29 replies to this topic

[teeth_03]

I'm posting this immediately after playing for a couple hours this morning, and I would like to dump my thoughts somewhere because I stopped playing after getting pretty frustrated with the game. I'll do this in list form.

 

1. First off, I played about 6 games of TDM and lost every one (after playing 2 rounds of MA and winning the 2nd), while being either 1st or 2nd on my team

 

2. After every match, half the server emptied (at least), and it would take a good chunk of the next round to re populate, meanwhile, the teams are unbalanced at 3v4,4v5 or 5v6. It really hurts when its 3v4 for a good chunk of a match.

 

3. Because of not getting the daily win, I feel like I didn't accomplish anything by losing 6 matches, which I think is the most frustrating part. Not getting the daily win bonus after 6 loses means I feel like I can't enjoy the game if I'm too worried about not getting it.

 

That daily win right now is pretty much the carrot on a stick for me. If I don't get it after a couple matches, it gets frustrating. We need other kinds of bonuses in place of this.

 

The worst part of this is, I haven't won a game of TDM in like 3 days, I'm pretty consistently on the losing handicapped team, which is quite annoying.

 

Get rid of the daily win bonuses and lower the time between matches please

 

 

[CrimsonKaim]

Seems to be a problem of #matchmaking

[Elite_is_salty]

How long have you been playing? Don't you have enough HC by now? I have like 400k so I never give a damn about it lol

[teeth_03]

I have like, 8k. Besides, this isn't about just you or me, its how new players might be experiencing the same thing.

[Dawn_of_Ash]

I'm posting this immediately after playing for a couple hours this morning, and I would like to dump my thoughts somewhere because I stopped playing after getting pretty frustrated with the game. I'll do this in list form.

 

1. First off, I played about 6 games of TDM and lost every one (after playing 2 rounds of MA and winning the 2nd), while being either 1st or 2nd on my team

 

2. After every match, half the server emptied (at least), and it would take a good chunk of the next round to re populate, meanwhile, the teams are unbalanced at 3v4,4v5 or 5v6. It really hurts when its 3v4 for a good chunk of a match.

 

3. Because of not getting the daily win, I feel like I didn't accomplish anything by losing 6 matches, which I think is the most frustrating part. Not getting the daily win bonus after 6 loses means I feel like I can't enjoy the game if I'm too worried about not getting it.

 

That daily win right now is pretty much the carrot on a stick for me. If I don't get it after a couple matches, it gets frustrating. We need other kinds of bonuses in place of this.

 

The worst part of this is, I haven't won a game of TDM in like 3 days, I'm pretty consistently on the losing handicapped team, which is quite annoying.

 

Get rid of the daily win bonuses and lower the time between matches please

 

I do understand your problem - even though I also have too much money in my hands. The thing about the Daily Win Bonus, is that you have to win. New players keep getting stomped by smurfs and bad matchmaking and they never learn of this "Daily Bonus" before they, swiftly, quit the game. It makes a lot of sense now why the game is having a hard time getting new players and that the majority of new players entering the game is because of social media promotions.

 

Anyway, I digress. I feel that if there is a Daily Bonus, which allows the player to gain "x" amount of HC if they just play and finish a match, then there would be something for it. Another option is that each player gets a sort of "extra HC pool" which refills daily, and allows each player to get, lets say for examples sake, 1000HC if they complete enough matches or play long enough instead of forcing you to play each game mode to gain the maximum amount of HC.

 

Just throwing ideas around.

Edited by Dawn_of_Ash, 28 March 2015 - 06:28 AM.

[reznog]

Im not a fan of the daily win system either. We used to have Hc and Xp rewards for achievements, i didn't care to check my unlocks since the removal

Edited by reznog, 28 March 2015 - 06:40 AM.

[FlamingBeaker]

When you say you were 1st or 2nd on your team in TDM, do you mean top score or top K/D ratio?

 

Not baiting, just asking for clarity in your post.

 

And I agree about the carrot on a stick.

 

And don't get me started about the "20 HC for Team Balancing" Bonus. Yuck.

Edited by FlamingBeaker, 28 March 2015 - 06:40 AM.

[OmegaNull]

I'm posting this immediately after playing for a couple hours this morning, and I would like to dump my thoughts somewhere because I stopped playing after getting pretty frustrated with the game. I'll do this in list form.

 

1. First off, I played about 6 games of TDM and lost every one (after playing 2 rounds of MA and winning the 2nd), while being either 1st or 2nd on my team

 

Being a long time player of this game, I do completely and wholeheartedly understand where you are coming from. TDM is tough and it gets unbalanced really easily. I have been on both sides multiple times (have something like 1600-1700 team games I have played and only have a 55% team win percentage). I been the person who floats my team and still cannot win the game or demolish the other team netting a lopsided win. Either one doesn't feel very good and I love having close games. At least with those, if you loose you know you tried hard. 

 

2. After every match, half the server emptied (at least), and it would take a good chunk of the next round to re populate, meanwhile, the teams are unbalanced at 3v4,4v5 or 5v6. It really hurts when its 3v4 for a good chunk of a match.

This is another reason why I have a lot of annoyance with TDM, Siege, and MA games (and love DM). A lot of times I a player has sat out (or I have sat out) to even things up. 

3. Because of not getting the daily win, I feel like I didn't accomplish anything by losing 6 matches, which I think is the most frustrating part. Not getting the daily win bonus after 6 loses means I feel like I can't enjoy the game if I'm too worried about not getting it.

 

That daily win right now is pretty much the carrot on a stick for me. If I don't get it after a couple matches, it gets frustrating. We need other kinds of bonuses in place of this.

 

The worst part of this is, I haven't won a game of TDM in like 3 days, I'm pretty consistently on the losing handicapped team, which is quite annoying.

 

Get rid of the daily win bonuses and lower the time between matches please

 

Since the beginning of implementing the daily win system we have had this issue. Players play, win, leave, rinse and repeat. Instead of staying in a match and having some fun they just leave. It really annoys me to hell and back and the way things were before was so much better. 

Edited by OmegaNull, 28 March 2015 - 08:31 AM.

[teeth_03]

Well, I'm trying to get my concerns heard, because I feel these issues are more important than some of the other stuff people are discussing, including whatever the hell the starting mech looks like because clearly that is game breaking.

[SigmaOmega]

Well, I'm trying to get my concerns heard, because I feel these issues are more important than some of the other stuff people are discussing, including whatever the hell the starting mech looks like because clearly that is game breaking.

Hopefully with the new devs, they will be heard. There are plenty of other topics as well that are being covered hopefully. Only time will tell what will happen. Until then, the new devs are still working on the bugs.

 

I would also suggest hoping on the official unofficial hawken teamspeak.

[Broham78]

High level players server hopping and noob stomping has always been a problem in Hawken. That's why it empties out quickly after the match. Gameplay has been garbage today but there's always tomorrow.

[SigmaOmega]

High level players server hopping and noob stomping has always been a problem in Hawken. That's why it empties out quickly after the match. Gameplay has been garbage today but there's always tomorrow.

Persistance and positive outlook is the key. I always have fun even when I am pub stomped

[Brawler_Yukon]

Im not a fan of the daily win system either. We used to have Hc and Xp rewards for achievements, i didn't care to check my unlocks since the removal

What are you talking about, we still have HC bonuses for doing certain achieves, there just aren't a whole massive amount to alleviate the point of the DWB, which is so that the grind isn't completely unbearable. I'm all in favor of a better HC system, but DWB is the only thing around to make getting HC easy/bearable to me.

[Broham78]

Persistance and positive outlook is the key. I always have fun even when I am pub stomped

I personally fire up my Predator and follow them to the next server to punish them for thier transgressions

[MomOw]

Frustration... humm... well I played today on the laptop computer of my GF, fps ~15 on the middle of the fights on Bazaar, can't aim at flying Zerkers.... 

 

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH

 

http://en.wikipedia....e_Primal_Scream

[teeth_03]

Frustration... humm... well I played today on the laptop computer of my GF, fps ~15 on the middle of the fights on Bazaar, can't aim at flying Zerkers.... 

 

WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH

 

http://en.wikipedia....e_Primal_Scream

 

That is self inflicted frustration, nothing the devs can fix.

[Dawn_of_Ash]

I still think that idea that if a player stays in a server for multiple matches, that they should get a bonus should be implemented. This problem is the cause of many other problems, to be blunt. Small player base due to many small problems which add together to make a large problem. The only thing that the game has for keeping new players is it's epic gameplay.

[HeraldRedfordIII]

I don't know much about Matchmaking but is it possible to transfer one group of players from one server to another. Or smashing two servers together kinda like salvaging players

[AsianJoyKiller]

If the bonuses aren't tied to wins, what's to keep me from essentially AFKing (and doing whatever I have to, to avoid getting AFK booted) in base? All of the credits, none of the effort.

And before someone brings up, "Why bother if you don't even play the game?" or "Why not have fun and play the game anyway?"

I don't know. But people do it. There are a frightening number of people out there who will AFK and not play the game so they can progress in the very game they aren't playing.

[crockrocket]

If the bonuses aren't tied to wins, what's to keep me from essentially AFKing (and doing whatever I have to, to avoid getting AFK booted) in base? All of the credits, none of the effort.

And before someone brings up, "Why bother if you don't even play the game?" or "Why not have fun and play the game anyway?"

I don't know. But people do it. There are a frightening number of people out there who will AFK and not play the game so they can progress in the very game they aren't playing.

Ugh. I hadn't considered that. I do think that a bonus for consecutive matches is important though. Perhaps a more stringent activity requirement, I.e. you need to give and/or take a certain amount of damage. Still potential for abuse, but less so.

[MomOw]

Isn't an automatic kick from idling already implemented ? Isn't it enough to prevent this type of abuse ?

[crockrocket]

Isn't an automatic kick from idling already implemented ? Isn't it enough to prevent this type of abuse ?

AJK's concern was that people might wander in circles around base, or otherwise actively avoid combat. Though I think this shouldn't be a major concern, it is certainly worthy of consideration.

[sabrehawk90]

Isn't an automatic kick from idling already implemented ? Isn't it enough to prevent this type of abuse ?

 

The way the automatic kick works is that you have to not give any player input for a bit, then it kicks you. The problem with it is that you can fire a single bullet or press A every half minute and you won't get kicked.

[MomOw]

As the vast majority of people in hawken are players (i.e. they log in to play the game) I don't think this would be a real issue.
There will always be some mad people not playing the game, but leave them be as long as they are not able to do ruin too much games

[teeth_03]

How about just a bigger points to HC ratio? That way, if I play like a boss and get 800-900 points in MA but my team still loses, I get more HC.

[moosa17]

That daily win right now is pretty much the carrot on a stick for me. If I don't get it after a couple matches, it gets frustrating. We need other kinds of bonuses in place of this.

 

I understand, but the last thing we "need" is for the game to be more watered down with grind mechanics rather than being actually fun to play. You need to stop worrying about this. I know it's nice to get the bonus and it is frustrating when you want it and go 10 games losing (and yes that is a different issue), but if you're playing Hawken for the carrot and not because it's actually fun to play, take a break for a while and play something else. If you want to keep playing Hawken, don't play it for the bonus or the HC. As long as you are completing matches it will come in quick enough.

I've wasted enough hours of my life "playing" games that are all promise of fun and no delivery. I've ended up on Hawken because it's one of the only F2P games that you can actually enjoy like a proper game instead of following endless lies of "fun" behind a locked door. 

Edited by moosa17, 29 March 2015 - 09:29 PM.

[teeth_03]

How are any of the suggestions in this thread making the game more "watered down with grind mechanics"? We are suggesting the game make more logical sense for both the grind and player retention.

It may not matter that much to you, but the daily win bonuses are kind of like a set goal put in place by the old devs, " Win a game of every game type every day." Of course the game is still played and enjoyed while trying to reach that goal, albiet not with a large reward by any measure, but its still a goal that is there to be reached.

Not to mention, the issue of players leaving games to play another game type because they just won, causing servers to empty out. I would like to play the game types I want to play, not ones that I still need to earn a bonus for.

[Pastorius]

Firstly, let me say that your post addresses some long standing issues with the game and I understand your frustrations. People constantly quitting and rejoining servers is a vicious circle and incredibly frustrating. I'm sure that it is also the route to all the auto-balance problems. You just cant expect the game to correctly balance a half empty server with an odd number of players. 

 

I still think that idea that if a player stays in a server for multiple matches, that they should get a bonus should be implemented. This problem is the cause of many other problems, to be blunt. Small player base due to many small problems which add together to make a large problem. The only thing that the game has for keeping new players is it's epic gameplay.

 

I like this and agree but I also see AJK's point about playing the AFK in order to progress. Maybe it could be tied in with the win bonus? Say, a percentage roll-over for staying in the server? If the server is full and the auto-balance actually has a chance to work, the likelihood of you getting a win the next time around has to be higher if you didn't manage it in the first game.

 

Thanks for the post teeth_03 

Edited by Pastorius, 30 March 2015 - 06:56 AM.

[teeth_03]

I would like to thank the devs for answering some of my questions that were related to issues in this thread:)

 

Thanks Guys!

 

Obviously I didn't get any concrete answers, but I feel better that the devs are aware of the issues.

[Jerv]

How long have you been playing? Don't you have enough HC by now? I have like 400k so I never give a damn about it lol

 

Well, that's 500 hours right there, on top of the HC you've spent already. However, those of us who have families and jobs can't rack up numbers like that, especially since skill has zero effect on earnings.

 

Personally, betweeen the messed up economics and the MM, I think the new devs have A LOT of work to do before I come back. I left for the same reasons OP is frustrated, and only returned to see if the new owners can take a game that had potential and get rid of the parts that made me quit the first time. Thus far, the only reason I haven't left again is that I know that change takes time.... but it seems that every improvement on the dev's side is countered by the community growing more toxic because of people like you berating those that haven't dedicated their lives to Hawken!

 

I play games for fun. Your attitude makes Hawken less fun. Many Hawken players share your attitude, and many also share mine.

 

 

What are you talking about, we still have HC bonuses for doing certain achieves, there just aren't a whole massive amount to alleviate the point of the DWB, which is so that the grind isn't completely unbearable. I'm all in favor of a better HC system, but DWB is the only thing around to make getting HC easy/bearable to me.

 

Aside from 250 HC for the first win of the day in each battle mode, there really isn't any way to earn HC. I mean, that Daily Mode Win bonus alone is double what you earn in a match regardless of damage dealt or KDR or any other measure; it's 12 HC/minute no matter whether you AFK or wipe the entire enemy team 38 times in 0.03 seconds.

 

An additional 20 HC for a win doesn't mean much because MMR is borked to where personal perfomance has zero effect on your odds of winning, not that 20 HC is much. But aside from DWB and the 1-in-10 chance of a pitiful "bonus", the economics in this game are a blatant cash grab, and I hope the new devs fix it as well as fix the MM that puts me in the same matches as ADHD kids tweaking on Red Bull; something I thought MMR was supposed to disallow. 

Edited by Jerv, 04 April 2015 - 10:23 PM.