137 replies to this topic

[BurnsHot]

SS396, on September 21 2014 - 12:33 PM, said:

BurnsHot, on September 19 2014 - 08:36 PM, said:

I found more Info about the Technical Debt buried in the forums.  I added them to the OP.

Posted April 11, 2014, https://community.pl...post__p__495831,  [HWK]HUGHES said, "Rather than spend additional time on the feature itself, work to fix issues with the scaling of the platform was prioritized. You may recall us mentioning this in the past (the weeks prior to the Steam launch) where we needed to make sure the platform would be able to scale to the number of users desired and for those of you who have been with us for a while, the difference is indeed noticeable despite the roughness for a while that was a "necessary evil".

For a while after that, tool fixing and bug fixing was a priority for the platform team until work shifted to removing our dependency on AWS; transitioning to a completely new database. This is no small project but is a requirement for cost consideration, performance and for regions of the world where AWS is not an available solution. This work is in progress."


Posted April 22, 2014,/hawken/forums/mtr-era/topic/54728-development-update-4222014/#entry504660, [HWK]HUGHES said, "Our team has made great strides in our migration away from AWS dependencies and we now have a separate build of the game running in a completely isolated environment with a new database and that was no small task to accomplish. It's still a significant amount of work to migrate the live version of HAWKEN to a new database, but we plan on making that a smooth transition that won't negatively effect players. Hopefully in an upcoming Development Update we'll be able to announce the completion of this work and you will have never even known it took place."

AWS stands for Amazon Web Services.  It's Amazon Elastic Compute Cloud (Amazon EC2) mentioned above.

Or "AWS dependencies" could mean DynamoDB.  

Take a look here:  https://fauna.org/community/customers

My take from that page is that the migration happened well before steam, and was completed along time ago.

Didn't we start having Sync issues after the Steam release_

[Silverfire]

I had sync issues before Steam.

[LONEDEADWOLF]

Silverfire, on September 21 2014 - 02:21 PM, said:

I had sync issues before Steam.

True but i have them much much worse then before steam.. Now it's just way out of hand......Laggy games to the point it is just awful..... something is a foot...I just pray it's for the good of the game....Nothing worse then finding a diamond in a rut of a mountain and not know if it's going to be around much longer. With much respect to the Devs...I just wish one would make a clear statement..(We  Team Adhesive are finishing up on the system to come for a better Hawken. Please stop bothering us and play the damn game.) It would go a very long way to making me feel at ease.....Love you Dev's but i 'am scared.

Edited by LONEDEADWOLF, September 21 2014 - 06:10 PM.

[AsianJoyKiller]

BurnsHot, on September 21 2014 - 01:53 PM, said:

Didn't we start having Sync issues after the Steam release_

There's been bouts of sync issues, both before and after Steam.

But I think to answer your question, there has been what appears to be an increase of sync issues as of the past few months.

[Flifang]

Had a few times where I lag a little, then it seems to be back to normal but when I shoot people no shots are fired. I have people shooting at me though and doing me damage. I asked a friend and he confirmed I and he was perfectly synched up but back to this after about one minute it drops me with a message saying connection to the host was lost. There's also some major spikes that aren't on my end and either it ends and it randomly, I mean RANDOMLY teleports me somewhere in the map. Like around 3 corners and down or up three levels of elevation random. Or I die, in which case I can have the card displaying who killed me up to 3 minutes before the lag stops, or I get bugged into the garage, able to fully communicate with my team match specs frozen until the next map loads. Beginning to be a very frequent occurrence.

[BurnsHot]

SS396, on September 14 2014 - 10:41 AM, said:

I myself think its just a cover for whats really happening and don't feel its the right time to get into that, many of you would just call me crazy and full of conspiracy theories.

SS396, on September 14 2014 - 12:46 PM, said:

I can't, I wish that I could but I can't.  The information I have isn't very conclusive, it shows something is going on, but its not as discernible as seeing black from white.  I'm also pretty sure that the people on the forums aren't ready to see it, and it could cause even more doomsday threads.  Thats the biggest reason why I'm withholding the info that I have.

I will give you a hint on what I think and its only one single boss thats controlling things and forcing the others to remain quiet.  You've got the companies listed, you just haven't pointed the finger at the big fish yet.  I also don't know the exact reason for why, I've come to what I think could be a reason why, but again, I have no evidence on a reason.

SS396, on September 15 2014 - 12:06 PM, said:

I just want to add this.  The Dev's haven't tried to hide anything, the board of directors is whats hiding things.  The Devs are just doing what they are told.

So obviously its taking longer than they expected.  Like I said they don't like it that they can't tell us whats going on, but they have to do what they are told.

BurnsHot, on September 15 2014 - 12:00 PM, said:

Kind of like SS396 holding back some of his speculations.

Lol, what I'm holding on to is not a speculation.  Its concrete, the issue is the why, thats the part that isn't black and white.

SS396: Don't think I've forgotten what you've said throughout this post.  I just wanted it to simmer and give time for more news to surface.  It doesn't seem like anything new is going to be found.

So are you ready to reveal your Theory,  Probably should do it before they pull the plug.  As you know, US West has been down for what 24 hrs now and not one Peep from the Devs.

[StubbornPuppet]

Synchronization lag has been tearing me a new one ever since the update that moved parts of the game to client side.  I never had any issues before that update, but since then... I find myself unable to shoot, jump or do anything but move about - followed by a sudden random placement of my mech at whereever the game thinks I was headed when it lost track of me... about 5 or 6 times every other match.

Some days are better than others.  Some days I can't even play the game.  Other days it's down to a minimum and I might make it through a match or two with none of this synch-lag.

[SS396]

BurnsHot, on September 23 2014 - 11:48 AM, said:

SS396: Don't think I've forgotten what you've said throughout this post.  I just wanted it to simmer and give time for more news to surface.  It doesn't seem like anything new is going to be found.

So are you ready to reveal your Theory,  Probably should do it before they pull the plug.  As you know, US West has been down for what 24 hrs now and not one Peep from the Devs.

K, Well, let me explain some things that you have referenced.  

I agree, I don't think we are going to gather any more news ourselves.  There might be 1 unknown piece of the puzzle that is currently in a holding pattern, but the results of that I fear will be detrimental to the community and should remain unknown.  If any brand new news is going to surface its going to come in some form of an official announcement from a Dev or it could be a leak from a Dev, but nobody has leaked as of yet and I don't think they are going to start now.

You asked was I ready to reveal my theory, but I already have, you've quoted it in your post.  My theory is that one person is controlling things, the one that has invested the most money and the most to gain if Hawken is a success, and the most to lose if Hawken is a failure.  Thats completely different than the pieces of info I am holding back on.

I honestly don't have a clue whats going on, I don't think any of us know.  The longer it goes on, the more confused I get, the more disappointed I get.  Why servers in regions are disappearing and some new ones are being brought online in others, it certainly doesn't make sense to bring servers up if they have plans on abandoning the game.  

I actually have 2 seperate things I'm withholding currently.  The first one a few people know about that I've talked with in private, and one other person has found the same info digging around.  We have all agreed to keep it off of the forums.  The last piece of info I have, I have only told one other person (besides my family) that I'd trust with my life, and don't think either of them (the info that is) is in any way shape or form something positive or definitive.  I think it just causes more confusion and it would just be throwing a wrench into the gears and the community would be at each others throat arguing about what it means.  Pessimists against optimists.

So will it ever be a good time to share my news with everyone, no and I don't have any plans on doing it either, I fail to see what good it would do.  I may be seen as an angry warmonger around here on the forums, but I'm not going to be the one that reaches into my pocket and drops both little boy and fat man on the party and enjoy it as everyone reacts and fights with each other.

Edited by SS396, September 23 2014 - 02:56 PM.

[BurnsHot]

StubbornPuppet, on September 23 2014 - 12:02 PM, said:

Synchronization lag has been tearing me a new one ever since the update that moved parts of the game to client side.  I never had any issues before that update, but since then... I find myself unable to shoot, jump or do anything but move about - followed by a sudden random placement of my mech at whereever the game thinks I was headed when it lost track of me... about 5 or 6 times every other match.

Some days are better than others.  Some days I can't even play the game.  Other days it's down to a minimum and I might make it through a match or two with none of this synch-lag.

What are your computer specs_  I've read other threads where the Devs mentioned that they have increased the hardware requirements for the game.

Also if you are still having sync issues try renaming your MyDocuments/MyGames/Hawken folder to Hawken Back up and let the game create a new Hawken folder for you.  It might make a difference in sync times.

SS396, on September 23 2014 - 02:52 PM, said:

K, Well, let me explain some things that you have referenced.  

I agree, I don't think we are going to gather any more news ourselves.  There might be 1 unknown piece of the puzzle that is currently in a holding pattern, but the results of that I fear will be detrimental to the community and should remain unknown.  If any brand new news is going to surface its going to come in some form of an official announcement from a Dev or it could be a leak from a Dev, but nobody has leaked as of yet and I don't think they are going to start now.    

You asked was I ready to reveal my theory, but I already have, you've quoted it in your post.  My theory is that one person is controlling things, the one that has invested the most money and the most to gain if Hawken is a success, and the most to lose if Hawken is a failure.  Thats completely different than the pieces of info I am holding back on.

I honestly don't have a clue whats going on, I don't think any of us know.  The longer it goes on, the more confused I get, the more disappointed I get.  Why servers in regions are disappearing and some new ones are being brought online in others, it certainly doesn't make sense to bring servers up if they have plans on abandoning the game.  

I actually have 2 seperate things I'm withholding currently.  The first one a few people know about that I've talked with in private, and one other person has found the same info digging around.  We have all agreed to keep it off of the forums.  The last piece of info I have, I have only told one other person (besides my family) that I'd trust with my life, and don't think either of them (the info that is) is in any way shape or form something positive or definitive.  I think it just causes more confusion and it would just be throwing a wrench into the gears and the community would be at each others throat arguing about what it means.  Pessimists against optimists.

So will it ever be a good time to share my news with everyone, no and I don't have any plans on doing it either, I fail to see what good it would do.  I may be seen as an angry warmonger around here on the forums, but I'm not going to be the one that reaches into my pocket and drops both little boy and fat man on the party and enjoy it as everyone reacts and fights with each other.

Yes I understood your theory.  I was more trying to get those nuggets of info from you. I can respect your decision to withhold it and wont badger you about it.

We players are left in the dark and Most of us are Towing the Company Line trying to stay positive.  When they do come out of seclusion, I hope they acknowledge the loyal player base and give us damn good, detailed explanation for going silent.

[StubbornPuppet]

BurnsHot, on September 23 2014 - 06:01 PM, said:

StubbornPuppet, on September 23 2014 - 12:02 PM, said:

Synchronization lag has been tearing me a new one ever since the update that moved parts of the game to client side.  I never had any issues before that update, but since then... I find myself unable to shoot, jump or do anything but move about - followed by a sudden random placement of my mech at whereever the game thinks I was headed when it lost track of me... about 5 or 6 times every other match.

Some days are better than others.  Some days I can't even play the game.  Other days it's down to a minimum and I might make it through a match or two with none of this synch-lag.

What are your computer specs_  I've read other threads where the Devs mentioned that they have increased the hardware requirements for the game.

Also if you are still having sync issues try renaming your MyDocuments/MyGames/Hawken folder to Hawken Back up and let the game create a new Hawken folder for you.  It might make a difference in sync times.

It's most assuredly not my machine specs.  Quad core i7, 4GB video card, 32GB RAM...  and it's running on an SSD.  I tried the folders fix about 3 months ago... it didn't help, unfortunately.  Thanks for trying though.  What would have been great is if they still had tech support at Meteor/Adhesive - they were really interactive and helpful back in the day.

[Zycon]

BurnsHot, on September 23 2014 - 06:01 PM, said:

We players are left in the dark and Most of us are Towing the Company Line trying to stay positive.  When they do come out of seclusion, I hope they acknowledge the loyal player base and give us damn good, detailed explanation for going silent.

And lots of credits or a bunch of new maps and Aus servers.

[ShadowWarg]

Zycon, on September 24 2014 - 03:46 PM, said:

BurnsHot, on September 23 2014 - 06:01 PM, said:

We players are left in the dark and Most of us are Towing the Company Line trying to stay positive.  When they do come out of seclusion, I hope they acknowledge the loyal player base and give us damn good, detailed explanation for going silent.

And lots of credits or a bunch of new maps and Aus servers.

I'm all for a exclusive limited time offer mech chassis on top of that.

[Odinous]

Well,i know its not about the "technical debt" but,check this out

https://community.pl...is-it-possible/

Mabe the future is much brighter than we think_!_

Edited by Odinous, September 25 2014 - 05:47 AM.

[BurnsHot]

Odinous, on September 25 2014 - 05:47 AM, said:

Well,i know its not about the "technical debt" but,check this out

https://community.pl...is-it-possible/

Mabe the future is much brighter than we think_!_

This article is not that different from my Firefall scenario where the Dev's went into a period of silence then months later come out to announce a major change in the game.

I do believe something big is coming and like [HWK]Defter eluded to "Its worth the wait".

[Spliff_Craven]

The technical debt is technically paid... So why can't they tell us anything or even update the test drives_

The test drives shouldn't be stagnated due to technical debt.
So I cry BLSHT on TechDebt.

[Godmoney]

Thanks for the original post OP. I'm a new player and I've seen this term thrown around "technical debt" Your thread helped clear that up for me. Very kind of you to do that. TY

[PepeKenobi]

Test drives would be something much appreciated here, yep.

Speaking of that, do test drives accumulate XP for when you purchase any so you get the earnings effectively back to your brand new purchased mechas_

ps. bugfixes, exploits, immersion factor ((cockpit)) .. and one more map or two.... That would be the tech debt I find here at my end. Other thingies like more customizations and so forth would be cool as well....

[BurnsHot]

For those who are still interested, here is a video explaining in more detail the "Rabbit Whole" that was created to serve up and publish Hawken to the masses.

Seems like their entire effort to build the backend of the Publishing using Amazon AWS either fell apart (too many unforeseen problems) or they were beat to market by the likes of NVIDIA's GRID(NVIDIA's cloud gaming platform) and Meteor just gave up on the idea of becoming their own powerhouse publishing company.  This is all in conjunction with the low player retention and monetization.

I now believe that the $28 million or so dollars are all used up to get them to where we are now and they are currently seeking another round of Investment Funding to continue the maintenance and "Service" aspect of the game.

Edited by BurnsHot, October 22 2014 - 11:56 AM.

[Sylhiri]

"Cart before the horse"

[alpha78]

BurnsHot, on October 22 2014 - 11:53 AM, said:

For those who are still interested, here is a video explaining in more detail the "Rabbit Whole" that was created to serve up and publish Hawken to the masses.

Seems like their entire effort to build the backend of the Publishing using Amazon AWS either fell apart (too many unforeseen problems) or they were beat to market by the likes of NVIDIA's GRID(NVIDIA's cloud gaming platform) and Meteor just gave up on the idea of becoming their own powerhouse publishing company.  This is all in conjunction with the low player retention and monetization.

I now believe that the $28 million or so dollars are all used up to get them to where we are now and they are currently seeking another round of Investment Funding to continue the maintenance and "Service" aspect of the game.

So basically, they built skynet in order to support AWS and in doing so sacrificed the game development, community development and marketing efforts.  I'm curious what portion of their expenditures this network architecture experiment cost relative to actual game development/marketing/PR.  

It would be a shame if such a great game concept/design was lost due to an overzealous network architecture project.

Now I understand the "technical debt".  Thx for posting this.