42 replies to this topic

[JeffMagnum]

I'm referring to this series



If the Hawken equivalent was promoted on the official Hawken FB and Youtube channel, it'd be an easy way to show new and prospective players what the game has to offer at higher skill levels when it comes to weapon mastery, strategy, and prediction without being overwhelming and unfocused like, for example, a TPG match between the two best teams in the league.

The main issue would be determining who would commentate and chosing the people who would judge the submissions. The commentator needs to be entertaining while also having a thorough enough knowledge of the game to describe what's going on in the video, and everyone deciding would need a significant amount of gameplay experience and skill to acurately determine whether something actually is impressive or just seems impressive to a new player (e.g. a simple quadrakill or pentakill).

If I had to make the decision, it'd be Nept (probably too busy now tho what a nerd) for commentator and the 10 highest MMR players who are regularly active on the forums for the judges. It's elitist, yes, but what else would be as streamlined and work as well as that selection process? There are lots of lower-MMR players who would be just as good, but picking them out individually based on...what? would be way too time-consuming. Also, since I'm sure there would be a lot of personal submissions from the judges, it'd probably be fair to keep people from selecting their own videos as one in their top 5.

I think the easiest way to facilitate judging would be creating a new forum or subforum along the lines of "Community Montage Entries" where everyone can make a thread with their submission. I don't see why there would need to be a "one submission per person" rule, though a cap at taking 2/5 of the places seems fair.

And compared to some of the other things^{markee fest} that have been going on to promote Hawken lately, this would actually involve the community that cares and show off talented members within it.

Oh, and MC prizes would bring up the incentive to submit entries greatly. I like the first three getting incrementally less as opposed to only one person getting anything, though a unique sticker for 1st in addition to the MC would be nice.

Edited by JeffMagnum, 08 August 2015 - 07:30 AM.

[Nept]

ELITIST SCUM.

[CounterlogicMan]

I have been kicking around this sort of idea. Getting footage from important parts and different perspectives through out a TPG match from both sides. Then commentating/analyzing what is happening. Would inform players about the play that is happening, the meta the teams are using, and give exposure to the league/players/teams. 

 

I already do some self commentary/TPG matches on my stream: www.twitch.tv/evaius 

 

I am also the team captain of Axe-Attack, one of the most competitive TPG teams. I have played over 1.5k hours the raider patch and reckon I am qualified as far as knowledge of the game, players, and teams. Would love to help/commentate if I can!

[Nept]

You can have my hypothetical spot! 

 

In all seriousness, it's a good idea - one which would involve the community and which could potentially help retention rates.  Zaccubus also creates UT tutorial videos that are given center stage within the game launcher.  Similar things could certainly be done for Hawken, and might go a long way toward addressing the less-than-stellar tutorials we have atm.

 

Also, not to derail the thread, but I don't think my questions deserve a topic of their own.  Does anyone watch MarkeeDragon?  Does he even play Hawken?  I sifted through his previous broadcasts page and noticed that his last Hawken-heavy stream was in mid June.  I even watched a good chunk of "MarkeeFest" today (like 2 hours worth on the second monitor) and noticed that it was almost entirely about Eve - much like his streams.

 

Jeff's initiative seems like the better option here.

Edited by Nept: Lord of the God-Kings, 07 August 2015 - 04:39 AM.

[JeffMagnum]

I have been kicking around this sort of idea. Getting footage from important parts and different perspectives through out a TPG match from both sides. Then commentating/analyzing what is happening. Would inform players about the play that is happening, the meta the teams are using, and give exposure to the league/players/teams. 

 

I already do some self commentary/TPG matches on my stream: www.twitch.tv/evaius 

 

I am also the team captain of Axe-Attack, one of the most competitive TPG teams. I have played over 1.5k hours the raider patch and reckon I am qualified as far as knowledge of the game, players, and teams. Would love to help/commentate if I can!

 

I honestly think that'd be better suited for another project altogether just because our goals seem to be so different. You're trying to give people who already are decent insight into how organized teams play, but I just want to let new players look at impressive plays and kills as entertainment and to see what the mechs and weapons they're using are actually capable of.

 

You can have my hypothetical spot!

 

no I want a repeat of the Origin camping commentary from that one 3v3

[Nept]

So much sandy.

[JeffMagnum]

Also, not to derail the thread, but I don't think my questions deserve a topic of its own.  Does anyone watch MarkeeDragon?  Does he even play Hawken?  I sifted through his previous broadcasts page and noticed that his last Hawken-heavy stream was in mid June.  I even watched a good chunk of "MarkeeFest" today (like 2 hours worth on the second monitor) and noticed that it was almost entirely about Eve - much like his streams.

 

The only experience I have with him is joining his server while he was playing and making him take a ragebreak for awhile after two matches. He's a spacebar Rocketeer god 

 

I didn't even intentionally ruin it though because I had no idea who he was and just thought he was some streamer who finally attracted enough people for me to play against

Edited by JeffMagnum, 06 August 2015 - 10:03 PM.

[Amidatelion]

Sure let me just forward you the entire list of people who signed up and never contributed to the HKTS initiative in the same vein so that you too can be disappointed by community members absolute disinterest in taking initiative in the promotion of the game!

[JeffMagnum]

Sure let me just forward you the entire list of people who signed up and never contributed to the HKTS initiative in the same vein so that you too can be disappointed by community members absolute disinterest in taking initiative in the promotion of the game!

What's the story here? And there would be weekly or biweekly MC incentives so that would probably help

[Elite_is_salty]

Elite = Best commentator.

[Badtings]

Great idea OP! Would love to watch something more than just gameplay!

[Rainbow_Sheep]

Make sure you check out the last frag on this one, the corner play is insane



A beautifully edited frag movie

V.I.E.R. - TF2 frag movie by DoB:

There are two problems I can see with this

1. Since HAWKEN currently has no replay/demo function built in people will have to record all their games if they want to have a chance to submit something (Unless they have an old clip saved)

2. The amount of clips submitted will be a problem to work around. Will this be a monthly thing or just whenever you have enough clips that you want to show off? How many clips will there be in a video?

Otherwise I would be happy to edit, sound mix and look through clips.

I've also wanted to make a community frag video for a very long time.

Edited by Rainbow Sheep, 06 August 2015 - 11:55 PM.

[CraftyDus]

TPG players used to submit to the Frag of The Week at the Nineteeneleven forums and one of the community's movie makers would compile several player's worth of them in a short movie.
TPG FOTW was always more interesting then pub montages of untagged randoms who didn't shoot back or even notice they were being killed.

[PoopSlinger]

Every clip should be of a raider goin ham,  its best fun to watch and most impressive.

[Hyginos]

TPG players used to submit to the Frag of The Week at the Nineteeneleven forums and one of the community's movie makers would compile several player's worth of them in a short movie.
TPG FOTW was always more interesting then pub montages of untagged randoms who didn't shoot back or even notice they were being killed.

 

Do we have those?

 

 

EDIT:

Sure let me just forward you the entire list of people who signed up and never contributed to the HKTS initiative in the same vein so that you too can be disappointed by community members absolute disinterest in taking initiative in the promotion of the game!

 

 

So did all that footage I put throught the drop box just vanish into the ether? I was bugging tickle like once a week that it was full.

 

 

Further EDIT:

I wonder if this markeedragon guy would be willing to commentate and edit footage if we dump it on him. 

Edited by Hyginos, 07 August 2015 - 05:20 AM.

[Silverfire]

I'd do commentary (although I'm probably not as qualified as others may appear) and/or edit if I had the time but alas I do not. I'll see if I can make time

Edited by Silverfire, 07 August 2015 - 04:42 AM.

[CraftyDus]

So for example we had a frag of the week forum section where the handful of movie makers would invite submissions for a given week/cup

 

http://nineteeneleve...wforum.php?f=27

 

And a section where the resulting montages could be posted

 

http://nineteeneleve...wforum.php?f=29

 

 

all under the sub section movies

 

But then that was a forum community wholly owned and operated by the TPG players, so it had mad content and outsurvived the dev participation in their own game by many many years.

Edited by Drafty Krust, 07 August 2015 - 05:05 AM.

[JeffMagnum]

Would it be possible to have the ordered list of top plays of the week sent to Reloaded to be edited into a coherent video with their (hopefully unobtrusive) branding, SFX, and transitions of choice or whatever added in? I was thinking getting the devs more involved with the actual consistent playerbase might be beneficial for everyone.

But obviously I'm not opposed to something done entirely by the community either if Reloaded can't or doesn't want to spend time on that, and I'm sure there are competent video makers here. The montages would still need to be posted on the Hawken Facebook/Youtube with maybe even an in-game link to get any exposure though.

Would it be better to have one person consistently commentate like with the UT montages or have a different person here do it every week?

Edited by JeffMagnum, 07 August 2015 - 08:24 AM.

[Silverfire]

Devs have been "open" to post community stuff at least if you stick a link in a support ticket and you ask nicely. I've had no issues getting a weekly War Wednesday post on Facebook and Twitter when I asked.

But it's the community that would do the heavy lifting, like gathering and editing such clips together. The devs have enough on their plate, and there's not enough of them anyway. I don't think they'd be opposed to us putting a few logos in there or something, but this can probably be cleared in a support ticket. It's literally free advertising for them anyhow.

In terms of commentating, maybe not one person all the time as we have real life stuff too and may not have the time evry now and then, but it probably should be a regular rotation of competent people commentating. It shouldn't be totally different every time because breeding familiarity with such videos is good to have especially in a voice to give the audience an idea of who and what they'll hear every time they launch a video like this.

As for submissions, some sort of weekly thread would be needed, and maybe even some sort of external nonforum location could be set up for nonforum goers, open up the playing field and not restrict it to the forum goers, which is a small and elite group of the community.

Edited by Silverfire, 07 August 2015 - 08:40 AM.

[Rainbow_Sheep]

Another good example

[JeffMagnum]

1. Since HAWKEN currently has no replay/demo function built in people will have to record all their games if they want to have a chance to submit something (Unless they have an old clip saved)

2. The amount of clips submitted will be a problem to work around. Will this be a monthly thing or just whenever you have enough clips that you want to show off? How many clips will there be in a video?

 

Since TPG requires games to be recorded anyway, there should be a good bit of material to work with from there. But yeah, that would be annoying. I'd probably record whenever I got into a high-MMR match that appeared out of nowhere or in SSSDM, but I doubt I'd run OBS constantly mostly just because I want to listen to music and would rather have plain clips. 

 

The frequency would really depend on how many clips are reguarly submitted. 

Edited by JeffMagnum, 08 August 2015 - 07:33 AM.

[JeffMagnum]

Devs have been "open" to post community stuff at least if you stick a link in a support ticket and you ask nicely. I've had no issues getting a weekly War Wednesday post on Facebook and Twitter when I asked.

But it's the community that would do the heavy lifting, like gathering and editing such clips together. The devs have enough on their plate, and there's not enough of them anyway. I don't think they'd be opposed to us putting a few logos in there or something, but this can probably be cleared in a support ticket. It's literally free advertising for them anyhow.

In terms of commentating, maybe not one person all the time as we have real life stuff too and may not have the time evry now and then, but it probably should be a regular rotation of competent people commentating. It shouldn't be totally different every time because breeding familiarity with such videos is good to have especially in a voice to give the audience an idea of who and what they'll hear every time they launch a video like this.

As for submissions, some sort of weekly thread would be needed, and maybe even some sort of external nonforum location could be set up for nonforum goers, open up the playing field and not restrict it to the forum goers, which is a small and elite group of the community.

 

I have no problem with the community doing the gathering part, but I didn't know if devs would want more control over the editing process if they'd be promoting it on FB/Twitter/Youtube often. 

 

I mean, it really wouldn't take much time at all for one person to do once the video was edited together since it's just a couple minutes total of gameplay that needs to be commentated on, but I get that. I was also wondering about just having three or so people who can volunteer to do it.

 

If possible, what about a subforum here where all the clips are posted as topics? That'd keep the people judging from having to dig through one long thread to find videos buried among other comments while still allowing feedback on individual submissions, and if the series was made biweekly or monthly, that solution would be even more useful. How many people from outside the forums do you think would actually submit clips though, and where would they find out about doing so? Maybe there could be something on the Hawken subreddit but anything else seems like it'd mostly be wasting time. 

Edited by JeffMagnum, 07 August 2015 - 09:49 AM.

[CounterlogicMan]

Regardless I would still love to help if you would have me Jeff.

 

[JeffMagnum]

At the very least I'm sure you'd be able to post some nice clips. I think it's also worth mentioning that this isn't my project, because I don't intend on doing anything other than judging and looking at submissions after everything gets going. Maybe initially I'll help set things up, but this will be a community thing and I'd rather decisions like who does what be made by voting or at least discussion. It would be possible to include more people to judge if the rest of the players already doing so were good with it, but there would need to be a limit so that decisions can be made fairly quickly while still having enough to get a varied range of opinions. 

Edited by JeffMagnum, 07 August 2015 - 10:07 AM.

[Hyginos]

If possible, what about a subforum here where all the clips are posted as topics? That'd keep the people judging from having to dig through one long thread to find videos buried among other comments while still allowing feedback on individual submissions, and if the series was made biweekly or monthly, that solution would be even more useful. How many people from outside the forums do you think would actually submit clips though, and where would they find out about doing so? Maybe there could be something on the Hawken subreddit but anything else seems like it'd mostly be wasting time. 

 

If you could maybe get one of those banner popups in the client that included a submission link that might work.

 

I'm thinking a thread for each period where submissions for that week/biweek/month go, linked in the client itself with those notices about double HC weekends and whatnot. "Submit your best plays for week of Fleemvember the 78th!" or something.

 

Even better, offer a forum badge and/or a trivial amount of HC or MC for getting a clip selected. You'd get lots of submissions.

[Nept]

If anyone's actually planning on running with this idea, I'd suggest limiting the judges to 3-5.  Gets to be a pain coordinating people.

[JeffMagnum]

Yeah, thinking about it, 10 is way too many. The thread is just an idea that came to me last night that I posted without thinking about the process much, but if it's actually going to happen then there needs to be a few revisions. 

 

 

Even better, offer a forum badge and/or a trivial amount of HC or MC for getting a clip selected. You'd get lots of submissions.

 

Maybe all the people selected could get a small amount of MC and the winner could get more plus a forum badge? 

[CounterlogicMan]

5 judges.

 

One email that gathers the videos. Community submits links whether twitch/youtube/download to the email.

 

Videos go onto a google drive doc/folder for each week.

 

Judges judge.

 

An editor, or two, gets the videos that win and works with the commentator to make the video.

 

That is how I would envision something like this working. In terms of the process.

[JeffMagnum]

So here's what I'm thinking now:

• monthly video instead of weekly
• five judges
• cutoff date is a week before the month is over to give people time to make decisions and edit a video together without rushing
• judging is done in a Steam group (the videos could also be linked to there to make it easier to view them all)
• commentator(s) and editor(s) will be decided by judges
• hopefully MC prizes or badges or something for the winners

[CraftyDus]

Because nobody should be wanting to watch sad montages of 1k's in pubs against people not even facing person when they die, JeffMagnum should join TANG's TPG team ASAP

[Rainbow_Sheep]

I was considering making a thread about this, but I heard unreal engine has a replay feature built in. Can anyone confirm this?

so we can all yell at the devs about it

Edited by Rainbow Sheep, 07 August 2015 - 11:20 AM.

[crockrocket]

I would watch this.

[Sylhiri]

Do we have those?

 

We'd have more if there was a spectator mode or the people who can get into the broken as **** version wasn't hoarding the knowledge.

 

/anger

Edited by Sylhiri, 07 August 2015 - 02:31 PM.

[_incitatus]

Because nobody should be wanting to watch sad montages of 1k's in pubs against people not even facing person when they die, JeffMagnum should join TANG's TPG team ASAP

No. He should come play with THC where he belongs. And coincidentally, where you belong as well.

Edited by (thc)_incitatus, 07 August 2015 - 03:24 PM.

[Hyginos]

We'd have more if there was a spectator mode or the people who can get into the broken as **** version wasn't hoarding the knowledge.

 

/anger

 

How to get spectator: submit a ticket asking nicely and with a reason.

 

Knowledge un-hoarded.

[IareDave]

This is a great idea. Now I just gotta fix this shitball buggy program called ShadowPlay. (fuzzy bunny obs)

[Amidatelion]

 

So did all that footage I put throught the drop box just vanish into the ether? I was bugging tickle like once a week that it was full.

 

 

Just checked.

 

Every folder is empty.

[Hyginos]

If anyone's actually planning on running with this idea, I'd suggest limiting the judges to 3-5.  Gets to be a pain coordinating people.

 

If you get 10 judges and wait a few weeks, you'll have 3-5 judges.

[JeffMagnum]

No. He should come play with THC where he belongs. And coincidentally, where you belong as well.

 

Because nobody should be wanting to watch sad montages of 1k's in pubs against people not even facing person when they die, JeffMagnum should join TANG's TPG team ASAP

 

too bad I'm just gonna make my own team and beat all the tpg nerds

Edited by JeffMagnum, 08 August 2015 - 04:09 AM.

[Amidatelion]

 

 

 

too bad I'm just gonna make my own team with hookers and blackjack and beat all the tpg nerds