242 replies to this topic

[[HWK]HAGER]

Dackstrus, on March 01 2013 - 08:27 PM, said:

For the first time i can say,

NOT A SINGLE BAD THING HERE.

GG, you've also figured out how to patchnote. Enjoy.


Now fix people missing their freds.

We've been working on improving the patch notes. Great to hear they are a hit this go around.

We do actually listen.

[Guiotine]

Major_Victory, on March 01 2013 - 07:57 PM, said:

So 2 days of level 25 rocketeer and it just had its "Rocketeery-ness" removed. Explosive damage decreased, that's what this thing is good for. Hopefully this works out, I was enjoying the big guy, at least the EOC might be better now.

I'll take a read through it again, but I'm pretty sure Hellfires just got buffed, and it wasn't explosive damage that was nerfed exactly, it was explosion feather damage, that means they lowered the minimum damage done by explosions. This shouldn't mean much to a rocketeer using the Seeker or EOC, as seeker (as well as Hellfires) are homing, and the EOC just got a pretty nice buff overall. AFAIK seeker/EoC/Hellfires splash were all pretty much non existant, so this wouldn't effect them as much as it effects the HEAT, TOW, and Rev-GL. The HEAT nerfs suck, but it was necessary because of scouts (and to a lesser degree infils). Seeker homing nerf (through weapon levels) was something I didn't think necessary, but it seems all the weapon level upgrades are being brought in line to all give a 5% boost. Further lessening the gap between a level 1 and a level  25 mech.

edit: after re-reading through the changes to the EOC, Seeker, and Hellfires, I notice nerfs to an "inner damage" radius. Im not entirely sure what this is, but I think it means the radius where damage starts to feather is smaller now, so you need to be more accurate with your explosions. That should be easier for rocketeers not using the HEAT, since EOC mine radius was doubled, and Seeker (should be) homing.

edit 2: after re-re-reading it, Hellfires were the only explosive weapon to directly get a damage nerf. But I think a Homing buff, fire rate buff, missile acceleration buff, missile initial speed buff, and spread buff counteract that, no_

Edited by Guiotine, March 01 2013 - 08:59 PM.

[draco7891]

Conquistador, on March 01 2013 - 06:24 PM, said:

CaptainSoviet, on March 01 2013 - 06:09 PM, said:

Let us go back to the days of when the grenadier was good, and the rev-gl actually did something.

Soooo... Back to this_

I'd rather we not.

By contrast, if I take some conservative guesstimation at the RoF increase, the RevGL post-patch will be around 19 grenades to overheat, 14.6 seconds of fire time, and 1425 total damage possible.

These are numbers identical to the Assault Rifle. Except the AR is direct-aim, and hitscan. The RevGL is still projectile and has a lob arc, and still has the 0.25sec explode after contact timer to deal with. The post-patch RevGL will not just be useless in a 1v1, it will be actively dangerous to take a RevGL Grenadier at all, in any scenario.

It's going through the same cycle that the EOC did, first by being nerfed repeatedly into obscurity. Eventually, it will be buffed back to the position it was in originally, with a few minor tweaks to put it where it should be. We'd all just like it not to take the ~2 months like it did for the EOC.

Draco

[Analysis]

Scapes, on March 01 2013 - 03:46 PM, said:

Mechs

• NEW Mech: RaiderMapsMatchmakingCustomizations
  
  • Details coming March 5!
    
  • NEW Map: Facility
    
    • Game Modes: Team Deathmatch and Missile Assault.
      
    • This work-in-progress map will be in an unskinned or "whitebox" state. Try it out and let us know what you think!
      
    • This map will not be part of the normal map rotation. There will be servers dedicated to this map specifically which can be accessed via Server Browser.
      
    • This map will also support Deathmatch in an upcoming patch.
  • Server Browser: We've seen significant improvements to matchmaking, but it's still not ideal so we're bringing back the server browser.
    
    • The server browser will not have a requirement tied to its availability. Meaning, a first time player will be able access this tab right away.
      
    • Matchmaking servers +/-300 points outside your player rating will be grayed out and you will be unable to join. This restriction does not apply to custom servers.
      
      • Joining through friends is still possible even if the server is outside of your rating.
    • These are not servers separate from the ones we use for matchmaking, they're all from the same pool. We will also be running Custom Servers.
      
    • Server names will be unique so it'll be easy to find specific servers.  The name of the server a player is on will appear on the TAB screen during gameplay to make this process even easier.
      
    • Your Player Rating will appear on the Server Browser so you can see where you fall on the scale in comparison with available servers. The purpose of this system is to both identify and track the skills of gamers in order to be able to match them into competitive matches.
      
    • Servers will be labelled "Beginner", "Medium", or "Advanced", dynamically based on the average rating of the players currently on the server. Empty servers will show as "Unranked" until at least 3 players have joined.
      
    • Game mode lock restrictions previously applied to Matchmaking also apply to Server Browser. Players will need to play a requisite number of Team Deathmatch games to unlock other game modes.
  • Matchmaking has been renamed Quick Match.
    
  • The "All Regions" filter has been removed.
    
  • The "Custom Servers" filter has been added. Servers in this filter will be set up to run "test" maps such as Facility or work-in-progress game modes. If you use Quick Match, you'll be put into one of these servers most closely matching your Player Rating.
    
  • Two new ways to "express" yourself to allies and enemies in-game: Details coming March 5!
    
  • NEW Camouflages: WOODLAND-GRN, HAZMAT-Z10, BRAIN-WAVE
    
  • NEW Thruster: JT-H0TSH0T
    
  • NEW Repair Drone: RD-QU4TERNION
    
  • NEW Chassis: Muller (Class
• GameplayModesMiscellaneousClick here to view the article
  [/quote]
  
  • Suicides: When a player suicides, credit for the kill will be given to the last player who dealt damage as long as they are within the time limit to get an assist (10 seconds).
    
  • Nemesis System
    
    • Dominate a foe by killing them three times without them killing you to gain bonus XP. When dominating or dominated, you will be marked by a skull or target icon (respectively) next to your name. While being dominated, you can end the domination to remove your target icon and gain bonus XP by earning a kill or critical assist against the foe who is dominating you.
      
    • Become a nemesis of a foe by killing each other three times each in a match to gain bonus XP.
      
    • Become an underdog by killing or assisting against a mech at least five levels above yours to gain bonus XP based on level difference.
  • Kill Messages
    
    • Assists for which you dealt most of the damage are now displayed as critical assists.
      
    • When the requisite action for dominating, dominated, nemesis, or underdog status is achieved, it will be reflected in the kill message.
  • Team Deathmatch: A new win condition has been introduced. The first team to 50 kills or the team with the most kills after 15 minutes wins.
    
  • The Friends List and Message windows now scale with your set resolution.
    
  • The profanity filter has been adjusted to be less aggressive.

I like that a new mech is coming and a new map, but I'm concerned about some changes and a lack of other changes. Any chance we may see some interactivity in future maps. The current 4 maps(Prosk, Origin, Bazaar, Uptown) are all static except for the occasion background windmill.

Can a greyed out server be joined via quick match making_

Why is there no mention of the kill cam in the patch_ What this tells me is you guys are probably happy with the current form.

No mention of zooming out repair mode_ It seems strange to have your revenue based on cosmetics and only be able to see part of the mech. Please bring back a more distant repair view.

The days of utter dominance of winning by 50+ kills is now over.
With the new condition(first to 50 kills) does this mean if a game lasted 5 mins you would only get a fraction of the hawken points or would it be considered a 15 minute game_

Less of a filter is great and this might mean my name is no longer partially censored.

Please bring back camera rotation at the end of the match. In the current Hawken patch only the "MVP" can rotate the camera. In older versions of the game everyone was able to shift the camera around at the end of the match.

Thank you for partially eliminating suicides. I still feel that a suicide should still be considered a -1 kill though. You don't have to subtract any exp though. Alternatively the kill count could be left the same, but the category of suicides on the score screen could be included. At the end of the match a kill net could be kills - suicides = kill net.

Not a fan of the Nemesis icon unless it is only viewable on the score screen.

Kill message mean more large floating text_

[h0B0]

http://community.pla...hday-patch-eva/
Review up.

No mention of stunlock_

No mention of account bound inventory_

No mention of cammos_

[SS396]

Somehow my post way back on page 2 was not responded too so I'll post it again.  This time it'll be a little more obvious.  

Alpha and beta exclusive camo's__
Where are they_  I don't see them listed in the patch notes.  

What I do see is 3 new camo's and does this mean that our exclusive camo isn't exclusive at all_  Just free.  

info please, when you get a free moment this weekend.

Edited by SS396, March 01 2013 - 09:16 PM.

[Omega22]

all i See is DECREASE !!!

[Climatic]

Great freaking work guys with the server browsers! Some weapons were over nerfed on my opinion, but can't say that until I'll play a few games after the patch. In general great work devs, you guys really listened to the community and raised the awesomeness of this game. As a guy who love the game you guys created, you have my thanks!

[Conquistador]

draco7891, on March 01 2013 - 09:03 PM, said:

Conquistador, on March 01 2013 - 06:24 PM, said:

CaptainSoviet, on March 01 2013 - 06:09 PM, said:

Let us go back to the days of when the grenadier was good, and the rev-gl actually did something.

Soooo... Back to this_

I'd rather we not.

By contrast, if I take some conservative guesstimation at the RoF increase, the RevGL post-patch will be around 19 grenades to overheat, 14.6 seconds of fire time, and 1425 total damage possible.

These are numbers identical to the Assault Rifle. Except the AR is direct-aim, and hitscan. The RevGL is still projectile and has a lob arc, and still has the 0.25sec explode after contact timer to deal with. The post-patch RevGL will not just be useless in a 1v1, it will be actively dangerous to take a RevGL Grenadier at all, in any scenario.

It's going through the same cycle that the EOC did, first by being nerfed repeatedly into obscurity. Eventually, it will be buffed back to the position it was in originally, with a few minor tweaks to put it where it should be. We'd all just like it not to take the ~2 months like it did for the EOC.

Draco

This is an absolutely fantastic change for the only fully automatic explosive weapon in the game that has area denial abilities beyond the horizon regardless of line of sight. I see absolutely zero problems with this implementation, considering they even buffed ROF, which means the area denial is even more potent over that shorter period of time.

It now takes actual skill to use the weapon beyond minute changes to firing arc over a twenty second sustained fire period!

Also, I'm not certain using a metric comparison against the AR is the best way to defend your argument. All bullet weapons were falling by the wayside, being sidelined by explosives and the nerf to explosives applies across the board. The fact the new revgl will put it on par with the AR is FANTASTIC. this means bullet weapons are now feasible again in context of explosives. Which is exactly what the game needed. Marginalizing an entire ammo type is a rut HAWKEN has been struggling to climb out of for months.

Finally, in mech context, grenadier rev-gl seems more like a support side grade to the alternate choice of heat, which makes the grenadier a better duelist. They're different, parallel roles that both have their place, and since it's arguably easier to use a fully automatic compared against a burst weapon, I have no problems with use of the new revgl as a longer-range mortar for area denial. Sure it takes more skill now because now heat management actually matters to the rev-gl, but that's a welcome change to mindless endless spam with no consequences on what is perhaps one of the easier explosive weapons to use.

I simply could not be happier.

Edited by Conquistador, March 01 2013 - 09:54 PM.

[RudaForce]

Everything looks... Amazing!
Except no PS nerf. Bad Devs!
Better luck next time.

[necroq]

Climatic, on March 01 2013 - 09:27 PM, said:

Great freaking work guys with the server browsers! Some weapons were over nerfed on my opinion, but can't say that until I'll play a few games after the patch. In general great work devs, you guys really listened to the community and raised the awesomeness of this game. As a guy who love the game you guys created, you have my thanks!

looks like they listen to much. for example emp has even less duration now. who use it_
do you collect statistics for items_ I can't imagine somebody is so crazy and take emp instead of detonator.

Edited by necroq, March 01 2013 - 09:35 PM.

[Guiotine]

Since there wasn't any mention of alpha/beta camos, I just assumed they are still not ready to release account bound inventories.

[SS396]

Guiotine, on March 01 2013 - 09:36 PM, said:

Since there wasn't any mention of alpha/beta camos, I just assumed they are still not ready to release account bound inventories.

Read here, this was posted on the 8th of Feb.
http://community.pla...al-responses-2/

Thats the thing, that says next patch expected on the 24th of Feb, if its not ready, thats perfectly fine.  Just acknowledge it.

I'm just hoping it was left out of the patch notes, thats all.

[Xuande]

Great patch coming up! Looking forward to it!! However I am sad to see there will be no change to SS and still no capabilities of using previously bought camos on other mechs without having to re-buy them.

EDIT: And where's the reticle_! Please consider giving it back!!

Edited by Xuande, March 01 2013 - 10:06 PM.

[Cincyslayer99]

From what I am seeing it certainly looks like we are in for more longer lasting "duels" which I think is great!

[c0mad0r]

Proof that they do read the bug forums!!!

Quote

Items

• Repair Charge: No more "dud" charges! There will be a very slight delay before healing begins, but the charges will now always heal.
  
• Detonator: This item will no longer penetrate a deployed Shield.

There's 5+ threads on the Repair Charge issue. Glad to see it in there!

I posted the Detonator bug HERE and am kinda jazzed I "contributed" lol.

Edited by c0mad0r, March 01 2013 - 10:01 PM.

[Guiotine]

SS396, on March 01 2013 - 09:45 PM, said:

Guiotine, on March 01 2013 - 09:36 PM, said:

Since there wasn't any mention of alpha/beta camos, I just assumed they are still not ready to release account bound inventories.

Read here, this was posted on the 8th of Feb.
http://community.pla...al-responses-2/

Thats the thing, that says next patch expected on the 24th of Feb, if its not ready, thats perfectly fine.  Just acknowledge it.

I'm just hoping it was left out of the patch notes, thats all.

oh yeah, I completely forgot about that, no wonder so many people mentioned it this time around.

[Pirits]

Perhaps the death of my heat infiltrator, and the birth of an EOC infiltrator...

[phed]

wow wow wowowowowo wow!

Great work, can't wait to bug test this new patch.  Though I feel I may be disappointed in my qm score...

...and what about them camos_

[draco7891]

Conquistador, on March 01 2013 - 09:33 PM, said:

I see absolutely zero problems with this implementation, considering they even buffed ROF, which means the area denial is even more potent over that shorter period of time.

No, it isn't, and here's why: using the weapon as an area-denial tool burns heat pool. Current ROF is ~1.25 (5 in every 4 seconds), I guesstimated 1.3 (or 4 in every 3 seconds). If you put down 10 grenades, that's half your heat pool for 7.6 seconds of denial. At that point, an opponent can simply step into your line of fire, because he knows that even if you hold down the button, you will overheat before you can do enough damage to kill him. That's not area-denial, it's suicide in a C-class chassis. The RevGL in area-denial is dead.  You do not have any leeway in your heat or damage output to do any kind of denial or corner-punishment or fishing for damage. Not a single round.

Quote

It now takes actual skill to use the weapon beyond minute changes to firing arc over a twenty second sustained fire period!

Not skill, god-like prescience and prediction. You must hit every grenade, on target, every time. Missing a grenade tanks your damage output and heat pool so severely that you will never recover against the AR/SMC/Vulcan. A single grenade is equivalent to missing an entire second of AR fire.

Quote

All bullet weapons were falling by the wayside, being sidelined by explosives and the nerf to explosives applies across the board.

Hitscan bullet weapons have the inherent advantage of being undodgeable (and have thus continued to be applicable against explosive options). The only explosive weapons that were sidelining bullets were those with splash ranges and minimum damages larger than a player's ability to avoid them (and thus to be unavoidable), both of which are corrected by this patch; those changes I think are good and will change the dynamic of the game. But bullets have never been obsoleted by explosives.

Quote

Finally, in mech context, grenadier rev-gl seems more like a support side grade to the alternate choice of heat

Except that the RevGL is the initial equipment loadout and is thus not a sidegrade, but the initial experience that the mech is attempting to convey. That experience should not be "this mech is worse in every way imaginable to literally any other weapon combination you could have chosen". The HEAT is superior (and continues to be superior) in all dimensions and in all scenarios when compared to the RevGL, pre or post-patch. That's not a sidegrade. It's the only viable option.

Draco

Edited by draco7891, March 01 2013 - 10:50 PM.