61 replies to this topic

[Rukinom]

Hello all!

 

Over the past couple of months, many of us have become well aware of somebody utilizing the ASUS RoG Motherboard feature called "Sonic Radar." This is a tool, for those who are unaware, which works much like the HAWKEN radar, except it lights up targets even when they are walking by utilizing sound recognition and pinpointing where that sound is being emitted from. This effectively allows for wallhacking, and devalues radar silence, invisibility, and outflanking.

 

The issue with it? It's not touching the game's code. There's no way to trace the use of it, there's nothing it does to affect mouse motion, speed, textures, anything. A player could stream their gameplay and her viewers would be none the wiser. A player could compete in TPG matches, submit her footage, and be cleared without a second thought.

 

Little do we know, she may have a radar on a second monitor broadcasting every enemy's location regardless of any actual radar presence.

 

One user (who was scoring in record highs today) claimed to be using the program, and that "if this game begins banning for using modern hardware, it is truly doomed." She was a skilled player, hit her shots, knew how to dodge and all that, and she was up against some very competitive people, but she just had that extra little idea of where everyone was at any given time, and that tipped the scales to the point of near doubly outscoring any player on the server (around 530, whereas I was at 343 with 13/40 kills).

 

So my question is: is HAWKEN "doomed?" Because if this game has to go through the seventh layer of hell to get people to stop using Sonic Radar, I'd say it's worth it.

 

Not sure if there's any way to detect it, but I mean, she's literally outright claiming to be using it, and claims there's nothing wrong. Is there something wrong with it? What do y'all think?

 

EDIT: http://rog.asus.com/...ns/sonic-radar/A link to information about the product put forth by ASUS.

Edited by Rukinom, 04 February 2016 - 02:26 PM.

[Nightfirebolt]

I'd bet that these people are just using conventional hacks and claiming to be using this hardware to cover their asses.

 

Either way, it's not a good situation.

Edited by Nightfirebolt, 04 February 2016 - 04:22 PM.

[CraftyDus]

A player could compete in TPG matches, submit her footage, and be cleared without a second thought.

 

 

5 of the last 6 I caught were wallhacks/minimaphack(radar) pretending to soundwhore

thats my fetish

they get caught and they get banned

[devotion]

sonic radar won't make you double the score of players you wouldn't have doubled already.

[Nept]

She's just hacking.

[-Tj-]

If you're talking about the person I'm thinking of, I'm pretty sure they're just using cheats and doing what Nightfirebolt said. I read up on this piece of software, and as bad as it sounds, apparently it isn't as effective as the in-game radar at all. In fact, here's some videos of it in action:

 

 

Hawken radar: pinpoint enemy locations horizontally, estimate vertically.

ASUS Sonic Radar: close estimate of where a sound came from.

 

I'm with the other folks. They're probably just cheating and trying to cover their asses.

[Silent_]

Not really convinced either. Good headphones do much better job and without looking at radar.

 

IF it were accurate, it could be help in heavy firefight when you might miss walking sounds. Or same even more so with cloaked infil, boosting. But software in videos seems to be just useless distraction.

 

EDIT;

All audio sources outside of certain radius wont get played, and thus there is no way for analyzer to detect it either. If it isnt audible with decent audio setup, then it wont show up in that program either.

Edited by Silent_, 04 February 2016 - 04:25 PM.

[gArphEus]

Jeez... what else comes next ??? - Mindlink-to-movement interface, retina-HUD-overlay, and thought-triggered weaponry? Damn those cheetahs !!!

I say impale them on a spear and show them on the HAWKEN main screen as deterrent example 4 others... Hell, yeah !!! Torches and pitchforks !!!

And Blood and Souls 4 Arioch !!!

[WmMoneyFrmMissouri]

Jeez... what else comes next ??? - Mindlink-to-movement interface, retina-HUD-overlay, and thought-triggered weaponry? Damn those cheetahs !!!
I say impale them on a spear and show them on the HAWKEN main screen as deterrent example 4 others... Hell, yeah !!! Torches and pitchforks !!!
And Blood and Souls 4 Arioch !!!

... What's next in this crazy World you ask? Hands free masterbation.... MUAHAHAHA

[CraftyDus]

After watcher rog sonar vids, I can breathe easy knowing a decent set of headphones and a dxracer trump that program's efficacy.
Human ears are still way better.

[Kopra]

I find the use of words "sonic radar" the most disturbing.

Radar = radio detection and ranging
Sonar = sound navigation and ranging

[OpTiC_DeRpY]

Hello all!

 

Over the past couple of months, many of us have become well aware of somebody utilizing the ASUS RoG Motherboard feature called "Sonic Radar." This is a tool, for those who are unaware, which works much like the HAWKEN radar, except it lights up targets even when they are walking by utilizing sound recognition and pinpointing where that sound is being emitted from. This effectively allows for wallhacking, and devalues radar silence, invisibility, and outflanking.

 

The issue with it? It's not touching the game's code. There's no way to trace the use of it, there's nothing it does to affect mouse motion, speed, textures, anything. A player could stream their gameplay and her viewers would be none the wiser. A player could compete in TPG matches, submit her footage, and be cleared without a second thought.

 

Little do we know, she may have a radar on a second monitor broadcasting every enemy's location regardless of any actual radar presence.

 

One user (who was scoring in record highs today) claimed to be using the program, and that "if this game begins banning for using modern hardware, it is truly doomed." She was a skilled player, hit her shots, knew how to dodge and all that, and she was up against some very competitive people, but she just had that extra little idea of where everyone was at any given time, and that tipped the scales to the point of near doubly outscoring any player on the server (around 530, whereas I was at 343 with 13/40 kills).

 

So my question is: is HAWKEN "doomed?" Because if this game has to go through the seventh layer of hell to get people to stop using Sonic Radar, I'd say it's worth it.

 

Not sure if there's any way to detect it, but I mean, she's literally outright claiming to be using it, and claims there's nothing wrong. Is there something wrong with it? What do y'all think?

 

EDIT: http://rog.asus.com/...ns/sonic-radar/A link to information about the product put forth by ASUS.

Do you know how dumb you sound right now?

 

Oh man someone has something I don't ban em! Next thing you know you'll get the great idea, anyone getting over 60fps should be banned. Or anyone using a high end mouse should be banned, or a mechanical keyboard. God forbid they use an SSD that loading time gives such a huge advantage. Sonic Radar works best in games that have a volume slider for each individual sound stream. One for music, one for sfx(gunfire footsteps), one for ambient, cut out the music and ambient sounds Sonic Radar works well, but most online games use a cut and dry Music stream and general SFX which has gunfire footsteps and ambience all in one steam which renders something like Sonic Radar useless. Try learning about software and hardware before you go shouting on the rooftops for a ban, because right now you sound pretty dumb calling for a ban on gimmickware.

[PsychedelicGrass]

Looking at the videos it seems kinda useless, just gives a vague indicator of the direction the sound came from :|


I don't feel like this gives as much of an advantage as the person in question claims it does..

[-Tj-]

After watcher rog sonar vids, I can breathe easy knowing a decent set of headphones and a dxracer trump that program's efficacy.
Human ears are still way better.

 

I'm using a $5-for-2 pair of cheap Chinese-made earbuds. Works great. :)

[asipo]

i thought all cheat need to hook with the hawken

 

that include twitch/broadcast too right?

[ATX22]

i thought all cheat need to hook with the hawken

that include twitch/broadcast too right?

Dunno, I don't think nvidia shadowplay does, not sure why the sonic radar would need to either.

[phed]

Oh cool, I was thinking of coding something like this, would make it so deaf people could play fps at less of a disadvantage.

And I could turn down my headphones to protect what little hearing I have left.

I don't see any marked advantage this gives; unless you are paying in a custom server with radar off, maybe.

[Epsilon_Knight]

Those example videos don't really show where the software shines: 1v1 combat with audio below the noise floor created by your own mech.

 

I've been in plenty of fights where both parties duck around corners and try to stay off the radar, and rest assured they're still generating sound but it might not be possible to hear over footsteps, health alarm, etc.  Well those sounds are dead center and likely do not show up directionally on the radar (but even if they did, they would be extremely consisted in display every time).  In a situation like this, say in the hallways on Wreckage, this software can offer a definite advantage.

 

In the middle of a cluster fuzz?  Of course it's useless.

 

That said, I don't think it's game breaking, I don't think it'll allow anyone to double their normal score, and since it's built out of the audio driver, there's basically nothing to be done about it.  It doesn't hook into the game, there's no DLL injection or modified files to target, best case you could scan for the Asus Sonar default directories or registry entries indicating the visible component was installed, but that's pretty damn invasive.

 

So while I think it's not good honest gameplay, I don't think it has anything on the scanner item (pls nerf).

[CraftyDus]

No, ROG sonic radar is awful and will not help you

[comic_sans]

If it's who I (probably we) think it is, she's given to lie about a lot of things and probably gets more pleasure out of that than any other aspect of what she's doing.

[DieselCat]

... What's next in this crazy World you ask? Hands free masterbation.... MUAHAHAHA

Money, That's called hiring a hooker.....BaDa Bing !

[CoshCaust]

>extra little idea of where everyone was at any given time

>tipping the scales

 

Bruh that's stomping on the scales. Most of the time, a moderately talented player knows where any relevant enemies are, true, but having this wall-hacky advantage is not a small advantage. High up the skill ladder, a massive difference in player talent can be attributed simply to their comfort with the subtleties of movement in the direct vicinity of another player - deciding when to peak, when to stop entirely, etc. etc. - it's all psychological and is a skill learned like any other- one that a simple exploit completely overwrites.

 

My only point: This is an enormous advantage [even assuming this is what's being used and not simply wall hacks], and a person is pathetic for using it (not to mention concreting themselves as a bad player).

[XFXFuryX]

No, ROG sonic radar is awful and will not help you

 

This is the most retarded thing I have ever heard.

 

I personally have and use a Asus x99 Rampage Extreme, with "Sonic Radar II" I'm not sure what version of the technology is being used in the videos but I can tell you from 1st hand experience that Sonic Radar 2 is EPIC. Those videos are just some pre-set settings not even close to being optimized for the game they are playing, not to mention both videos show very outdated versions of the technology.

 

Sonic Radar II is fully customization and once you tuned the right sound tones to pick up instead of all the background and ambient noise, its a god sent in identifying where targets are coming from.

 

ASUS is the world's 5th-largest PC vendor by 2014 unit sales ^. ASUS appears in BusinessWeek�s "InfoTech 100" and "Asia�s Top 10 IT Companies" rankings, and it ranked FIRST in the IT Hardware category of the 2008 Taiwan Top 10 Global Brands survey with a total brand value of $1.3 billion.

 

I think its safe to say, these guys know EXACTLY what they are doing when it comes to developing this future technology.

 

I understand that some people may not like the new technology but such is life, technology will always progress. My advice to you is "Upgrade Your Hardware"

 

God forbid the developers start banning for technology advancements now. As if the game is not dead enough as it is.

 

Also I hear this being referred to as "Software" maybe the old version was but the new Sonic Radar II has a on board chip, on the motherboard. Pretty sure that classifies it as "Hardware" not "Software"

[-Tj-]

This is the most retarded thing I have ever heard.

 

[some stuff backing up ROG Sonic Radar as if it's the greatest thing to happen to gaming like EVER]

 

Upload us some video proof of how good this software is when used "properly" using your account in Hawken and I'll believe it. Till then, everything I've seen and read about it points me in the direction of "this is helpful, but doesn't make players a GOD."

Edited by -Tj-, 07 February 2016 - 08:41 PM.

[ATX22]

This is the most retarded thing I have ever heard.

 

I personally have and use a Asus x99 Rampage Extreme, with "Sonic Radar II" I'm not sure what version of the technology is being used in the videos but I can tell you from 1st hand experience that Sonic Radar 2 is EPIC. Those videos are just some pre-set settings not even close to being optimized for the game they are playing, not to mention both videos show very outdated versions of the technology.

 

Sonic Radar II is fully customization and once you tuned the right sound tones to pick up instead of all the background and ambient noise, its a god sent in identifying where targets are coming from.

 

ASUS is the world's 5th-largest PC vendor by 2014 unit sales ^. ASUS appears in BusinessWeek�s "InfoTech 100" and "Asia�s Top 10 IT Companies" rankings, and it ranked FIRST in the IT Hardware category of the 2008 Taiwan Top 10 Global Brands survey with a total brand value of $1.3 billion.

 

I think its safe to say, these guys know EXACTLY what they are doing when it comes to developing this future technology.

 

I understand that some people may not like the new technology but such is life, technology will always progress. My advice to you is "Upgrade Your Hardware"

 

God forbid the developers start banning for technology advancements now. As if the game is not dead enough as it is.

 

Also I hear this being referred to as "Software" maybe the old version was but the new Sonic Radar II has a on board chip, on the motherboard. Pretty sure that classifies it as "Hardware" not "Software"

 

I don't care if people use it, but let's not just slap the whole "advancements in technology" phrase on it and call it a day.  This is a crutch, just like keyboard and console macros... a crutch is a crutch.  Some people use cheats as a crutch, some people will use this.  It may not have the same impact, but it sounds like it's getting as close to crossing that line between cheating and not as you can get.

[MechFighter5e3bf9]

if this isnt just some bs trying to cover up someones use of hax and its real, then rather than the usual suggesting baning why not a quick fix, patch hawken so that there are random sound events around the player that are not auidible. then their radar will explode literaly

 

if they patch the hack to ignore inaudible ranges, then make it audible, for say a split second. if the hack can now detect audible range, then make it audible for a split sec, if they now also check for audible range AND split seconds then make it audible, and normal time BUT sound waves can be canceled out by an equal signal so it is possible to beat such a hack with just a little patchwork

 

and unreal engine 3 has plenty of tools to do it hell i could if they would let me

 

 on a side note, random noise generation and radar jammer seem to go hand in hand, i say radar jammers should produce walking sounds to go with the red blips, or repair sounds

 

(ps i want predator mech to allow directional speaker like in avp2010, allow us to record a clip in our mic and play it on crosshair, only a 3 second clip, cooldown between recordings and directional mic aswell, so from a far i can, record some audio clip from a brawl 2/3/4 guys going at it, then creep off and find a big c class repairing behind a rock and hes too far for me to sneak up on, too dangerous to interrupt his repair while i attempt closing the gap as sure as his friends will swarm backward, so.. hes 10% plops down to repair  im 100m away  and he could easily cover behind rock if i attempted to stop repair SO i use the directional mic/speaker to scare the hell out of him since he hears the clip i recorded of a brawl he stops repairing, he looks around and coast is clear, then resumes repairing mission accomplished there i am now wristblading his torso through his mech 

Edited by MechFighter5e3bf9, 07 February 2016 - 09:08 PM.

[MechFighter5e3bf9]

This is the most retarded thing I have ever heard.

 

I personally have and use a Asus x99 Rampage Extreme, with "Sonic Radar II" I'm not sure what version of the technology is being used in the videos but I can tell you from 1st hand experience that Sonic Radar 2 is EPIC. Those videos are just some pre-set settings not even close to being optimized for the game they are playing, not to mention both videos show very outdated versions of the technology.

 

Sonic Radar II is fully customization and once you tuned the right sound tones to pick up instead of all the background and ambient noise, its a god sent in identifying where targets are coming from.

 

ASUS is the world's 5th-largest PC vendor by 2014 unit sales ^. ASUS appears in BusinessWeek�s "InfoTech 100" and "Asia�s Top 10 IT Companies" rankings, and it ranked FIRST in the IT Hardware category of the 2008 Taiwan Top 10 Global Brands survey with a total brand value of $1.3 billion.

 

I think its safe to say, these guys know EXACTLY what they are doing when it comes to developing this future technology.

 

I understand that some people may not like the new technology but such is life, technology will always progress. My advice to you is "Upgrade Your Hardware"

 

God forbid the developers start banning for technology advancements now. As if the game is not dead enough as it is.

 

Also I hear this being referred to as "Software" maybe the old version was but the new Sonic Radar II has a on board chip, on the motherboard. Pretty sure that classifies it as "Hardware" not "Software"

this feature is not an upgrade realy because thats like saying joe bloes gaming mouse with rapid fire and macro functionality is an upgrade when all this is, is the same features we had only melded into hardware so those hardware manufacturers can get a buck too instead of helios and all them hack sellers making the money. just cause it is in the form of hardware doesnt make it innocent, you buy a hardware radar to cheat your an idiot because there is no easier way to identify and "treat differently" people who use such "hacks" and yes its a hack anything you do to use a product as it was not intended to accomplish a job, you did a hack job

[CraftyDus]

Seriously, you kids think this is better than just using your ears. It's so much worse.

ROG "sonic radar" will actually make you worse if you used it in lieu of headphones.

It's a marketing gimmick, and confers little to no benefit.

[MechFighter5e3bf9]

and any hack such as this that uses overlays on top of the game screen is only surviving in hawken now cause hawkens building up its strength and when they are ready they can start up proper anti cheat like any other out of production game. even punkbuster was great at nabbing hacks that hooked into the "canvas",using known malicious drivers and payloads being hooked in a live game and and especially good at detecting third party overlays such as this radar using admin screen shots

 

personaly i think the security boost is worth the cost of no steam overlay, or someones skype bubble bliping around ffs

Edited by MechFighter5e3bf9, 07 February 2016 - 09:57 PM.

[CraftyDus]

to repeat, it's useless.

read : not an advantage, whatso-ever

 

 

ah nvm, you're not gonna get it

[CraftyDus]

lol runa

[MechFighter5e3bf9]

its useless being my point i just figgured id drag it out for some people who would like to not live in fear of the new wave of hacker horror  this post was sure to instill

 

saying its useless is fine for most of us but some people wanna know why it is useless all jokes aside

Edited by MechFighter5e3bf9, 07 February 2016 - 11:04 PM.

[CraftyDus]

It's merely a sound visualizer.
Unless you are entirely deaf, it's not giving you anything extra.
It's clumsily trying to show you what your ears are already telling you.
And it's doing it poorly.

[MechFighter5e3bf9]

yeah but it scares the 40 year old hardcore players they done invested too much to let some skum do a trick like this so im just blabing a few technical difficulties for such a hack sos to keep any fear from starting, cause you know good n well this things gonna become a goto failsafe for wallhackers who've been caught

[Call_Me_Ishmael]

 

Also I hear this being referred to as "Software" maybe the old version was but the new Sonic Radar II has a on board chip, on the motherboard. Pretty sure that classifies it as "Hardware" not "Software"

 

Step 9 in how to lie: make a truthful statement/admission.  The rest of the post has a striking resemblance to a certain "princess'" style.

[PoopSlinger]

This is the most retarded thing I have ever heard.

 

I personally have and use a Asus x99 Rampage Extreme, with "Sonic Radar II" I'm not sure what version of the technology is being used in the videos but I can tell you from 1st hand experience that Sonic Radar 2 is EPIC. Those videos are just some pre-set settings not even close to being optimized for the game they are playing, not to mention both videos show very outdated versions of the technology.

 

Sonic Radar II is fully customization and once you tuned the right sound tones to pick up instead of all the background and ambient noise, its a god sent in identifying where targets are coming from.

 

ASUS is the world's 5th-largest PC vendor by 2014 unit sales ^. ASUS appears in BusinessWeek�s "InfoTech 100" and "Asia�s Top 10 IT Companies" rankings, and it ranked FIRST in the IT Hardware category of the 2008 Taiwan Top 10 Global Brands survey with a total brand value of $1.3 billion.

 

I think its safe to say, these guys know EXACTLY what they are doing when it comes to developing this future technology.

 

I understand that some people may not like the new technology but such is life, technology will always progress. My advice to you is "Upgrade Your Hardware"

 

God forbid the developers start banning for technology advancements now. As if the game is not dead enough as it is.

 

Also I hear this being referred to as "Software" maybe the old version was but the new Sonic Radar II has a on board chip, on the motherboard. Pretty sure that classifies it as "Hardware" not "Software"

Its still software. As far as "know EXACTLY what they are doing"  they are marketing dumb fuzzy bunny to push their ROG brand.  They're trying to create exclusivity with software that is made to run with their mobos and soundcards.  That's probably because slapping gaming on the box and covering the thing in multicolored plastic and LEDs doesn't cut it anymore.

 

 

EDIT:  Its ok, I got gimmicked into buying an overpriced motherboard too.

Edited by PoopSlinger, 08 February 2016 - 05:50 AM.

[Epsilon_Knight]

It's merely a sound visualizer.
Unless you are entirely deaf, it's not giving you anything extra.
It's clumsily trying to show you what your ears are already telling you.
And it's doing it poorly.

You're either an idiot or a god.

 

Eyes are accurate, easily down to ~0.015 degrees.  For audio localization, directly in front of you, accuracy is down to ~1.0 degrees, but 7-15 degrees for sounds located further to your sides.  That's without interfering, often louder sounds.  So having something you can watch at the bottom of your screen giving you better than 360 degrees worth of directional information IS better than human hearing.  Seeing a directional indicator for sounds that would be substantially or entirely camouflaged by your mech noise IS better than human hearing.

 

You could argue that Hawken's audio information is incorrect (which would throw your ears off, too), or that the ASUS driver/software is bad at translating the audio information to a lateral direction (doubt it), or that there's too much noise in the software (though XFXFuryX's personal experience would differ), maybe.

 

But hey, why bother with the details when you can always just call anyone who disagrees "kids", and assert that it's not an advantage at all?

Edited by Epsilon_Knight, 08 February 2016 - 08:27 AM.

[Hyginos]

You're either an idiot or a god.

 

Eyes are accurate, easily down to ~0.015 degrees.  For audio localization, directly in front of you, accuracy is down to ~1.0 degrees, but 7-15 degrees for sounds located further to your sides.  That's without interfering, often louder sounds.  So having something you can watch at the bottom of your screen giving you better than 360 degrees worth of directional information IS better than human hearing.  Seeing a directional indicator for sounds that would be substantially or entirely camouflaged by your mech noise IS better than human hearing.

 

You could argue that Hawken's audio information is incorrect (which would throw your ears off, too), or that the ASUS driver/software is bad at translating the audio information to a lateral vector (doubt it), or that there's too much noise in the software (though XFXFuryX's personal experience would differ), maybe.

 

But hey, why bother with the details when you can always just call anyone who disagrees "kids", and assert that it's not an advantage at all?

 

While you are correct about the directional resolution, but you are making the assumption that the display itself is accurate enough that visual inspection of it can be more accurate than simply hearing the same sounds. After watching the videos of it in action I would assert that it most certainly is not.

[eth0]

Eyes are accurate, easily down to ~0.015 degrees.  For audio localization, directly in front of you, accuracy is down to ~1.0 degrees, but 7-15 degrees for sounds located further to your sides.  That's without interfering, often louder sounds.  So having something you can watch at the bottom of your screen giving you better than 360 degrees worth of directional information IS better than human hearing.  Seeing a directional indicator for sounds that would be substantially or entirely camouflaged by your mech noise IS better than human hearing.

 

/r/theydidthemath

[Epsilon_Knight]

While you are correct about the directional resolution, but you are making the assumption that the display itself is accurate enough that visual inspection of it can be more accurate than simply hearing the same sounds. After watching the videos of it in action I would assert that it most certainly is not.

 

XFXFuryX seems like they'd dispute those videos of old software that may not have been properly configured.  Nothing concrete to go on until someone posts video of it in use in Hawken, properly configured, whatever that may mean.

 

However, there's nothing physically preventing the software from showing noise direction accurately to the limits of the monitor.  Relying on Asus software being bad means it might only be sorta-kinda-fair till the next motherboard is released.  That's not a new meta I want to participate in.

 

/r/theydidthemath

 

/r/ididthegoogle

 

Also common sense.  You can try to aim at stuff in front of you with your volume turned up and your monitor turned off, but don't expect good results.

Edited by Epsilon_Knight, 08 February 2016 - 08:43 AM.