79 replies to this topic

[DeeRax]

 

 i deserve to be mocked/punished for it.

 

 

???
 

 

 

Dang.

[LaurenEmily]

???
 

 

 

Dang.

Wait what 

[DeeRax]

A) Punishment for just being a noob and making goofy suggestions in the past? Punished? Really? Harsh. Gods forbid we relentlessly punish/mock every new player who drops by the forums and doesn't know what they're doing or talking about. "LOLSTFUGTFO!" (Especially since I am still in this category, the feels)


...and/or...


B)

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

???

Edited by (TDM) DeeRax, 10 July 2015 - 12:12 PM.

[DeeRax]

(And that's my one creepy internet in-poor-taste joke quota for the year, sincere apologies)

Edited by (TDM) DeeRax, 10 July 2015 - 11:22 AM.

[Sp3ctrr]

-snip-

 

Yadda yadda- the game is where it is. We're not likely to get the old system back.  We'll get updates when we're given them. Just be grateful reloaded came along and kept this ship afloat.

[hoghead]

Got my boost on!  Opp's wrong thread. 

[ThatDamnedBoedy]

When I saw that DerMax had replied to this thread, I just knew, I knew that absolutely nothing productive would be said.

 

 

 

Now, what you're saying is a common conception - this is a problem. The fact that what you're saying is something of common perception for new players is a problem.

 

It is a big problem, because some of your more significant points are quite wrong when pressed to their extremes.  G2R and Turret modes could stand a (minor) buff, but I certainly wouldn't push it (and what you've suggested is drastic), and the T32 is probably the least useful weapon on the pred, but other than that, what you've stated, I'm afraid to say, is... well... laughable, and the cause of Der's attention seeking spam.

 

 

1. Hellfire missiles, ignoring their rate of fire, do less damage than the TOW, even if every one of the rockets hit - which is something of a rarity in itself.^Source 

Of course, you'd want something similar, being an auto aim weapon, but they have one of the single lowest DPS's in the game - and by a pretty long shot as well - and it's my understanding that this doesn't even account for the time it takes to lock on itself, making locked on hellfires likely the second least threatening weapon (and easily the least threatening secondary) in the game in terms of DPS and versatility, second only to the aggro mode of the helix repair torch, at a paltry 20 DPS - versus 55 for the standard TOW, and a maximum of 106.67 for the charged SAARE on the incinerator.

 

It is widely agreed on by the competitive community that apart from the G2 Assault, the least competitive mechs in the game are the Bruiser and the Rocketeer - due strictly to the hellfire missiles. The issue at hand is actually the auto aim feature. It's difficult to balance for in any game.

While they can be used situationally and effectively, you will be hard pressed to find an experienced player that agrees with you on the nerf aspect. The best you'll get is a compromise where one might nerf the targeting feature - by implementing a laser guided feature of some sort - and then upping the damage or RoF significantly. Given that hellfires supposedly operate on heat signatures - same as pred vision, it's not anywhere close to unfeasible that they would lock through cloak.

 

 

 

2. The scout, while clearly a favorite of many veterans, is also in the realm of "not so competitve in team fights" mechs. While you say it's only downside is it's health - in a game that's all about health, with hit boxes the size of small barns (literally) that's a massive downside. I'm having difficulty fully articulating the nature of how balanced-to-underpowered the scout actually is, and am hoping someone will be able to do so better.

 

The lack of health is extremely significant.

 

 

 

3. Turret mode! Yes. Here we have a thing. Vanguard is quite viable, but all else sort of falls short. All that really needs to be done to bring other turret modes in line is to increase forward damage resistance a bit. It's a very boring solution, but turrets are about positioning - and turret mode should be no different. Adding a "whoops I fuzzy bunnyed up" button isn't really the way to go about it.

 

 

 

4. Grenadier. I don't think you understand how significant a nerf 90 points of health actually is. This is a game where people complain the berserker, with it's 355 points of health, has too much compared to the infiltrator, at 330 - and they've got the moves to make the best of it. The gren is a good mech. no getting around that - but even at the very highest levels of play, it's projectiles are predictable and avoidable and even at the best of the best, it requires significant timing, precision, and map knowledge to use effectively. The vulcan gren may be able to stand a nerf - but even then only for the ability. It can still be easily outplayed by someone of comparable skill in most other mechs.

 

 

5. Pred T32 - not going to get much argument. It's an underwhelming "ambush" weapon with comparable (though worse in terms of burst) stats to the breacher without the versatility.

 

 

 

6. The single consensus on the G2 Raider in terms of buffing it is that you shouldn't show up on radar when walking with the ability. That's it. It can be devastating in the right hands. I've never gotten to the point where it's more effective than some of my other mechs, but it can be an absolute terror. It could probably stand some tweaks, but they're few, minor, and far between - no factors of three anywhere.

 

 

7. Brawler is one of the most OP mechs in the game. It has the fat to take on anything, and the damage of a scout. You need to be very careful with your heat management, but this thing hits like a howitzer fired at a baby. It could stand a nerf, if anything. Not a lot to say here. Every mech turns at the same speed, every mech aims just as well as the next. Having more than twice the health of the only other mech with comparable weapons - a mech that you declare needs a nerf - is no joke.

 

 

 

 

 

All of this said, these are real perceptions of the game, and they do need to be addressed somehow. I just don't know how.

 

You do have my apologies for any ramblings or grammatical/syntactical errors. I like to get drunk on Wednesdays to alleviate the nonsense that typically accompanies them.

 

1) Its funny you think I'm a new player since I've been at this for the better part of 2-3 years.  The scout plays far too well to the core mechanics.  It is overpowered in all the senses I have described regardless of your opinion.

 

2) The scout is small and fast and dodges fast.  It also has ridiculous firepower and can out dodge any turn rate.  It isn't about the veterans knowing how to make the most out of it.  When I use it myself my scores get higher than with almost any other mech.  It plays peekaboo the best on top of all that.  It doesn't have a barn sized hitbox...rather the smallest hit box of all mechs.  Armor isn't the balancing factor.  If you had all the other mechs with the same dodge cooldowns, speed and hitbox size as the scout you'd see what I mean.   I don't mind flavor but the scout giving up *some* armor for being the most powerful and tactically flexible mech in game is a bit much.  It would be acceptable if you just removed the TOW and forced it into either kiting or brawl range.  Right now it is basically a better version of the brawler.

 

3) allowing a 180 spin isn't a "fuzzybunny" button...it is simple adaptation to an issue that is encountered mainly in public games.  Private servers for competitive play have fewer issues with team communication and composition issues.  The game should be balanced around public play.  Hell I want friendly fire to be on by default but I'll bet that will never happen.

 

4) Actually I do understand - hence my desire for an HP reduction - I don't speak these points from ignorance I have every single mech at rank 6 and I have used them all extensively on every map.

 

5) T32 is a basic charged gun.  Yeah some people use it well but overall it is underwhelming...especially on the predator imo.  I like it ok on the raider and the XT version needs a boost of some kind.  

 

6) Who gives a fudge about consensus.  People had a consensus that the earth was the center of the universe and we all know how wrong that is.  Words like consensus and common sense are bullying phrases.  Try to stay away from them.  It makes arguments weaker not stronger.  The G2 Raider is fun on wreckage for me becuase I can lurk in narrow passages and spring a trap.  Perhaps it is that there are so few maps that cater towards its play style.  On facility you're almost limited to the inside of the facility rather than the outskirts otherwise your lack of range hurts enough to make it useless outside of super close ranges.

 

7) Brawler is a joke - too slow, nuf said.  The game is based on speed and its slowness hinders it more than anything else.

[ticklemyiguana]

1) Its funny you think I'm a new player since I've been at this for the better part of 2-3 years. The scout plays far too well to the core mechanics. It is overpowered in all the senses I have described regardless of your opinion.

2) The scout is small and fast and dodges fast. It also has ridiculous firepower and can out dodge any turn rate. It isn't about the veterans knowing how to make the most out of it. When I use it myself my scores get higher than with almost any other mech. It plays peekaboo the best on top of all that. It doesn't have a barn sized hitbox...rather the smallest hit box of all mechs. Armor isn't the balancing factor. If you had all the other mechs with the same dodge cooldowns, speed and hitbox size as the scout you'd see what I mean. I don't mind flavor but the scout giving up *some* armor for being the most powerful and tactically flexible mech in game is a bit much. It would be acceptable if you just removed the TOW and forced it into either kiting or brawl range. Right now it is basically a better version of the brawler.

3) allowing a 180 spin isn't a "fuzzybunny" button...it is simple adaptation to an issue that is encountered mainly in public games. Private servers for competitive play have fewer issues with team communication and composition issues. The game should be balanced around public play. Hell I want friendly fire to be on by default but I'll bet that will never happen.

4) Actually I do understand - hence my desire for an HP reduction - I don't speak these points from ignorance I have every single mech at rank 6 and I have used them all extensively on every map.

5) T32 is a basic charged gun. Yeah some people use it well but overall it is underwhelming...especially on the predator imo. I like it ok on the raider and the XT version needs a boost of some kind.

6) Who gives a fudge about consensus. People had a consensus that the earth was the center of the universe and we all know how wrong that is. Words like consensus and common sense are bullying phrases. Try to stay away from them. It makes arguments weaker not stronger. The G2 Raider is fun on wreckage for me becuase I can lurk in narrow passages and spring a trap. Perhaps it is that there are so few maps that cater towards its play style. On facility you're almost limited to the inside of the facility rather than the outskirts otherwise your lack of range hurts enough to make it useless outside of super close ranges.

7) Brawler is a joke - too slow, nuf said. The game is based on speed and its slowness hinders it more than anything else.

I see you haven't read the rest of your own thread then. The point remains, these are common perceptions of new players.

Little to none of what I stated is an "opinion". In team based games past the 2200 or so mark, the scout is often one of the lowest scoring mechs. That's not an opinion. In the same games, brawler is frequently the highest scoring and most deadly. That is also not an opinion. Turret mode is meant to be a calculated decision - that's an opinion. Giving all of them a 180 spin is giving players the ability to rather easily recover from a mistake in their positioning and decision making. That part is not an opinion.

I'll rephrase on the G2R part. The consensus among people who play it extensively and have deep knowledge of the game - ie: people who know what they're talking about.

My opinion is that despite the time you've spent playing, you actually do not understand most of the concepts you're bringing up.

Your opinion that the game should be balanced for public games is ludicrous. Balance is balance, and adjusting it to cater to your specific viewpoint - if this post is what that is, will seriously damage whatever integrity the game currently has. It will make weak mechs weaker, and strong mechs stronger, and people like myself - the godless, satan worshipping 2500 pub stompers will literally never die.

At the end of the day, that's the best we're going to get.

Edited by ticklemyiguana, 10 July 2015 - 03:07 PM.

[EM1O]

Still sore from that G2 raider smackdown i laid on you Boedy? When can i convince you it's pure power?

 

Damm but I enjoy driving G2R and anything GoodStuffs about it.

Not a Thread Buster here, but hey Boedy, please include a massive buff of the G2Raider (not just speed, i mean).

Unfortunately Flifang prolly ruined any hope of that...

Edited by em1o, 10 July 2015 - 03:19 PM.

[EM1O]

Not a valid point in any kind of a civilized balance discussion.. (biased opinion)

I think the intent was to state that no opinion was forthcoming as there was insufficient experience driving the Brawler to give either a pro or con statement. A very valid disclaimer in any discussion.

[Amidatelion]

1) Its funny you think I'm a new player since I've been at this for the better part of 2-3 years.  The scout plays far too well to the core mechanics.  It is overpowered in all the senses I have described regardless of your opinion.

 

7) Brawler is a joke - too slow, nuf said.  The game is based on speed and its slowness hinders it more than anything else.

 

You are wrong.

[EM1O]

You are wrong.

and any stream with Satrunine in it

 

*my Brawler hero*

Edited by em1o, 10 July 2015 - 08:28 PM.

[U235]

"THe basic values of most of the propelled ballistic weapons should be revisited. I have witnessed the effects of TOWS, Hell Fires, and HEAT projectiles. After watching what just one Hell Fire missile can do to a tank (crap, almost a whole city block, ) the representation of damage dealt by HAWKEN's volley of six Hell Fires is laughable, and a TOW doing more damage then a Hell Fire salvo is fsking ridiculous." em1o

 

"Ill give you that, and raise you the fact that Incin's shooting ability is obviously not only different, but in some cases more limited"  Panzermanathod

 

"It's impossible to make weapons function like their real-life counterparts unless you want ridiculously short TTK and boring gameplay." JeffMagnum

 

!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!All are great statements in my opinion vs. indifferences between predator, scout, and hellfires near every user indicates. Including every claim hellfires are noob weapons and pred/ scouts strictly for advance users. The Mechs are stacked as is gentlemen.

Edited by U235, 10 July 2015 - 09:34 PM.

[xRequiem]

2) The scout is small and fast and dodges fast. It also has ridiculous firepower and can out dodge any turn rate. It isn't about the veterans knowing how to make the most out of it. When I use it myself my scores get higher than with almost any other mech. It plays peekaboo the best on top of all that. It doesn't have a barn sized hitbox...rather the smallest hit box of all mechs. Armor isn't the balancing factor. If you had all the other mechs with the same dodge cooldowns, speed and hitbox size as the scout you'd see what I mean. I don't mind flavor but the scout giving up *some* armor for being the most powerful and tactically flexible mech in game is a bit much. It would be acceptable if you just removed the TOW and forced it into either kiting or brawl range. Right now it is basically a better version of the brawler.

Last I remember, hitboxes and dodge cooldowns are standardized per class type.

I.E. all C classes have the same hitbox size and a dodge cool down of 1.4 seconds.

All B's are the same hitbox with 1.2 seconds

All A's are the same hitbox with 1 second

You effectively proved, you didn't know what you were talking about when you said the scout was different.

Edited by xRequiem, 10 July 2015 - 09:29 PM.

[U235]

The gaming industry taste of salty renaissance bath water! Continue to free our minds with advanced HAWKEN mech kombat!

Edited by U235, 10 July 2015 - 09:46 PM.

[L_evis]

Replace Scouts flak with t32bolt and miniflak with reflak. Remove Incinerator secondary weapon ability to switch to higher dps mode, leave only lower and reduce its heat consumption, replace ppa with miniflak. All other mechs are almost well balanced. Thx.

[Sp3ctrr]

 

replace ppa with miniflak

 

Oh dear, You haven't ever had a miniflak on an incinerator, have you?

 

 

The heat generation is too low for the SAARE to be effective, the incinerator is a support mech, miniflak wouldn't work with that role.

[Panzermanathod]

For some, Incinerator isn't a support mech solely for PPA. That said, I wouldn't mind the heat generation being removed from SAARE (although MMA getting a bit of a boost would be nice), but miniflak instead of PPA? Eh... no.

[I2DI]

You are a disgrace, OP. I'm ashamed of you.

[L_evis]

incinerator is a support mech

In ingame description - yes, but actually no. 

Edited by L_evis, 11 July 2015 - 07:52 AM.

[DerMax]

You are a disgrace, OP. I'm ashamed of you.

You're overreacting. If it's a sarcasm, it doesn't look like one.

[PsychedelicGrass]

We need to get back on topic here.

 

The zerker is in dire need of excessive buffs. No discussion needed. Make it happen. The ability should, on top of what it already does, remove all heat buildup and prevent further heat generation for the duration of the ability (which btw should be at least tripled). This is lore-friendly and stuff because, like, the dmg boost is from using the heat to make explosive bullets or whatever and stuff so it all evens out and is balanced(:

 

 

Edit: oh and the vulcan too. More dps pls.

Edited by PsychedelicGrass, 11 July 2015 - 08:08 AM.

[MomOw]

We need to get back on topic here.

 

OKAY

 

[talons1337]

If you're getting killed by hellfires, then I have but two words of advice:

 

git gud

[PsychedelicGrass]

If you're getting killed by hellfires, then I have but two words of advice:

 

git gud

What if you get killed by them because they're not at all intimidating and you entirely ignore them, assuming they won't do anything at all? 

 

 

 

i-is that the entire point of them being weak? To trick people like me into dying from them? D:

Edited by PsychedelicGrass, 11 July 2015 - 12:01 PM.

[Bazookagofer]

Someone needs a little punch.

How about two? He can get one from me too damn flying lil buzzards...

 

Guys OP has one valid point. Scout should be renamed. The name is rather misleading... (And by misleading I mean it is a 180 degree U turn that passes into another dimension where lizard/octupuses rule the earth with humans as slaves because a scout is supposed to scout not be a blitzing meteor that wiped out the dinosaurs went back into space and is planning to make another genocide on humans because the zionists ordered it too!)

 

I will go put my tin foil hat on.

Edited by Bazookagofer, 13 July 2015 - 05:00 AM.

[Panzermanathod]

In ingame description - yes, but actually no. 

What makes you think Incin isn't support? Don't say PPA, as that's just one weapon

[Bazookagofer]

What makes you think Incin isn't support? Don't say PPA, as that's just one weapon

The better question is what makes it a support mech? The sole reason the incinerator exists is to deal out damage... massive damage. The only true support mech we have is the Technician. You can argue Bruiser and Rocketeer are supports because hellfires are a pretty good suppression weapon but even then that is kind of stretching it. The only support thing going for the incinerator is the fact that it can suppress enemies... but almost every mech can do that to some degree. For some reason I can't find incinerator on the main websites mech guide. Weird because I remember something about incinerator taking heat from nearby allies and I don't know if that is the case anymore. Either way even if that passive ability is in place its main purpose is to fuel the incin's DPS.

Edited by Bazookagofer, 13 July 2015 - 05:22 AM.

[Panzermanathod]

The better question is what makes it a support mech? The sole reason the incinerator exists is to deal out damage... massive damage. 

 

***PPA is the only weapon Incin has that does real damage. BBY is fairly weak by comparison and doesn't produce much heat, and the M4MA is useful for its effect, as that one doesn't do much damage and isn't too good for an offensive Incin. There is also the SAARE but even that is a double edged sword.

 

Weird because I remember something about incinerator taking heat from nearby allies and I don't know if that is the case anymore. Either way even if that passive ability is in place its main purpose is to fuel the incin's DPS.

 

***So you don't think the very act of taking heat away from nearby allies is some sort of support ability? Plus, for PPA, it won't help its DPS much, since you'll have to shoot it less to fire SAARE more, and it won't help for M4MA because you can shoot it and SAARE fairly consistently, and extra heat won't improve it's DPS. It only significantly aids in the BBY's DPS. 

 

Incin works off the concept of Heat=Ammo. Yes, it can use Heat offensively, but it's still a support mech. Not as much as Tech, of course

[Bazookagofer]

 

The better question is what makes it a support mech? The sole reason the incinerator exists is to deal out damage... massive damage. 

 

***PPA is the only weapon Incin has that does real damage. BBY is fairly weak by comparison and doesn't produce much heat, and the M4MA is useful for its effect, as that one doesn't do much damage and isn't too good for an offensive Incin. There is also the SAARE but even that is a double edged sword.

 

Weird because I remember something about incinerator taking heat from nearby allies and I don't know if that is the case anymore. Either way even if that passive ability is in place its main purpose is to fuel the incin's DPS.

 

***So you don't think the very act of taking heat away from nearby allies is some sort of support ability? Plus, for PPA, it won't help its DPS much, since you'll have to shoot it less to fire SAARE more, and it won't help for M4MA because you can shoot it and SAARE fairly consistently, and extra heat won't improve it's DPS. It only significantly aids in the BBY's DPS. 

 

Incin works off the concept of Heat=Ammo. Yes, it can use Heat offensively, but it's still a support mech. Not as much as Tech, of course

 

So the only thing going for it being a support is the ability to take some heat away from allies and suppression (As I said before every mech has that to some degree)? That not a lot. It kind of like saying Zeus from Dota 2 is a support because he has a mini stun. Apart from that minor ability (Whose primary purpose is just to get more heat for the secondary) everything for the Incinerator is geared towards damage. Having one supportive-esque passive doesn't make the mech a support mech since everything else for it is geared towards one thing... damage. Even the speed of the incin and the armor of it makes it a tip of the spear assualt mech.

[L_evis]

What makes you think Incin isn't support? Don't say PPA, as that's just one weapon

Cuz i play it a lot, and done insane killstreaks, slay tons of enemies and made enemy teams impossible 2 play. 

Edited by L_evis, 13 July 2015 - 09:09 AM.

[Panzermanathod]

So the only thing going for it being a support is the ability to take some heat away from allies and suppression (As I said before every mech has that to some degree)? That not a lot

 

***I never said it was the only thing. I just said it was a thing. Because you keep ignoring the fact that it does have support functions by saying...

 

"everything for the Incinerator is geared towards damage."

 

Having one supportive-esque passive doesn't make the mech a support mech since everything else for it is geared towards one thing... damage.

 

***We're talking about Incin in general. Not PPA Incin. But if you want to go that far, Tech isn't a support mech because aside from the heal beam everything else it has is geared towards damage. You have a primary that lowers defense, a mid ranged alternate specifically given to it so ones can more easily "combat-tech", and the prestige... okay I honestly don't know about that. Never used it.

 

I've never said Incin is pure support, but saying that it's only geared towards damage (and I'm going to assume offensive capabilities overall) is just ignoring certain aspects of the mech. BBY isn't overly great at dealing damage, and it's heat generation makes SAARE useage  less viable coompared to other weapons. The PPA *is* more or less an offensive weapon. I'm not arguing there. M4MA is not a good weapon for direct offense, and its ability is meant to make up for it's low ROF/Damage/projectile speed/range.

 

Yes, Incin has speed and a meh fuel tank. Brawler has HP and some slight regen. Vanguard has high defenses. I've heard lot of people say Incin is good for attacking but generally speaking they are talking about PPA Incin.

 

 

[Bazookagofer]

 

So the only thing going for it being a support is the ability to take some heat away from allies and suppression (As I said before every mech has that to some degree)? That not a lot

 

***I never said it was the only thing. I just said it was a thing. Because you keep ignoring the fact that it does have support functions by saying...

 

"everything for the Incinerator is geared towards damage."

 

Please read posts carefully. I mentioned its only supportive ability and gave it credit for that. That one ability doesn't make it a support in any shape way or form.

 

Having one supportive-esque passive doesn't make the mech a support mech since everything else for it is geared towards one thing... damage.

 

***We're talking about Incin in general. Not PPA Incin. But if you want to go that far, Tech isn't a support mech because aside from the heal beam everything else it has is geared towards damage. You have a primary that lowers defense, a mid ranged alternate specifically given to it so ones can more easily "combat-tech", and the prestige... okay I honestly don't know about that. Never used it.

 

Lol no. The technician is a support mech in every shape,way, form possible. Its secondary, ability and even first weapon is meant to help out team mates. The other weapons were added to the Technician so it isn't completely helpless if caught alone or if the team needs that extra bit of DPS. Combat Tech is a thing but you will get better results with every other mech when it comes to combat because the Technicians primary role is to heal. Not fight. The Incinerator on the other hand has one passive ability that helps out a team. To make sure you can read this easily. APART FROM THAT it has nothing which makes it a support.

 

I've never said Incin is pure support, but saying that it's only geared towards damage (and I'm going to assume offensive capabilities overall) is just ignoring certain aspects of the mech. BBY isn't overly great at dealing damage, and it's heat generation makes SAARE useage  less viable coompared to other weapons. The PPA *is* more or less an offensive weapon. I'm not arguing there. M4MA is not a good weapon for direct offense, and its ability is meant to make up for it's low ROF/Damage/projectile speed/range.

 

So what is it? It can't be a support. Suppression is in every mech to some degree. That leaves only one option. It is an assualt mech. If it had a primary weapon that removed heat from a nearby ally and gave it to you then it would be able to be played as a support. If its special ability removed heat from allies and added it to enemies. That would be supportive. As of now it has one passive ability that is supportive. Doesn't make it a support under any circumstance because APART FROM THAT it just dishes out damage.

 

Yes, Incin has speed and a meh fuel tank. Brawler has HP and some slight regen. Vanguard has high defenses. I've heard lot of people say Incin is good for attacking but generally speaking they are talking about PPA Incin.

 

Yes it has that speed and armor for a reason. I will let you guess it though.

 

 

 

Edited by Bazookagofer, 14 July 2015 - 10:08 AM.

[Flifang]

An incinerator being attacked from two people not close enough together to be hit by splash is a dead man. The incinerator is effective because its ability is a built in incentive for a team to be near it and help it. If an incinerator goes in alone or gets caught where it shouldn't it's dead just like any other mech. Its support role is essentially filled just by being there as opposed to the technician which requires you to still do things. Right now the incinerator is just a fancy shiny assault mech. It could use serious tweaks but not a rework. This mech needs to function in a way where it's far more powerful with team synergy. Right now it functions just fine alone as long as it's not balls deep in the opposing team. With the current way the other support mech functions this is not okay.

[StubbornPuppet]

I remember when I worked at a Pizza Hut, back in the early 90's, we had a promotion that included a free Nerf bat.  Those were some great weeks!  We took to the habit of sneaking up and whacking each other with them... which would always devolve into an every-employee-for-themselves bludgeoning.  It wasn't long before we realized you could take the foam off of the hard plastic rod down the middle and it then became an even more painful game of cracking each other with those.  Ouch.

[Panzermanathod]

 

 

 

Please read posts carefully. I mentioned its only supportive ability and gave it credit for that. That one ability doesn't make it a support in any shape way or form.

 

***You gave it credit by saying "but it's just for DPS anyways", unless I've gotten you confused with someone else.

 

Lol no. The technician is a support mech in every shape,way, form possible. Its secondary, ability and even first weapon is meant to help out team mates. The other weapons were added to the Technician so it isn't completely helpless if caught alone or if the team needs that extra bit of DPS. Combat Tech is a thing but you will get better results with every other mech when it comes to combat because the Technicians primary role is to heal. Not fight. The Incinerator on the other hand has one passive ability that helps out a team. To make sure you can read this easily. APART FROM THAT it has nothing which makes it a support.

 

 

***No, I wasn't seriously saying Tech wasn't a support mech. I'm saying it can be compared to Incin. You mention its first weapon helping out teammates... what about M4MA? Both are weapons with a special effect. And in the Tech's case it's to allow others to do more damage, whereas in Incin's case it's to effect enemy firing.

 

The other weapons for Tech is to give it a bit more DPS to help others? I could say the same for PPA. Not saying this is the case, just that the argument could use more concise wording.

 

And, as I've said before, I know that Incin isn't pure support.

 

So what is it? It can't be a support. Suppression is in every mech to some degree. That leaves only one option. It is an assualt mech. If it had a primary weapon that removed heat from a nearby ally and gave it to you then it would be able to be played as a support. If its special ability removed heat from allies and added it to enemies. That would be supportive. As of now it has one passive ability that is supportive. Doesn't make it a support under any circumstance because APART FROM THAT it just dishes out damage.

 

***You keep mentioning suppression. I'm not. And you're ignoring the effect of M4MA, which isn't effective at dishing damage, it's to make enemies overheat a bit faster.

 

Also apart from the heal beam Tech just dishes out damage.

 

Yes it has that speed and armor for a reason. I will let you guess it though.

 

***Because mechs tend to have better specific stats? And while it has speed and armor, it also has more limited firing capability unless you're just shooting all the time.

 

Not saying the Incin is perfect as is but if  you're going to say Incin is absolutely not a support mech in part because it's faster (but a meh fuel tank) and has armor (although it is the only G1 C-class that *never* had a turret mode), then... I just find the reasoning kind of silly. I get it, it's just a bit silly.

 

 

[Bazookagofer]

 

 

 

 

Please read posts carefully. I mentioned its only supportive ability and gave it credit for that. That one ability doesn't make it a support in any shape way or form.

 

***You gave it credit by saying "but it's just for DPS anyways", unless I've gotten you confused with someone else.

 

Lol no. The technician is a support mech in every shape,way, form possible. Its secondary, ability and even first weapon is meant to help out team mates. The other weapons were added to the Technician so it isn't completely helpless if caught alone or if the team needs that extra bit of DPS. Combat Tech is a thing but you will get better results with every other mech when it comes to combat because the Technicians primary role is to heal. Not fight. The Incinerator on the other hand has one passive ability that helps out a team. To make sure you can read this easily. APART FROM THAT it has nothing which makes it a support.

 

 

***No, I wasn't seriously saying Tech wasn't a support mech. I'm saying it can be compared to Incin. You mention its first weapon helping out teammates... what about M4MA? Both are weapons with a special effect. And in the Tech's case it's to allow others to do more damage, whereas in Incin's case it's to effect enemy firing.

 

The other weapons for Tech is to give it a bit more DPS to help others? I could say the same for PPA. Not saying this is the case, just that the argument could use more concise wording.

 

And, as I've said before, I know that Incin isn't pure support.

 

So what is it? It can't be a support. Suppression is in every mech to some degree. That leaves only one option. It is an assualt mech. If it had a primary weapon that removed heat from a nearby ally and gave it to you then it would be able to be played as a support. If its special ability removed heat from allies and added it to enemies. That would be supportive. As of now it has one passive ability that is supportive. Doesn't make it a support under any circumstance because APART FROM THAT it just dishes out damage.

 

***You keep mentioning suppression. I'm not. And you're ignoring the effect of M4MA, which isn't effective at dishing damage, it's to make enemies overheat a bit faster.

 

Also apart from the heal beam Tech just dishes out damage.

 

Yes it has that speed and armor for a reason. I will let you guess it though.

 

***Because mechs tend to have better specific stats? And while it has speed and armor, it also has more limited firing capability unless you're just shooting all the time.

 

Not saying the Incin is perfect as is but if  you're going to say Incin is absolutely not a support mech in part because it's faster (but a meh fuel tank) and has armor (although it is the only G1 C-class that *never* had a turret mode), then... I just find the reasoning kind of silly. I get it, it's just a bit silly.

 

 

 

It doesn't have enough else going on for it to be anything else really. Like I understand what your saying and all but in the grand scheme of things it doesn't really just support as much as it assaults. 

[Panzermanathod]

I never said it was just support. I've mentioned several times it's not much of a support mech, not like the Tech is.

[talons1337]

edit: redacted

Edited by talons1337, 15 July 2015 - 10:52 AM.

[EM1O]

buff the MG and RL turrets. really big buffs, including HP. make them an Item to reckon with.