33 replies to this topic

[BaronSaturday]

I feel there's a problem with the way G2s are currently. I know that ADH wanted them to be "fun", but fun is a relative term. I don't find it fun to be sploded because my mech is weak in the case of the G2 Assault. I think having a single loadout is cool and should stay, but all mechs should be viable. Being tough to play is one thing, but being unseen in upper tier play is not a good thing. I could have spent my HC/MC on something else.

I know that my idea of fun is not universal, but the G2 Raider is great when in great hands. The G2 Assault is only kinda good in the best of hands and that's really unfortunate for such a unique mech. I have ideas on how to change it, but I would like to know how people feel about both of the G2 mechs. If I'm alone iny view then fine.

[Maximmo]

I don't really use my G2 Raider, I find it too hard to play for me but I like the G2 Assault. I find it pretty powerful with its dual Vulcan and I'm using it when my team is loosing. It is my last chance weapon. I can get rid of ennemies fast with that mech.

[BIsmuthZornisse]

what issues does g2assault have in high tier play? (i'm nowhere near that)

one issue I can see is that it it has great difficulty engaging/chasing targets around cornes, since both its weapons spin-up.

my suggestion for fixing that is modifying the weapons into what i call "burst vulcans": (quoting my suggestion thread)

 

There is no spinup, instead first shot deals increased damage and builds much more heat than the shots afterwards. Maybe reduce overall damage per second a little bit.

My idea is, that instead of spinning up, the barrel comes into motion by a small detonation inside the weapon (like a car's engine, i guess?), and that this explosion causes the increased heat and the stronger first bullet(since it would be expelled at a higher speed).

Since both its right weapon and first weapon are currently spinup weapons, this mech has a big problem responding to surprise attacks as well as with following targets around corners, so i think the spinup should be removed, at the very least for the right weapon. The extra heat generation is meant to discourage "abusing" the first shot.

 

as for the g2raider, its righthanded weapon hits like a truck (and you better land that hit with that long reload time). my only problem (besides having only 1 lefthanded weapon) is the momentum of its ability not getting carried over into a jump/flight and becoming slower when boosting. boosting should maybe just be disabled for the abilty's duration and boostdependent internals should activate while walking. although a boosting g2raider with the abilty active going even faster would be a sight to behold.

 

i would actually like the g2 mechs to have 3 lefthanded weapons like g1 mechs, cause i'd like a fully featured mech for that hc cost. maybe modified versions of the g1 version's weapon (not just in terms of pure stats but also projectile behavior, for example reflecting off walls once) could work.

[Upright_6]

what issues does g2assault have in high tier play? (i'm nowhere near that)
one issue I can see is that it it has great difficulty engaging/chasing targets around cornes, since both its weapons spin-up.
my suggestion for fixing that is modifying the weapons into what i call "burst vulcans": (quoting my suggestion thread)

 
as for the g2raider, its righthanded weapon hits like a truck (and you better land that hit with that long reload time). my only problem (besides having only 1 lefthanded weapon) is the momentum of its ability not getting carried over into a jump/flight and becoming slower when boosting. boosting should maybe just be disabled for the abilty's duration and boostdependent internals should activate while walking. although a boosting g2raider with the abilty active going even faster would be a sight to behold.
 
i would actually like the g2 mechs to have 3 lefthanded weapons like g1 mechs, cause i'd like a fully featured mech for that hc cost. maybe modified versions of the g1 version's weapon (not just in terms of pure stats but also projectile behavior, for example reflecting off walls once) could work.

I like the idea of the burst vulcans but that gets rid of the main weakness of the G2 Assault. Givivng it insta-fire weapons would make it OP as it's only weaknesses are range (most mechs in the game are geared for close-mid engagements btw) and suprise attacks

[MomOw]

Assault G2 needs a (slight) buff :

 

 

About G2 assault, I feel like it's a missed opportunity.

 

I would have prefered a gameplay that lead to ~105 DPS, 6 heat per second when using 1 weapon, and a really high DPS when using both let's say ~190 DPS, but with a really high heat per second (25 heat per second ? 4s before overheat, 760 damage before overheat).

(105 DPS is the SMC, 190 DPS is equivalent to incinerator with uncharged SAARE + PAPA)

 

On the paper this seems more tricky due to a dual mode that overheat like hell and could sort of buff the "low-grade" coolant of the G2A.

[Merl61]

The g2 mechs aren't great, put they can be used even at a high level in certain circumstances. Just ask thirdeye.

[m0bieduck]

G2 raider is op. In the right hands, the g2 assault is too. Forgot whatever his name was who was good at it

[Flifang]

The biggest problem for the G2 assault in high tier play is it requires serious dedication once you engage. With the nature of its weapons, makes it an amazing assault mech but when it overheats or gets surrounded it degrades to a small game animal shrieking in the clutches of a predator. When a team back it up it shines greatly. Be the Good Samaritan and help a teamate push every now and then, even if you don't have good expectations for the outcome; you might be surprised.

[kingalbert2]

G2 raider is good at swatting infiltrators or scouts.

[KarlSchlag]

I wonder if it is a mistake by the former dev team, an unforeseen side-effect or a "buff", but: 

 

Why is the G2 Raider visible on Radar while its ability is activated?

 

I'm just curious, because the ability is just  speeding up the walk-speed. Not the boost speed(!)

And in a regular Raider you are invisible on Radar when ability is activated and you only walk.

 

I posted this in several forums, but noone seems to really care.

 

But being invisible while in G2 blitz-mode, would amplify the "speciality" of the G2 Raider severely. The moment of surprise. Peek-a-boo-splat-in-your-face-alike. The G2 Raider would work so much better even against more advanced players, who will watch the radar constantly. 

[LaurenEmily]

I wonder if it is a mistake by the former dev team, an unforeseen side-effect or a "buff", but: 

 

Why is the G2 Raider visible on Radar while its ability is activated?

 

I'm just curious, because the ability is just  speeding up the walk-speed. Not the boost speed(!)

And in a regular Raider you are invisible on Radar when ability is activated and you only walk.

 

I posted this in several forums, but noone seems to really care.

 

But being invisible while in G2 blitz-mode, would amplify the "speciality" of the G2 Raider severely. The moment of surprise. Peek-a-boo-splat-in-your-face-alike. The G2 Raider would work so much better even against more advanced players, who will watch the radar constantly. 

This is most likely a bug that was not intended to happen. It's been discussed before and i'm pretty sure everyone agrees that it shouldn't be this way.

[Flifang]

I think it's caused by the active fuel consumption.

[SoldierHobbes11]

G2 mechs were made to be very niche mechs because they were meant to be used by pilots who have already mastered a few mechs, not as training wheels for new players. They're supposed to be more difficult to use but yield some explosive results when properly piloted. My advice when buying these mechs is never get them with meteor credits and only but it with Hawken credits if there's nothing else you really want.

[Kopra]

I think it's caused by the active fuel consumption.

This. When fuelless dodges were implemented, they didn't show on map until it was fixed.

[KarlSchlag]

@ LaurenEmily: Thanx! I felt like being the only one who cares :D 

 

@ SoldierHobbes: I watched your G2-Raider video on Youtube and you are bringing it to the point: Against less experienced players it is a ton of fun playing the "Fat ninja". But people who can read the radar will await you around the corner and all that surprise-effect is gone. Being invisible during Blitz would give the G2 Raider more edge and make it maybe not only a Fun-mech but a serious opponent even for advanced pilots.

 

ICH LIEBE MEINEN G2-RAIDER! Please fix that bug, if you can call it so.  It goes far beyond my knowledge, but the G2 Raider-Blitz has to be reprogrammed, so that its fuel consumption, and only that doesnt show on Radar. There should be a route that bypasses the global route or path for that.

 

Lol... if you want to know anything about programming, don't ask me

Edited by KarlSchlag, 26 April 2015 - 03:19 AM.

[BaronSaturday]

G2 mechs were made to be very niche mechs because they were meant to be used by pilots who have already mastered a few mechs, not as training wheels for new players. They're supposed to be more difficult to use but yield some explosive results when properly piloted. My advice when buying these mechs is never get them with meteor credits and only but it with Hawken credits if there's nothing else you really want.

I understand that. But my problem isn't really with the g2 raider. It's with the g2 assault. It's, hands down, the least viable mech in the game. I don't know what ADH thought would be fun, but the g2A just isn't fun to me. I may be alone in that and that's fine, but... come on. Gimme a solid double hit scan mech with some oomph.

[Kopra]

I understand that. But my problem isn't really with the g2 raider. It's with the g2 assault. It's, hands down, the least viable mech in the game. I don't know what ADH thought would be fun, but the g2A just isn't fun to me. I may be alone in that and that's fine, but... come on. Gimme a solid double hit scan mech with some oomph.

 

Sharpshooter. 

 

Anyway, the whole G2-series of mechs was a brainfart from the old devs who wanted to produce something with as low effort as possible in between "real" mechs; G2 Assault is supposed to be just a "fun" mech living on the novelty of dual Vulcans. It would be great if the new devs improved the mechanics on the G2 Assault (which I doubt as it wouldn't bring in very much $$$ if at all).

[Meraple]

I personally don't like using G2-Blitz, or even the normal Blitz to close gaps.

I prefer to use it when in combat for increased LOLCANTHITME.

 

..But then I'm kinda terrible with both.

Kinda.

 

 

Here's a suggestion that has probably been suggested tons of times before:

Spoiler

What about two ''Assault Cannons'' on the G2-Assault?

A moderate-ROF, close- to medium-range single-barrel cannon made specifically for dual-wielding,

the decent ROF can be somewhat negated by alternating fire between both weapons.

If you want to have a bit more burst however, you can also ofcourse choose to fire both at the same time.

 

This way it has a mix of sustain and burst, but doesn't specialize in either.

[BaronSaturday]

I personally don't like using G2-Blitz, or even the normal Blitz to close gaps.
I prefer to use it when in combat for increased LOLCANTHITME.

..But then I'm kinda terrible with both.
Kinda.


Here's a suggestion that has probably been suggested tons of times before:

Spoiler

What about two ''Assault Cannons'' on the G2-Assault?
A moderate-ROF, close- to medium-range single-barrel cannon made specifically for dual-wielding,
the decent ROF can be somewhat negated by alternating fire between both weapons.
If you want to have a bit more burst however, you can also ofcourse choose to fire both at the same time.

This way it has a mix of sustain and burst, but doesn't specialize in either.

I actually suggested the AC/Vulcan xt combo. That way there's still a wind up on one. It would be give it moderate corner play options while still keeping it unique, it would definitely help make it viable, and it would give the player more options.

I've actually noticed that you can't keep vulcan xts wound up... this is fine, but I find myself in situations where I actually have to round corners firing one. My problem with this method is that I'm stacking heat before I turn the corner and being on radar, then if I engage my opponent I still have to wait for the other Vulcan to wind up. I don't want to round a corner not firing at the red blip in my radar because then I have to wait for both. I don't want to round the corner firing both because they heat up very fast and if I don't have to use the ability I don't want to. It's actually my favorite mech behind the Tech, but it's so underwhelming at this point that I never use it.

Edited by SaturdayGhede, 26 April 2015 - 07:41 AM.

[Flifang]

When all else fails in the G2 assault, wait around a corner for an enemy that you know will be coming and press them into the nearest wall with your guns firing. That's one of the only fall-back strategies I can think of when the G2 isn't working out that well and from my experience that's usually caused by a team that won't commit to a push with you, which you cannot control. This mech doesn't have the speed to use the Vulcans as a kiting weapon in a tight spot so when you're in a bad spot you're just as helpless as a c-class is against similar numbers. If anything play it like a c-class in this aspect.

[crockrocket]

Personally I don't see a problem with the G2s. They both satisfy a niche playstyle. The thing is, not every mech is going to satisfy every individual. Other than assault, I hardly ever touch B-Classes, for example. And that's fine.

[BaronSaturday]

Personally I don't see a problem with the G2s. They both satisfy a niche playstyle. The thing is, not every mech is going to satisfy every individual. Other than assault, I hardly ever touch B-Classes, for example. And that's fine.

I don't disagree with this at all. I mentioned earlier that I'm totally cool with the g2 raider. It's niche, strong, hard to play, and when I see it pop it's ability it physically unnerves me. Like... It actually scares me. We do have a lot of herd to master mechs though. Pred, Scoot, Raider, g2 raider, Reaper, and SS. All of these mechs were designed to fit niche play. Hell, even the Incin is tough to get used to. But the G2 Raider is far more viable than the g2A. I see them in nearly every Siege match I play. I hardly see the G2A. I just think it needs a simple (mechanical not developmental) change. Even if it has the same dps (still haven't confirmed 135 or 155), adding the AC would open it wide up.

[HeraldRedfordIII]

I didn't see this and I don't know if its a bug, but sometimes I hit the shift button during the G2raider blitz and the speed buff doesn't apply(which is good) to the boost so it switches to the boost speed and since it has the slowest boost speed it creates this large gap of stand still that can really screw you over.

 

The only thing i want to buff is the walk speed for the G2 Raider while also nerfing the ability to keep it at its current speed

[crockrocket]

I don't disagree with this at all. I mentioned earlier that I'm totally cool with the g2 raider. It's niche, strong, hard to play, and when I see it pop it's ability it physically unnerves me. Like... It actually scares me. We do have a lot of herd to master mechs though. Pred, Scoot, Raider, g2 raider, Reaper, and SS. All of these mechs were designed to fit niche play. Hell, even the Incin is tough to get used to. But the G2 Raider is far more viable than the g2A. I see them in nearly every Siege match I play. I hardly see the G2A. I just think it needs a simple (mechanical not developmental) change. Even if it has the same dps (still haven't confirmed 135 or 155), adding the AC would open it wide up.

I remember almost a year back now, soon after I started playing. G2R was almost universally regarded as absolute shite. Not really relevant to you points, I just think it's an interesting observation.

 

G2A has great potential in certain situations, namely when you can catch someone in the open. I agree that it is weaker than G2R, and in fact it's up there with bruiser for weakest mech in the game imo. I just don't think it's necessarily a problem if it's weak in most situations. Given the assault ability, it would also be very difficult to buff it correctly. It would be a fine line between balancing it and making it OP.

 

 

I didn't see this and I don't know if its a bug, but sometimes I hit the shift button during the G2raider blitz and the speed buff doesn't apply(which is good) to the boost so it switches to the boost speed and since it has the slowest boost speed it creates this large gap of stand still that can really screw you over.

 

The only thing i want to buff is the walk speed for the G2 Raider while also nerfing the ability to keep it at its current speed

 

G2R Blitz doesn't affect boost speed.

Edited by crockrocket, 26 April 2015 - 01:30 PM.

[spinningchurro]

I wonder if it is a mistake by the former dev team, an unforeseen side-effect or a "buff", but: 

 

Why is the G2 Raider visible on Radar while its ability is activated?

 

I'm just curious, because the ability is just  speeding up the walk-speed. Not the boost speed(!)

And in a regular Raider you are invisible on Radar when ability is activated and you only walk.

 

I posted this in several forums, but noone seems to really care.

 

But being invisible while in G2 blitz-mode, would amplify the "speciality" of the G2 Raider severely. The moment of surprise. Peek-a-boo-splat-in-your-face-alike. The G2 Raider would work so much better even against more advanced players, who will watch the radar constantly. 

 

 

 

THIS NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED. 

 

 

 

Also I like the idea of a g2 assault buff.  Its ability used to completely empty the heat meter, now it only goes part way.

[KarlSchlag]

THIS NEEDS TO BE ADDRESSED. 

 

 

Done

[PoopSlinger]

Nobody's put in a lot of time to make the G2A really shine.  I know that I'm afraid of running into a G2A in some hands.  The mech kinda forces people to play around it differently.  It probably could use a little sumpin sumpin, bit of a kick.

 

 

I think all of hawken agrees on the ability thing.  It really should be Capnjosh's first priority, but he keeps working on xp-boost, gameplay experience fuzzy bunny.

[CraftyDus]

love my g2 sharpshooter

aka reaper

aka canary

aka tweety

aka tweets McGeets

aka TwiggyDiggy

aka clicky clicky, Ima peck at your mickey

 

Spoiler

 

 

[Flifang]

I guess I can switch to G2A for a while. I remember having a imfamous wizard compliment me on how I played it before so why not.

[petracles]

I know G2 mech's are aimed to have a somewhat similar ability to their respective G1 mechs, but maybe having just the same ol' insta heat-cooldown ability for the G2 could be reworked? I'm a burst player and love my heat cannon, so piloting the G2 Assault is pretty horrifying to me, yes I do have a bias here. But that said, I think there could not be a more boring (yet still applicable) ability for an already fairly simplistic mech than having heat cooldown.

Edited by petracles, 27 April 2015 - 09:52 AM.

[TronX33]

For me, I think the G2 Raider's Speed needs to be buffed. A lot. To Vanguard speeds. It has the slowness of a brawler, but 10 less health than the Vanguard. Or, increase the health to justify the slowness. However, I think if the Armor was raised to 735-ish, and Speed buffed just a little, to like Rocketeer speeds, it would be better. I don't have the G2-Assault, but in almost all my mechs, it's ridiculously easy to kill.

[MomOw]

For me, I think the G2 Raider's Speed needs to be buffed. A lot. To Vanguard speeds. It has the slowness of a brawler, but 10 less health than the Vanguard. Or, increase the health to justify the slowness. However, I think if the Armor was raised to 735-ish, and Speed buffed just a little, to like Rocketeer speeds, it would be better. I don't have the G2-Assault, but in almost all my mechs, it's ridiculously easy to kill.

 

I agree that the wild turkey is weak and slow (except when ability is acivated), and that its awesome burst doesn't compensate that beside 1vs1 on A-class.

So I think that a slight HP increase (~715), increased boost speed (~25.5 m/s), and reduce the cooldown of its ability (~15s), would help the turkey players think that it is not thanksgiving everyday.

Edited by MomOw, 19 July 2015 - 09:13 PM.

[6ixxer]

one issue I can see is that it it has great difficulty engaging/chasing targets around cornes, since both its weapons spin-up.

my suggestion for fixing that is modifying the weapons into what i call "burst vulcans": (quoting my suggestion thread)

 

 

I don't like this idea.

 

Perhaps modify the ability so it spins the Vulcans without shooting?  Lower the VulcanXT heat/sec and swap the cooling for spinners (lol make them chrome :p )

 

VulcanXT have lower DPS than standard Vulcan so lore would easily explain why they don't heat so fast. They can be balanced by making the ability free spin them only at 75-80% of full speed so they still get faster, but they start out most of the way there.

 

You can use it to prep your Vulcans ready for an alpha, or to keep them ready to fire when working around cover. Just give it a unique spinny whirr so you don't round a corner when you hear it.

 

Probably more interesting play. *Hopefully can be balanced?*

 

Cheers,

6ixxer

Edited by 6ixxer, 22 July 2015 - 05:56 PM.

[StubbornPuppet]

I think that fixing the bug that cancels out the G2 Raider's speed increase if you press boost would go a long way to make it more playable and effective.  Trying to remember to not boost or dodge while the turkey is in attack mode is just stupid.  I don't know what happened to cause this glitch, or if it effects everyone, but I really hope it gets fixed.