the players who are likely playing a lot ANYWAYS will be most rewarded.
  
• More end-of-game rewards. Right now you get points for match time, individual place, and team win/loss. Things like most assists, most EU returned, etc. A minor thing, but I do currently think it's cool the see just a long list of ALL the things that makes up your EXP for the round. It's lame though to see 2-3 things at the bottom of that list for your Hawken points. Having some more to list there would be nice. It wouldn't do too much for increasing HP given and it would be top-heavy though.
  
• In-game medals. An idea that would be pretty similar to the above idea, and also have the same bonus of having more to list. But things like what you see in Battlefield and I think Call of Duty_ (I gave up on that series a long time ago and can't remember) If you got 8 revives for example, you would get a medal that would give +50 exp so you level up just a bit faster. Things like this would be nice, as you have avenger/savior/revenge kills, successful healing, capping points etc.
  
• TF2-style achievements. And by tf2-style I mean that in tf2 any item can be bought, traded for or dropped if you're lucky. But every class has 3 weapons that can be unlocked by getting class-specific achievements. This I think would be VERY nice, allowing new players to fill out some items on the mechs that they like. Or just achievements that give like +500 HP when earned.