28 replies to this topic

[Anichkov3]

Greetings comrades!

 

????????????? ????????? ???? ?????????? ????? ???????????? ? ???????????? ?????????? ????: http://www.hawken.ru...8&start=50#9340

 

 

Changing the Special Ability for Rocketeer.
Suggest replacing the turret mode at Rocketeer on Shoulderguards rocket launchers.
- Each setting shooting six missiles and that together - 12 missiles.
- One missile deals 10 damage.
- Missiles fly straight without autoguider.
- Rocket launchers firing at a vast area and, therefore, one can not get the fur over 6 direct hits missiles.
- When using abilities Rocketeer heated by 15 points (almost as if shot from Hellfire).
- Recharge time: 20 seconds.

 

Another variant of the special abilities for Rocketeer "reactive armor". Since he specializes in missile weapons, the most logical option for the development of his abilities would be "reactive armor" similar dynamic armor mounted on tanks.
Thus the essence is simple:
- This ability gives partial protection against missile weapons, grenades and mines (specific weapons listed in the picture: green - full protection, yellow - the damage will be partially applied Splash, red - ability will not affect the rest of the weapons).
- Radius which will be undermined by enemy missiles - 14 m (this radius and is due to the fact of the damage from the splash).
- Duration abilities - 7 seconds (to Rocketeer had 2/3 fired Hellfire). (it may be worth reduced to 5 seconds?)
- Recharge time 20 seconds.
- If the enemy is within close proximity (in the inner circle radius 14 m), the Rockets of the enemy (of green and yellow list of weapons) will be undermined once the shot (as if he shoots at the wall) and the splash will be injured and the enemy and Rocketeer.

 

 

 

Another variant of the special abilities for Rocketeer "Air blitz".
Why is the ability to be his? Because Rocketeer perhaps the only Mech in the game not having instant-hit weapon (hitskan).

 

P.S. I would like to add a vote in the topic, but did not find how to do it. On the old forum was an opportunity. 

Edited by Anichkov3, 23 March 2015 - 12:22 AM.

[Elite_is_salty]

Not OP at all ...

[Anichkov3]

Hmm, maybe incinerator ability is too OP?

Maybe then and speed in the air at the berserk too OP?

Remember that Rocketeer almost the lowest DPS. 

[opicr0n]

That is a very nice idea Anichkov!

 

Honestly, does anybody _ever_ see a rocketeer in turret mode? I sure do not!

 

It means that the rocketeer turret mode is broken and could need and different ability.

[Anichkov3]

Rocketeers targeting turret sucks

[LarryLaffer]

Long range missiles seem to be ok. Ofc the testing on actual battlefield is required.

[TheVulong]

Can't say much about this exact suggestion but Rocketeers ability sure needs a change.

[WWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWWW]

I love your first idea!! This would really bring a different look and feel to the Rocketeer that would really let it live up to its name.

[MomOw]

I like the idea of a rocketeer with shoulder mounted rocket launchers and shooting salvo as a special ability.

Instead of direct-hit, make it a tagged location with sort of auto-aim :

 

first you shoot a tag on a location (hitting a mech will tag the ground or wall instead), then 0.5s (to be balanced) after you start shooting the salvo automatically aiming the tagged zone, so you can move or look up the missile will arc to reach the targeted zone.

Same damage and spread idea as the first post, but you shoot 12 missiles as 3x2x2 : three missiles from right shoulder, then 3 missiles from lef shoulder, repeat pattern, the whole salvo being shot in ~2s (to be balanced).

 

The purpose is to make the rockeeter a true suppression / area denial mech.

[Guns_N_Rozer]

wow great idea Anichkov3 ...... i never saw someone play in turrent mode (very few pilot) .....12 missile   so op......specially when u handle this rocke 

[LarryLaffer]

12 missile   so op

It is basically a nuke which deals 120 damage total, and 60 max per target every 20 sec. I don't think that it is OP even if not UP in terms of special abilities.

[Guns_N_Rozer]

It is basically a nuke which deals 120 damage total, and 60 max per target every 20 sec. I don't think that it is OP even if not UP in terms of special abilities.

yeah u r right ....but every mech is op if we know how to drive it .....but i do like to have that 12 missile ability on rocke

[Black_Knight_Sky]

+1 great idea and you presented it very well.

[HubbaBubba9849]

I think, since the role of the rocketeer is that of suppression, its ability shouldn't be something that just boosts attack or defense, but rather something akin to a multi-lock. As in "press F to lock-on to up to 3 enemies on screen".

Edited by HubbaBubba9849, 19 April 2015 - 10:44 AM.

[Duralumi]

you could've chosen a non-cursive font for your images, it'd be much easier on the eyes

 

That aside, I like the idea of Air Blitz. Perhaps it could reduce fuel consumption as well so the Rocketeer can stay in the air for longer.

[kasei]

Anything would be better than the current turret mode. I only ever use it for giggles.

I'll take any special ability over turret mode. Honestly, just slap Weapons Coolant on there and call it a day.

I'll post the same image I did last time for this thread. I want this on a G2. Advantage, more rockets. Disadvantage, not for close-quarters combat.

[Tankman95]

Maybe with the same animation as the incinerator's ability? Shooting out 6-8 heat seeking missile. Each target a random (or same) target.

 

Each missile does a small to decent amount of dmg. Not a "press F to kill" ability, but more of a suppression use.

[Rchive]

I really appreciate how much work went into this post!

I haven't used Rocketeer enough to know whether this is a good idea. Could be cool for a G2, though.

[AxionOperandi]

Pretty awesome idea (variant 1 & 3), I like it!  That would be a blast (pun!!) to use!

 

If it proves to be too strong/weak just tweak it till its right.

Edited by AxionOperandi, 20 April 2015 - 06:28 PM.

[VYR3]

interesting idea, but I'm not a fan of the mech with double auto aim weapons by default getting anything that will make it any more powerful. its Underpowered and should be reserved for lower level players trying to learn the game still.

 

any pilot over 1500 MMR should trash the rocketeer and use something stronger, its a fuzzy bunny mech for low level players. anyone can do better with any other mech if they actually know how to play the game, and with all the cheese flying out of a rocketeer, its hard to agree with it getting any kind of changes other than nerfs.

 

I'd rather fight a team of repair beam technicians than a team of seeker rocketeers. hell I'd rather fight against a team of scouts, cause those take some actual skill and good aim.

 

That said, its a nice idea.

[kasei]

interesting idea, but I'm not a fan of the mech with double auto aim weapons by default getting anything that will make it any more powerful. its Underpowered and should be reserved for lower level players trying to learn the game still.
 
any pilot over 1500 MMR should trash the rocketeer and use something stronger, its a fuzzy bunny mech for low level players. anyone can do better with any other mech if they actually know how to play the game, and with all the cheese flying out of a rocketeer, its hard to agree with it getting any kind of changes other than nerfs.
 
I'd rather fight a team of repair beam technicians than a team of seeker rocketeers. hell I'd rather fight against a team of scouts, cause those take some actual skill and good aim.
 
That said, its a nice idea.

Ya know, that post didn’t really contribute anything.

You think the Rocketeer is under-powered, but should only receive nerfs?
Did you actually read what you wrote?

Next you say that in matches higher than 1500 MMR, any other mech will perform better.

By that logic, a player competing in matches higher than 1500 MMR using an underpowered mech would be considered skilled at that particular mech. Correct?

I understand where you’re coming from though, you don’t want Hawken to turn into an auto-locking mess of missiles. However, I don’t think giving the Rocketeer a useful special ability would cause that. Perhaps this one is too much, but the Rocketeer does need an improvement.

I’d rather fight a full Hellfire team than a team full scouts. It’s amazing how opinions work. xD

Edit: Fixed formatting

Edited by kasei, 21 April 2015 - 02:21 PM.

[EM1O]

or add the capability to (CQC) dumbfire the entire Salvo at the cost of an immediate overheat condition of 50% timeout of a regular weps overheat.

now we're getting OP. (yeh, i'm plagiarizing MWO's Salvo overheat thingy)

it could be like the Bruiser Effect, where trolls go "OP ballistic" when you bust their face with a load of hellfires dumbfired without that dee-dee-dee warning then wipe their butt with the primary. only here with the super-duper Rocketeer mode, 12 all at once! alpha everything except maybe Brawler or turreted Vanguard.

 

seriously, not likely to happen, but it's a cool idea.

 

crap. reached my quota of positive votes for the day.

+1 anyway, bro!

Edited by em1o, 21 April 2015 - 10:25 AM.

[Epsilon_Knight]

Very well documented idea, you really put some consideration into the details.

If anything, it seems kind of weak, though. If it is dumbfire, and only 6 of the missiles can hit a c class mech, for a whopping 60 damage (and an a class for 40, maybe), once every 20 seconds, all I see it being good for is irritating enemies down hallways.

[VYR3]

Ya know, that post didn’t really contribute anything.

You think the Rocketeer is under-powered, but should only receive nerfs?
Did you actually read what you wrote?

Next you say that in matches higher than 1500 MMR, any other mech will perform better.

By that logic, a player competing in matches higher than 1500 MMR using an underpowered mech would be considered skilled at that particular mech. Correct?

I understand where you’re coming from though, you don’t want Hawken to turn into an auto-locking mess of missiles. However, I don’t think giving the Rocketeer a useful special ability would cause that. Perhaps this one is too much, but the Rocketeer does need an improvement.

I’d rather fight a full Hellfire team than a team full scouts. It’s amazing how opinions work. xD

Edit: Fixed formatting

I did read, and I understood your post, its a nice idea, and I do like it.

 

I think that the rock is underpowered, and I would rather see it nerfed even more than it get a buff until proper adjustments are made to make the mech actually require some aim and actually require some skill.

 

I think that the mech should be restricted and ONLY useful in very low MMR matches the way it is balanced right now. 

 

if the mech didnt have access to TWO instant lockon, fire and forget missiles, then I would be okay with it getting some new, more awesome abilities. 

 

as it stands, the mech is literally the most annoying, worthless mech to have on your own team or on an enemies team. when I see a rocketeer as MVP on an enemy team, I think one of two things, wow their team really sucks, or wow my team really fed that guy.

 

its a post, I liked what you had to say, but I dont want anything good to come to a mech that you can play shitfaced and not have to worry about a thing. come up with something better than what it has for weapons and then I'll be up for some changes to make it better, but until the double lock on BS is gone, I'll have none of it. 

 

and this is just my opinion, I dont have anything against players who like the mech, its certainly a play style, but I do have an issue with just how brainless you can be while playing that mech.

 

if the weapons functioned to where when you activate an ability they would lock on, that would be better, if it functioned to where the mech required precision aim because your rockets are laser guided, that would be good, but auto lock, skilless weapons really do not have a place in hawken. the game is supposed to be a fast paced, high adrenaline, high skill game, and when you have rocks and bruisers on the other team spamming hellfires, its not that at all.

 

I think that they can make the rock a good, balanced, challenging to use mech. I think that they can make it fun to fight and fun to fight as. Right now its not that, and thats not good for the game. I tried to get my friend to play the game a few days ago, and his only complaints were the rock was annoying cause in any match with them, all he could hear is the lock on warning, and the fact that they could lock onto the cloaked predator he was using from the trial.

 

so there is a problem with new players not liking the rock, as well as older players like myself. thats why I vehemently dislike the rock and want it trashed and rebuilt.

 

TL:DR yes I read your post, yes I read my post, I like your idea, I hate the rock, its a shitty mech that isnt any fun and I want it to be fun and skillful to play with because hawken doesnt need shitty mechs that take no skill to use.

[kasei]

I think that the rock is underpowered, and I would rather see it nerfed even more than it get a buff until proper adjustments are made to make the mech actually require some aim and actually require some skill.

You're classifying skill as precision aiming only. That's not the only ability that constitutes skill in this game. If we can't even agree on that then there's nothing left to discuss.
 

I think that the mech should be restricted and ONLY useful in very low MMR matches the way it is balanced right now.

So should the starter mech be a Rocketeer? Since the assault is now the default, should that be restricted for low MMR matches too? Should the Scout or Predator be restricted to only high tier play? No.
 

if the mech didnt have access to TWO instant lockon, fire and forget missiles, then I would be okay with it getting some new, more awesome abilities.

That's just incorrect. Hellfires are not instant lockon. The lock-on actually used to be much faster.
 

as it stands, the mech is literally the most annoying, worthless mech to have on your own team or on an enemies team. when I see a rocketeer as MVP on an enemy team, I think one of two things, wow their team really sucks, or wow my team really fed that guy.

I agree with you here, but that the whole point of the Rocketeer. The Rocketeer is a suppression mech, it's designed to be annoying. Its purpose is to keep people in cover. If a Rocketeer is getting a lot of kills, that means the other teams doesn't know how to use cover and is out in the open.
 

and this is just my opinion, I dont have anything against players who like the mech, its certainly a play style, but I do have an issue with just how brainless you can be while playing that mech.

I think we can both agree that no mech can be played brainless in higher MMR play. However, if you want to talk about brainless, let talk about the Incinerator and Tech combo then.
 

if the weapons functioned to where when you activate an ability they would lock on, that would be better, if it functioned to where the mech required precision aim because your rockets are laser guided, that would be good

The lock-on is only automatic for seekers. Even then you still have to have you reticle over the target. Like I said above you have to manually lock-on for Hellfires, you can't just dumb fire.
 

but auto lock, skilless weapons really do not have a place in hawken. the game is supposed to be a fast paced, high adrenaline, high skill game, and when you have rocks and bruisers on the other team spamming hellfires, its not that at all.

Says who? The game was a lot slower than this in the past. I think the game is too fast pace nowadays. I see now that we have two completely difference perspectives on what we want from Hawken. If the game gets any faster than it's current iteration, I'll just walk away from it.
 

I think that they can make the rock a good, balanced, challenging to use mech. I think that they can make it fun to fight and fun to fight as. Right now its not that, and thats not good for the game. I tried to get my friend to play the game a few days ago, and his only complaints were the rock was annoying cause in any match with them, all he could hear is the lock on warning, and the fact that they could lock onto the cloaked predator he was using from the trial.

No new player should be playing Predator to begin with. That's all I gotta say about that.
 

so there is a problem with new players not liking the rock, as well as older players like myself. thats why I vehemently dislike the rock and want it trashed and rebuilt.

That's funny. Seriously, where are all the threads talking about how the Rocketeer is overpowered?
 

TL:DR yes I read your post, yes I read my post, I like your idea, I hate the rock, its a shitty mech that isnt any fun and I want it to be fun and skillful to play with because hawken doesnt need shitty mechs that take no skill to use.

This last part was just callow.

Edit:

Honestly, remove the Seeker from the game. I'd still play the Rocketeer using the EOC. Do you have any issues with that idea? As it stands, I never see any Rocketeer using the EOC or the Heat Cannon, because the Seeker is far too attractive most of the time.

Edited by kasei, 22 April 2015 - 07:00 PM.

[VYR3]

You're classifying skill as precision aiming only. That's not the only ability that constitutes skill in this game. If we can't even agree on that then there's nothing left to discuss.
 

as far as this thread goes, yes, thats the only thing I care about. rocketeer doesnt auto dodge for you, just auto aims.

So should the starter mech be a Rocketeer? Since the assault is now the default, should that be restricted for low MMR matches too? Should the Scout or Predator be restricted to only high tier play? No.
 

no. but it shouldnt even be thought about after low tier gameplay because its a fuzzy bunny mech that doesnt have enough DPS or armour to stand against a good player.

That's just incorrect. Hellfires are not instant lockon. The lock-on actually used to be much faster.

 

I know they were, and a sub two second lock on is near enough instant that it doesnt matter. press a button, it locks on, you shoot missiles
 
I agree with you here, but that the whole point of the Rocketeer. The Rocketeer is a suppression mech, it's designed to be annoying. Its purpose is to keep people in cover. If a Rocketeer is getting a lot of kills, that means the other teams doesn't know how to use cover and is out in the open.
 

I think we can both agree that no mech can be played brainless in higher MMR play. However, if you want to talk about brainless, let talk about the Incinerator and Tech combo then.
 

now that is a pretty annoying combo, incends ability is the dumbest idea I think the original team ever had. that + green beam is just stupid. although, they both require at least some aim to use effectively unless running a redox and the incend is just alt spamming. then its just as bad as the rocks.

 

and I'll see if I can find the video, the guy had his mouse spinning the whole time playing the rock and didnt do totally shitty, although that was before the steam patch.

The lock-on is only automatic for seekers. Even then you still have to have you reticle over the target. Like I said above you have to manually lock-on for Hellfires, you can't just dumb fire.
 

its a wide enough grace zone that once again, it doesnt matter. I've used the seeker, its terrible, but it still consistently hits targets that I'm not actually centered on. they can be towards the edge of my screen and I still hit them with the damn thing.

Says who? The game was a lot slower than this in the past. I think the game is too fast pace nowadays. I see now that we have two completely difference perspectives on what we want from Hawken. If the game gets any faster than it's current iteration, I'll just walk away from it.
 

it is too fast paced, but it keeps the game from being a constant corner hugging mess that it was for a while. its better for newer players, not for older ones, and TBCH I'm okay with that, I would rather the game be too fast and draw in new people than be too slow and have players we have currently get frustrated and leave the game instead.

No new player should be playing Predator to begin with. That's all I gotta say about that.

 

I told him that, he wanted to play the invisible guy that can see through walls, it was more about the fact that they could lock on when you're invisible
 

That's funny. Seriously, where are all the threads talking about how the Rocketeer is overpowered?

 

old forums had a lot of them, in game a lot of players whine about it. I had a really good post about the rock on the old forums but since those are gone I dont think I'll be able to find it, which makes me sad.
 

This last part was just callow.

 

its a TL:DR, its a summary. its not immature, its not inexperienced. its simply there for people to get the gist of what I'm saying, so whatever.

Edit:

Honestly, remove the Seeker from the game. I'd still play the Rocketeer using the EOC. Do you have any issues with that idea? As it stands, I never see any Rocketeer using the EOC or the Heat Cannon, because the Seeker is far too attractive most of the time.

 

remove the seeker and then the rocketeer is suddenly much more balanced in my eyes, since its basically my biggest gripe with the damn thing.

 

double lockons is skilless, no aim, no thought, just left mouse button.

 

removing the seeker would probably make the rocketeer a lot better. I dont have a problem with the mech's damage output, its pathetic. I have an issue with the fact that you can look in the general direction of a mech, press two buttons and not have to think until your hellfires are recharged.

 

if I didnt see EVERY SINGLE ROCKETEER I get into a game with using the seeker/skillfire combo, I think I wouldnt have any other issues with the mech.

 

the only other thing I would need to see to be happy with how the mech is would be for hellfires to not lock onto cloaked mechs. that's just stupid. you can press a button, swirl in a circle, and target any cloaker on the map.

 

there are obvious, glaring issues that need to be looked at for QoL for other players first. yes the rock needs to be changed, yes they should do something about it, no its not a priority, no it shouldnt come before things like new mechs, new weapons, or new maps.

 

rock changes need to be a back burner, community effort with the devs so that we can fix the damn thing to not be a pile of fuzzy bunny and not be so annoying that people rage quit matches as soon as someone picks it in the mech selector.

 

I've gone through games with two rocketeers and I heard constant beeping. I couldn't go anywhere without instantly getting a lock on warning.

 

I'm just gonna say this: The game needs actual content and actual fixes before any of our current mechs even get glimpsed at. the mech needs a lot of fixing to make it good. I think a lot of my frustration with the thing is the fact that it sounds so cool, it looks awesome, and it sounds like one of the best things you can use in the game, but its not. its a piece of fuzzy bunny and it should be, because the original execution of the mech is pathetic and terrible. its one of those "in concept is great, in trial is terrible" kinds of things. 

 

the way the locks currently function is bad, it takes too little skill to pilot the mech, it take too little skill to inflict pretty sizable portions of damage onto enemies, and it takes too little skill in general to press a button and send a barrage of missiles at an enemy.

 

the mech isnt OP in the sense that it does too much damage, it doesnt have that good of armour, its not that fast, but it does basically half the work for you, and that shouldnt be a thing. if they made the mech require more precise aim by deleting the seeker and giving the mech something better, something cooler, and something that is much more fair in the game, I think that the rock would be a lot nicer.

 

 

and just to make it clear, cause its very late here, words are hard, and I'm tired, I have no hard feelings at you, so please dont take it that way. I want the mech to be good, but more things than just giving it new powers are going to need to be done before its in the right spot.

 

cheers.

[Anichkov3]

Increasingly, it seems that people want all the bottles in the game are the same. They do not like anything when some mechs are not like Assault, right? You want everyone to have been something like TOW + hitscan gun/shotgun. Many people forget that the game DIFFERENT mechs with different play styles and with different roles on the battlefield. And increasingly, people simply do not like whine of something. Why people do not think that there is no Rocketeer hitscan weapons. All weapons Rocketeer slowly flies into the enemy!

You've probably never played Rocketeer one on one against light mechs at close range. Remember also that you are finally Rocketeer mech support and suppression. His direct task on the battlefield - be hindered from the enemy. He successfully copes with it, but the damage his weapon is so negligible that practically able to fight one on one. 

And I repeat for the umpteenth time already.

If you have a problem with the battle against Rocketeer - then learn how to play. You have a problem that two Rocketeer shoot at you on a map when you go out of hiding? Including the brain and remember that if you had two against sniper you'd died on the spot as a dog would.

[Onstrava]

Why is this not in the game yet!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Now thats the rocketeer I've wishing for. Perhaps make it the G2 version *wink* *wink* come on devs don't let these ideas go to waste. Sure the idea isn't "revolutionary", but that doesn't mean it's a bad thing.

[6ixxer]

i think rocketeer can be very good when you have high ping (same as nief).

if you are plagued with high ping you should still have an option to play.

I have had fun playing with 400+ ping in rocketeer when no other mech could land any shots.

 

The issues are that rocketeer appears to have been over-nerfed on lockon time and helfire turn radius. perhaps dial them back a little.

I also agree that the turret mode is next to useless.

 

Id like to see a hellfire variant where it will fire single rockets at quicker intervals or holding lets you charge a full salvo (or the alt function toggles between these). Could have good synergy with EOC and heat. Ability could turn on a decent homing function (fast lockon + better turn rate) for 8sec with 30-35 sec refresh?