213 replies to this topic

[AsianJoyKiller]

It is my belief that upcoming patches should focus much more on balance and functionality.
And if you're going to add new content, how about a new C-Class already_

Edited by AsianJoyKiller, November 29 2013 - 06:37 PM.

[CookieTheory]

AsianJoyKiller, on November 29 2013 - 06:37 PM, said:

It is my belief that upcoming patches should focus much more on balance and functionality.
And if you're going to add new content, how about a new C-Class already_

They did mention before they were working on another mech at the same time as the predator. We'll probably see it in the next patch.

[Cyclohexane]

Some of you guys seem disapointed.  I completely agree balance is needed, but some of the content sounds awesome, especially a new map!

Developers:  Thanks for the continued updates on this great and free game!  And please listen to the community for balance changes, we can make your job easier.  I gaurnatee we play more than the programmers!

Edited by Cyclohexane, November 29 2013 - 07:02 PM.

[Aims]

I look forward to the content but some of the more alarming balance issues (such as the failsafe) should have been... dare I say... a priority_

[Sylhiri]

Aims, on November 29 2013 - 07:55 PM, said:

I look forward to the content but some of the more alarming balance issues (such as the failsafe) should have been... dare I say... a priority_

[SeasonzTZK]

Cyclohexane, on November 29 2013 - 07:01 PM, said:

Some of you guys seem disapointed.  I completely agree balance is needed, but some of the content sounds awesome, especially a new map!

Developers:  Thanks for the continued updates on this great and free game!  And please listen to the community for balance changes, we can make your job easier.  I gaurnatee we play more than the programmers!

Yes, I am dissapointed. How do you expect me to enjoy the new features if playing the game is a pain in the ass with all the unbalanced stuff_ Not to offend anybody on the devs side; with all due respect, I understand theres a small team behind all this that works their ass off to bring us cool stuff. But please, dont saturate us with content until you fix the balancing issues. Yes I know new map, drones etc is cool; but I seriously can't enjoy the game with the broken internals, server issues, crashes and so on. Seriously, it seems like you are nerfing what does'nt need to be nerfed and buffing what doesnt needs a buff. Turret mode buff_ I can think about the amount of times turret mode is actually useful and I would probably say 2 out of 10. It seems to me like you are focusing on the look of the game rather than in the mechanics; yes it looks pretty but that doesn't make me feel better when everything is unbalanced. I really feel we are going backwards rather than forward with this game, im sorry to be negative but thats what I think.

No offense intended, its just my opinion.

[DM30]

My thoughts after reading through this:

Pros:
1 - New map!
2 - MIRV nerf -- even as someone who enjoys playing the Raider a lot, I still felt that the MIRV mode needed toning down. Eager to see how the balance re-settles after this. Now, if the Scout Flak issue could be dialed back a tiny bit as well (WITHOUT hurting the Brawler), I'd be one thrilled Beta tester.
3 - Brawler buff -- turret mode is used so infrequently that this won't really affect much IMO, but at least the mech is getting attention. Hopefully next patch brings a non-turreted movement speed buff.

Con:
- Only one, but it's a doozy -- Broken content remaining broken.
--Failsafe needs to return to its previous values, and possibly lower in a subsequent patch depending on how they settle out.
--Fuel Converter should not reward fuel on self-damage.
--Hellfires need a lower maximum turning rate, AND they need to stop tracking if their target goes beyond a 100 degree (or thereabouts) angle from straight forward. (This from someone who plays Bruiser and Rocketeer extensively, and found them much more fun to play before the current iteration of HFs when they actually took strategy and foresight to use effectively).

Just throwing ideas out there, but those are my feelings.

Edited by DM30, November 29 2013 - 08:30 PM.

[Xacius]

SeasonzTZK, on November 29 2013 - 08:07 PM, said:

Cyclohexane, on November 29 2013 - 07:01 PM, said:

Some of you guys seem disapointed.  I completely agree balance is needed, but some of the content sounds awesome, especially a new map!

Developers:  Thanks for the continued updates on this great and free game!  And please listen to the community for balance changes, we can make your job easier.  I gaurnatee we play more than the programmers!

dont saturate us with content until you fix the balancing issues.

Quoted for emphasis.  I believe their design mentality is: "unless we're pushing new content, our players won't be spending money!"

While some of this may be true, I don't believe it takes the entire community into account.  

Here's how most of the more experienced players feel at the moment: "If you don't balance your game properly, we won't play it."

Why can't both parties be made happy_

[SeasonzTZK]

Xacius, on November 29 2013 - 08:39 PM, said:

SeasonzTZK, on November 29 2013 - 08:07 PM, said:

Cyclohexane, on November 29 2013 - 07:01 PM, said:

Some of you guys seem disapointed.  I completely agree balance is needed, but some of the content sounds awesome, especially a new map!

Developers:  Thanks for the continued updates on this great and free game!  And please listen to the community for balance changes, we can make your job easier.  I gaurnatee we play more than the programmers!

dont saturate us with content until you fix the balancing issues.

Quoted for emphasis.  I believe their design mentality is: "unless we're pushing new content, our players won't be spending money!"

While some of this may be true, I don't believe it takes the entire community into account.  

Here's how most of the more experienced players feel at the moment: "If you don't balance your game properly, we won't play it."

Why can't both parties be made happy_

This^^, I seriously dont think Ill keep playing this game if the balance issues are not addressed (not a threat, if it matters at all anyway). Correct me if Im wrong, but I think the purpose of a game is to make you have fun, not to piss you off and stress the fuzzy bunny out of you.

Edited by SeasonzTZK, November 29 2013 - 08:54 PM.

[NegativeD]

O no clan support yet. I see.

[KejiGoto]

It's pretty obvious this patch was more focused on content over balancing issues (unfortunately) but I think those complaining need to take a step back and remember this patch was sent up to the Seattle QA team before last week. We're also getting a fair amount of stuff with this patch including the Operation Frostburn 2.0 and a new map.

Personally I'm pretty stoked for Frostburn 2.0 and what secrets appear to be hidden in Snow Last Eco. It's pretty clear a fair amount of work went into this event and personally I'm looking forward to all the goodies to be had there. Also the new map looks awesome and I think it is pretty sweet that we're gonna have some dedicated servers for it making it very easy for anyone and everyone to check it out at their own pace.

Yes it sucks that we have to deal with no skill Hellfires and no skill Failsafe for another month but we still got a fair amount with this patch.

With that said balancing does need to be a bigger focus moving forward. I do not find most matches to be fun anymore. It's the same exploited nonsense every match and the results are more often than not lopsided matches where one team doesn't stand a chance. What's worse is players (you know who you are and you suck) who don't mind going 40 to 12 but the moment the shoe is on the other foot they turn tail and run.

Honestly fixing turret mode for any C-Class should be at the bottom of the priority list right now, even if the mech is well balanced in other regards. Why_ Because there are other problems which are far bigger and deserve much more attention than they appear to be getting. Brawler's issues do not lie with SA Hawkins, Turret Mode, or damage output but rather it is a mobility issue. For some reason the mechs that scream "I'M A WALKING TANK!" are given considerably more mobility and options than the Brawler is. In my opinion Rocketeer and Grenadier should both be the walking tanks which are slow lumbering mechs with a massive payload. I can't for the life of me understand why the two mechs with two explosive weapons and massive damage output get considering more mobility than the Brawler with its limited range.

Reverse these two (or three rather). Give the Brawler some worthwhile mobility and slow down the Rocketeer/Grenadier some. I think the whole idea of "More armor should equal a slower mech" is out the window with how some mechs perform. When mechs like Berserker, Bruiser,  ans Assault can get armor comparable to the mech class above them there is no excuse for the Brawler to be as slow as it is. Not only that but it's dodging is terrible and when I overheat I feel like I'll get back into the fight a whole lot faster just getting killed and respawning. All the armor in the world isn't going to help the Brawler when it can't run from any engagement, it can barely dodge anything, and has zero ability to chase. When I'm watching mechs stroll by when I'm boosting there's a massive issue there.

As for the lack of a Hellfire and Failsafe nerf the sooner these happen the better. Right now neither of these actually promote skill and anyone who says otherwise is blind. There's no situation where you need a 90% reduction on self damage, there's no reason for Hellfires to be as good as they are compared to weapons that require you to aim. The motto moving forward for balancing should be "If it makes the game easier then it shouldn't be."

There's nothing wrong with having a steep learning curve. When things are introduced which make it easier for new players to play you can bet your ass the high tier players will start abusing it too. Not only that but if it promotes bad gameplay habits it shouldn't be in the game.

For example slapping a Failsafe on a Scout, equipping a Heat Cannon (which needs to be nerfed), and then bum rushing everyone requires no skill at all. I don't care who you are or what situation you're in. I see people say "Oh but if they have a Shield then I need to get them out of it." You're wrong. You have several options are disposal including retreating, destroying the Shield, hanging back so you can dodge their fire, and so forth. If I have no problems playing EOC Infiltrator without a Failsafe then you can do it too. The problem is you became dependent on horrible gameplay habits and now require a crutch to be good.

Hopefully balance becomes a bigger issue moving forward. I know that just because we see new content doesn't mean balance isn't being worked on but I think being a little more public about it (The Cockpit is a great place for this /shamelessplug) and giving players an idea of what direction the team is heading would be great. I've got no doubts that we'll see the Failsafe and Hellfires nerfed sooner rather than later but there are still other issues outside of those that need to be addressed.

With that said I'm still excited to check out the new content and see how beautiful Wreckage looks on my system.

[MrShade_]

Hey devs, you need to stop trying to make Brawler Turret mode a thing. Giving it a speed boost in turret mode only is pretty much useless.

[BucketOfSkin]

Cyclohexane, on November 29 2013 - 07:01 PM, said:

Some of you guys seem disapointed.  I completely agree balance is needed, but some of the content sounds awesome, especially a new map!

Developers:  Thanks for the continued updates on this great and free game!  And please listen to the community for balance changes, we can make your job easier.  I gaurnatee we play more than the programmers!

YES. ALL 200 OF US PLAYING THE GAME ARE DISAPPOINTED.

[eth0]

Excited about the new content and looking forward to the next patch already! I'm counting the days... as soon as I find out when it is, anyway.

I can't handle all this excitement. Updates should be more frequent.

[HighCaliber]

BucketOfSkin, on November 29 2013 - 09:40 PM, said:

Cyclohexane, on November 29 2013 - 07:01 PM, said:

Some of you guys seem disapointed.  I completely agree balance is needed, but some of the content sounds awesome, especially a new map!

Developers:  Thanks for the continued updates on this great and free game!  And please listen to the community for balance changes, we can make your job easier.  I gaurnatee we play more than the programmers!

YES. ALL 200 OF US PLAYING THE GAME ARE DISAPPOINTED.

How this thread makes me feel.

]

[Akrium]

My biggest issues are the two "balancing" options.

1) Why use the mirv at all now_ What is the idea behind just straight up reducing the damage it does_ I understand you feel it does more damage than it should, but I think there is a FAR better option to fixing the weapon and add more interesting game play than just a dmg reduction.

Why not just reduce the range on the MIRV to be someplace between 25-50 meters_

That alone would cause ppl to diversify how they play. The mirv would be the cqc option and the slug would be the middle to range distance option. As the MIRV would do ZERO dmg at those ranges. Now that is FAR more interesting than just making the mirv, a shotgun dmg gun that can have pellets miss, do close enough dmg that the slug is going to be the better option the majority of the time. You are going to see a huge change over to the more accurate and efficient kla-slug. Once ppl understand the mirv does less dmg.

2) Why is the Hawkin's now a fully upgrade option over the AR_ It has a longer range, better accuracy and more dps. WHAT_!_!_!

The gun is failing in use because sustain weapons are still failing on a whole and you have way too many similar guns that are sustain dmg. Pick one of 5 similar sustain dmg weapons that are different in dmg/accuracy and range in a balanced way. Plus you put in on some mechs that have no real reason to use it. Such as the brawler.

This change confuses me to no end. Willing to change my mind about this after testing it some.. but I have a bad feeling.

Other than that, patch looks good =)

[ShadowWarg]

KejiGoto, on November 29 2013 - 09:28 PM, said:

It's pretty obvious this patch was more focused on content over balancing issues (unfortunately) but I think those complaining need to take a step back and remember this patch was sent up to the Seattle QA team before last week. We're also getting a fair amount of stuff with this patch including the Operation Frostburn 2.0 and a new map.

Of course the new content is cool, and I love it. But for the past 2/3 patches, which has been the past 2/3 months, there hasn't been any real balancing going on. And what was "balanced" was normally things that not many if anyone asked for, took noticed to, or thought was completely fine. I love the game and ADH and I understand that its a small team, (also I HATE sounding like I am demanding something or that I feel entitled to it, because I don't feel that way) but I just don't see why we have to wait so long for number tweaks instead of having something more frequently, within 1-2 weeks or something. I can honestly say at this point, that I don't care about the content anymore if the only time balancing changes comes long is every "major patch", which is once a month or so, I rather have number and balance changes over content.

[Leonhardt]

What people see as balance in a video game.

Spoiler

How it really is.

Spoiler

"Be Content with what you have; rejoice in the way things are. When you realize there is nothing lacking, the whole world belongs to you."

Edited by Leonhardt, November 29 2013 - 10:16 PM.

[KejiGoto]

ShadowWarg, on November 29 2013 - 10:11 PM, said:

KejiGoto, on November 29 2013 - 09:28 PM, said:

It's pretty obvious this patch was more focused on content over balancing issues (unfortunately) but I think those complaining need to take a step back and remember this patch was sent up to the Seattle QA team before last week. We're also getting a fair amount of stuff with this patch including the Operation Frostburn 2.0 and a new map.

Of course the new content is cool, and I love it. But for the past 2/3 patches, which has been the past 2/3 months, there hasn't been any real balancing going on. And what was "balanced" was normally things that not many if anyone asked for, took noticed to, or thought was completely fine. I love the game and ADH and I understand that its a small team, (also I HATE sounding like I am demanding something or that I feel entitled to it, because I don't feel that way) but I just don't see why we have to wait so long for number tweaks instead of having something more frequently, within 1-2 weeks or something. I can honestly say at this point, that I don't care about the content anymore if the only time balancing changes comes long is every "major patch", which is once a month or so, I rather have number and balance changes over content.

KejiGoto, on November 29 2013 - 09:28 PM, said:

With that said balancing does need to be a bigger focus moving forward.

[[HWK]ZamboniChaos]

We definitely understand the concerns regarding the overall balance of the game. This patch is primarily focused on content, and balance will be the focus of future patches.

For instance, we already have changes planned for the Failsafe and Hellfires, they just didn't quite make it into this patch.