311 replies to this topic

[SS396]

 

Coming at you live from the Hawken forums, SS396 brings you Arguing in Futility!

 

Featuring

• Logical fallacies!
• A total disregard for substantive responses!
• Focusing on semantics, yet missing the point of the discussion!
• Paranoia!

 

 

Don't forget insults.... and winning.  I was going to call you a dlldo, but you'd probably click the report button just for spite and not see the humor I intended.

 

Its ok TPG, it really is.  Those claims were really far reaching when they were made, I understand that you cannot provide any evidence to back them in any way shape of form, even after 24 hours of brainstorming on it.  You can't win them all.

[DallasCreeper]

This just seems like such a trivial topic to argue over for 3 pages of this thread, but that's just my opinion. 

[ticklemyiguana]

This just seems like such a trivial topic to argue over for 3 pages of this thread, but that's just my opinion. 

psh. go back outside, you casual.

[SS396]

This just seems like such a trivial topic to argue over for 3 pages of this thread, but that's just my opinion. 

 

Oh it is, but this is about the principal of the matter.  This is all about being called out and backing up your outlandish claim(s).  He over exaggerated comp plays importance quite a bit, trying to make it seem more important than it is in this community.  He did this more than 3 times, the biggest over exaggeration is then he stated that the only reason Hawken was alive was because of comp play.  I'm surprised he didn't break his arm patting himself on his own back.  Also and by community I mean anyone that has or does play Hawken, not just the subset of nerds that visit the forums frequently.  I would like Nept to note that definition of community in his silly summation of my thoughts on the subject, cause really nobody asked me exactly what I thought on the subject.  They just inferred it from my posts.  To me the community is anyone that plays this game, not just the ones that visit the forums.  We never hear those thousands of players opinions at all, by listening only to the vocal ones, you don't get the full picture.

 

Had that been me or some other random non TPG member on the forums making absurd outrageous statements like that, we would of been reamed from all sides by Coma-Doof warrior and his War Boy band.    (make sure you put a few seconds of a pause between War and Boy band, it sounds funnier that way)

[Xacius]

Don't forget insults.... and winning.  I was going to call you a dlldo, but you'd probably click the report button just for spite and not see the humor I intended.

 

Its ok TPG, it really is.  Those claims were really far reaching when they were made, I understand that you cannot provide any evidence to back them in any way shape of form, even after 24 hours of brainstorming on it.  You can't win them all.

Not sure if you're just trolling at this point, or if you're actually as delusional as you appear to be.  

[CounterlogicMan]

I have always enjoyed Hawken in the various iterations I have played. For reference, I started playing a week before the raider patch. I have enjoyed the game much more since the ascension patch, in part due to the increased speeds. Partially due to my increased participation in the small competitive community we have here. Mostly due to the way in which Hawken has captured a mix of Halo and Unreal Tournament shooter gameplay while mixing in a good amount of TF2 class based dynamics. All the while not failing to add in its own flavor. I think this uniqueness and balance between very contrasting styles of games has only grown stronger since the ascension patch. I feel this is closer to the vision Khang Le has spoke of when talking about Hawken as a game with great sci fi mech aesthetics with gameplay speeds that are somewhere between Halo and MechWarrior. Hawken's aesthetics have only gotten stronger in my opinion, UI excluded. The visuals have gotten much more polished and the special effects are top notch for a UE3 game running dx9. This has added greatly to my experience. Can't wait for the dx upgrade.

 

Overall I feel the game is much more balanced than it was before ascension. I enjoy the gameplay more even though the pacing has changed quite a bit. I feel there is a huge amount of potential in Hawken. I trust Reloaded, specifically josh, will nurture this potential in a responsible manner. Hawken is in a very weird limbo state. The game has fallen off the radar of most PC gamers despite its big splash in 2012. There will be more content. We know a little of what might be coming based on unused game files and hints dropped by the devs. This content will undoubtedly change the gameplay dynamics in some way. I don't think anything drastic will change gameplay-wise, a la ascension. The biggest challenge will be to renew the hype that Hawken had a few years ago. To me this means making the gameplay easier to view, more enjoyable over time, and advertising. Ya know player retention things. I am a bit biased here but from what I know about the effects of having a very watchable and understandable game, a fleshed out spectator mode and overall improved UI would go a long way.

 

For anyone that follows me on twitch or play with me often know that I say this a lot. Hawken as a whole is an incredible game, but is held back by little things that constantly detract from the experience right when it's getting really good. For players like me, and a lot of you reading this post, these things won't stop us from playing. But for players just coming to the game because they saw a youtube video, twitch stream, twitter post, friend, etc. These little things are deal breakers because most other free to play games these players are playing don't have these flow breaking things. A lot of these things, as I understand from looking back, were in the process of being worked on. Unfortunately Hawken's business history went down the way it did. Fortunately Reloaded has saved Hawken from death and are in a position to handle these little things. All considered I enjoy Hawken more than I did a year and a half ago. I will probably enjoy Hawken even more once more stuff is added to the game and more players are brought in. 

 

As far as what the little things I was referring to are, that discussion deserves a thread in of itself. I am sure many players have a pretty good list. I don't want to derail this thread by making the discussion about the little things.

 

As for the plethora of grammar mistakes, sorry it was really late when I typed this.

Edited by CounterlogicMan, 18 January 2016 - 03:58 AM.

[eth0]

Since I cannot send SS396 a private message I'm left to bump this thread.

Spoiler

 

Since that post, 2 TPG members have published Youtube videos, fuzzy bunnyng 2 Nept (1 did it just to backup Crafty as noted in another thread), but there are still pages on pages of videos produced by thousands of people unaffiliated with TPG. Therefore it can be shown that the Hawken content being created is not only by TPG players as claimed by Crafty and now you Nept.
 

 

That's not why I make videos. That's not why I made the videos in the thread you referenced. Please stop making things up.

 

Since you posted in that thread I thought that you took the humor well but I may be wrong. I'm sorry if my, admittedly clickbait, title upset you.

 

Outside of comparing screenshots and videos then-and-now for things like "old HUD!!!", "sfx=immersion", and "muh tunnel", Hawken now is what we had before with a few support mechs, air-dodge, and better balance (pending). 

 

-snip-

 

Quality post. In Josh We Trust.

[JackVandal]

you can bring a horse to water.....

Perhaps waterboard the horse? Salt him to death?

[crockrocket]

This just seems like such a trivial topic to argue over for 3 pages years of these threads, but that's just my opinion. 

 

Welcome to the forums

[coldform]

Welcome to the forums

Nothing but idle soldiers in country.

[ATX22]

You need topics like these to keep these forums alive!  There's generally less than ~30 people logged in on a busy day. 

[CounterlogicMan]

I forgot to add that I actually have felt a little disapointed over time with the direction in which new internals and items seemed to be going. It goes back to my feelings that there is a lot of potential in Hawken's design. Yet I can understand why the internals and items are the way they are. Hawken is built on a very lean design doctrine of kit bashing were old stuff is just thrown together in new ways and given new names/attributes and asthetics. This definitely saves a lot of time and money for small teams but in my opinion results in too much familiarity and a lack of unique experiences over time. Kind of like the underwhelming feeling of when you try the assault after having had the recruit for so long, then trying the berzerker thinking it would be much different. Or more back to my point of internals and items, how some internals really do change the way your mechs play then there are iterations of that same internal concept that are really just recycling the original idea in less impactful ways. Or just filling space when they should have been included in the original internal (looking at you air 180 and air compressor). I feel the pressure to iterate and kit bash as fast as possible to push out content resulted in some items/internals that are really just illusions of meaningful choice in internals/items. In summary I would feel a lot better about mech customization if there was more meaningful choice, impactful internals/items, rather than a bunch of options that are just pointless iterations filling space. This I feel can be done by revising some existing internals and/or introducing some new ones.

 

Relating it back to the topic at hand. The internals and item system we have now I feel is much better than the cooldown items and tuning systems we use to have. Mech customization has definitely gone in the right direction. However I feel due to the combination of pressure to quickly create content and a progression system that lagged behind we now have been left with a few dominant strategies in mech customization. Resulting in a sense of lost potential and a mess that needs cleaning up in the area of internals/items. Of any time that I have played Hawken, now is the time I feel mechs are pretty amazingly balanced. The dominant strategies and problems start to arise when I look at the items and internals selections. So it is saying a lot about how far the game has come when I say that despite all this items and internals are way better than what we used to have.

 

 

Counterlogicman tries with all his might to get this train back on the tracks.

Edited by CounterlogicMan, 18 January 2016 - 12:19 PM.

[Hyginos]

The internals and item system we have now I feel is much better than the cooldown items and tuning systems we use to have. Mech customization has definitely gone in the right direction.

 

I'm not sure I agree on the item thing. I sorta prefer cooldown item limits to ammunition.

 

With that said I am a big fan of how the item/internal layout looks. From the UI it is fairly obvious that the mech has a certain amount of space, and that it can be filled by internals/items of various sizes. 

 

On a somewhat related note, I've always been curious to see what would happen if items and internals shared space. You could take the same setup as before with half items and half internals, or you could choose to sacrifice one for more of the other.

 

However I feel due to the combination of pressure to quickly create content and a progression system that lagged behind we now have been left with a few dominant strategies in mech customization.

 

I wonder how much of this is the rapid content creation and how much of it is the age of the current patch. It would seem that, no matter how much customization there is, there will be a meta that is slowly refined as long as there are no other inputs.

[BeardApprovesYo]

Perhaps waterboard the horse? Salt him to death?

 

That is so beard!!!

[CraftyDus]

 

On a somewhat related note, I've always been curious to see what would happen if items and internals shared space. You could take the same setup as before with half items and half internals, or you could choose to sacrifice one for more of the other.

 

 

 

 

really cool idea

[_incitatus]

On a somewhat related note, I've always been curious to see what would happen if items and internals shared space. You could take the same setup as before with half items and half internals, or you could choose to sacrifice one for more of the other.

 

 

I think we'd see less items and more internals.

[CraftyDus]

that item cooldown internal would finally be valuable though

[SS396]

Since I cannot send SS396 a private message I'm left to bump this thread.

 
I have PM's disabled and have for quite some time.  Sorry if you'd rather deal with this in private, but I really don't have any reason to be secretive, what I would say to someone in private is exactly what I would say to them in public.

Also bumping this thread is not the only option, other people that have wanted to get ahold of me in private have simply quoted a single one of my posts in a forgotten thread in a low traffic area on the forums and asked me to turn on PM's for a conversation, at which point I have contacted them.

Heck, you could of just asked me to contact you in your post if you really wanted it to be private, oh well.

Spoiler

 
  
That's not why I make videos. That's not why I made the videos in the thread you referenced. Please stop making things up.
 
Since you posted in that thread I thought that you took the humor well but I may be wrong. I'm sorry if my, admittedly clickbait, title upset you.

 
All things considered, when you take a look at the timing of releasing those videos in relation to the ongoing discussion this thread, the title you chose of the post advertising those videos (which didn't upset me at all btw, I genuinely laughed when it popped up on the feed) and who it was from (someone affiliated with comp play), and the content of those videos (comp play). I think you can easily understand how anyone remotely familiar with the situation would of arrived at that conclusion.  Had you done one tiny single thing differently it would of been much more difficult to connect the dots.  I am simply stating my opinion of the matter based strictly off of deductive reasoning of the stated events. Its hardly making anything up, it is my observation of what I saw and what I read. Other peoples views of the situation might be different, some might be the same, but if it was not what you intended, well then your actions spoke louder than your words eth0.
 
Now I understand thats not WHY you make videos.   Notice I didn't say that backing up Craftys fallacy WAS the reason why you make videos BTW. I don't think thats any reason why anyone makes videos at all, just like I don't think that most of the Hawken related video content thats out there has been recorded by comp players, mandatory or not.  A fact I can provide google evidence for if asked to prove that assertion, humor intended. However the overwhelming evidence that directly linked you into my reasoning was your inclusion of your self admitted clickbait title where you specifically stated rallying support for Crafty. That is why I said what I said, if it wasn't what you intended then your message wasn't very clear at least not to me.

[Hyginos]

The discussion has moved on SS396. Please pay attention.

[DieselCat]

I think he was just responding to someone that wanted to speak with him in private but could not, so decided to post a reply here.

[SS396]

The discussion has moved on SS396. Please pay attention.

I responded at my earliest convenience to a post written directly to me within this thread, yes the current discussion from that point has moved onto another branch of the topic, but that does not mean that I CANNOT or SHOULD not respond to something said earlier. Plenty of people do this on the forums, but I don't see you busting out your barbie dream moderator badge and criticizing them when they do it.

[JackVandal]

if items and internals shared space. 

WANT

 

on a related issue, the current balance would need work, i mean, full orb lord with composite armor with room for deflectors fuel converter and an armor fuser, sweet biscuits that's nasty, but i really like this idea.

[HugeGuts]

On a somewhat related note, I've always been curious to see what would happen if items and internals shared space. You could take the same setup as before with half items and half internals, or you could choose to sacrifice one for more of the other.

 

We would see everyone take almost all internals, even after massive item and internal balance changes. Because items are still finite. There would need to be a way to replenish them beyond dying, i.e. Item Replenishment power ups on the battlefield, or returning items to infinite use on a cool down, or infinite use on a cool down with Item Cooldown Reduction power ups on the battlefield.

Edited by HugeGuts, 18 January 2016 - 10:07 PM.

[eth0]

 

We would see everyone take almost all internals, even after massive item and internal balance changes. Because items are still finite. There would need to be a way to replenish them beyond dying, i.e. Item Replenishment power ups on the battlefield, or returning items to infinite use on a cool down, or infinite use on a cool down with Item Cooldown Reduction power ups on the battlefield.

 

What happens when everyone using internals for health buffs and mobility get EMP'd? The same as any other fuzzy bunny. Don't you worry, there will be people running item heavy builds, too.

 

Hawken doesn't need replenishing items (see: current version) but it would probably be more fun. Power-ups on the map is tried and true, great for maps with bases, too. Need items? RTB. Maybe an internal to reduce item cooldown on kills? What if my repair drone deployed to collect scrap from the kill? Whoa.

 

Hawken could be so damn amazing. But enough of that drivel, let's get on to semantics and grudges:

 

Spoiler

Look ma, I'm on topic!

I think he was just responding to someone that wanted to speak with him in private but could not, so decided to post a reply here.

Holy wall of text.

 
I have PM's disabled and have for quite some time.  Sorry if you'd rather deal with this in private, but I really don't have any reason to be secretive, what I would say to someone in private is exactly what I would say to them in public.

 

You have the freedom to disable PM's, not derail the thread. Factual or not, off-topic posts are derailment.

Also bumping this thread is not the only option, other people that have wanted to get ahold of me in private have simply quoted a single one of my posts in a forgotten thread in a low traffic area on the forums and asked me to turn on PM's for a conversation, at which point I have contacted them.

 

Necro-ing is frowned upon, too. Seemed logical to reply in the same thread but there goes the "L" word.

 

Heck, you could of just asked me to contact you in your post if you really wanted it to be private, oh well.

I set my expectations too low and was still disappointed.

 

All things considered, when you take a look at the timing of releasing those videos in relation to the ongoing discussion this thread, the title you chose of the post advertising those videos (which didn't upset me at all btw, I genuinely laughed when it popped up on the feed) and who it was from (someone affiliated with comp play), and the content of those videos (comp play). I think you can easily understand how anyone remotely familiar with the situation would of arrived at that conclusion.  Had you done one tiny single thing differently it would of been much more difficult to connect the dots.  I am simply stating my opinion 

Spoiler

 

Since that post, 2 TPG members have published Youtube videos, fuzzy bunnyng 2 Nept (1 did it just to backup Crafty as noted in another thread), but there are still pages on pages of videos produced by thousands of people unaffiliated with TPG. Therefore it can be shown that the Hawken content being created is not only by TPG players as claimed by Crafty and now you Nept.
 

of the matter based strictly off of deductive reasoning of the stated events. Its hardly making anything up, it is my observation of what I saw and what I read. Other peoples views of the situation might be different, some might be the same, but if it was not what you intended, well then your actions spoke louder than your words eth0.
 

h h

 

Now I understand thats not WHY you make videos.   Notice I didn't say that backing up Craftys fallacy WAS the reason why you make videos BTW. I don't think thats any reason why anyone makes videos at all, just like I don't think that most of the Hawken related video content thats out there has been recorded by comp players, mandatory or not.  A fact I can provide google evidence for if asked to prove that assertion, humor intended. However the overwhelming evidence that directly linked you into my reasoning was your inclusion of your self admitted clickbait title where you specifically stated rallying support for Crafty. That is why I said what I said, if it wasn't what you intended then your message wasn't very clear at least not to me.

 

That seems to happen a lot.

It's hard for me not to crack a joke at all this but it has been proven again and again that no lesson can be learned either way.

 

I responded at my earliest convenience to a post written directly to me within this thread, yes the current discussion from that point has moved onto another branch of the topic, but that does not mean that I CANNOT or SHOULD not respond to something said earlier. Plenty of people do this on the forums, but I don't see you busting out your barbie dream moderator badge and criticizing them when they do it.

Plenty of people do it, Hyginos! Y'can't argue with that.

 

[DeeRax]

Hawken doesn't need replenishing items (see: current version) but it would probably be more fun. Power-ups on the map is tried and true, great for maps with bases, too. Need items? RTB. Maybe an internal to reduce item cooldown on kills? What if my repair drone deployed to collect scrap from the kill? Whoa.

That sounds cool as fuzzy bunny.

[SS396]

Look ma, I'm on topic!

Hardly.
 

You have the freedom to disable PM's, not derail the thread. Factual or not, off-topic posts are derailment.

From my point of view, This all began when you felt the need to respond to a sentence in a post that I made, where you felt I misrepresented your intention. Thats the exact point where I define where this derailment started. So, you might want to heed your own words. Cause it looks rather hypocritical on your end when you chose to derail a thread and then lecture someone on what classifies as a thread derailment.

 

Holy wall of text.

You also need to look up the definition of wall of text.
 

Plenty of people do it, Hyginos! Y'can't argue with that.

If he or anyone else has a problem with anything I write (or anyone else for that matter) they don't have to write some more bull fuzzy bunny in a post to say it, they can quietly click the report button and go about their business, not bothering anyone. We all know the reason why he posted that comment and made it a big display.  I mean really if you want to be technical about it he was derailing the thread according to your definition of off-topic posts are a derailment, so really you should be lecturing more than just me.  

[comic_sans]

Threads like this are why I avoid the forums now, more than anything.

[PoopSlinger]

Threads like this are why I avoid the forums now, more than anything.

BS  you come here for this stuff too.  You keep posting in it.

[Superkamikazee]

I think it's safe to say at this point the convo has moved on, yay, item and internals do need work.

I'm not positive what the best improvements would be, but I do feel items and internals need a solid paring down. There's too many, with too many being of little use. It seems to me items kept getting added over time to have more things up for purchase, because free to play. Less items and internals, easier to balance gameplay.

Item cool downs were in the game, now they're gone, but maybe items on cooldown were just poorly implemented. Perhaps certain items should have a changing cooldown that increases in duration the more an item is used. Weigh the power of the items, but I suppose that'd have to be balance tested with other items and internals receiving tweaks. Repair orbs are really the big spam item atm, mayge that item is not even needed, who knows.

I only mention the cooldown thing because MOBA games, because games like overwatch, kids like item cooldown. Need the tween scene.

[StubbornPuppet]

If I recall correctly, there used to be a way to replenish items by going to a station at the back of your home base.  I even think the station is still there on a couple of maps, just not active.

Edited by StubbornPuppet, 19 January 2016 - 06:44 AM.

[Hyginos]

I think it's safe to say at this point the convo has moved on, yay, item and internals do need work.

I'm not positive what the best improvements would be, but I do feel items and internals need a solid paring down. There's too many, with too many being of little use. It seems to me items kept getting added over time to have more things up for purchase, because free to play. Less items and internals, easier to balance gameplay.

Item cool downs were in the game, now they're gone, but maybe items on cooldown were just poorly implemented. Perhaps certain items should have a changing cooldown that increases in duration the more an item is used. Weigh the power of the items, but I suppose that'd have to be balance tested with other items and internals receiving tweaks. Repair orbs are really the big spam item atm, mayge that item is not even needed, who knows.

I only mention the cooldown thing because MOBA games, because games like overwatch, kids like item cooldown. Need the tween scene.

 

22 internals isn't too many IMO, especially considering that 9 of them are simply a different sized version of another internal, and there are only 14 items. The issue is, as you said, that many of are too little use. I think some sort of fix for the orblord build would introduce quite a bit of variety. Even just fixing the repair kit's pickup speed would be helpful.

 

Does anyone recall the original justification for moving from cooldown to charge based items? I can't seem to find the patch notes.

Edited by Hyginos, 19 January 2016 - 07:13 AM.

[coldform]

Does anyone recall the original justification for moving from cooldown to charge based items? I can't seem to find the patch notes.

I think this was done to nerf the top tier items, without removing them from the code. I also think their was a perceived issue with item spamming.

[Kopra]

22 internals isn't too many IMO, especially considering that 9 of them are simply a different sized version of another internal, and there are only 14 items. The issue is, as you said, that many of are too little use. I think some sort of fix for the orblord build would introduce quite a bit of variety. Even just fixing the repair kit's pickup speed would be helpful.

 

Does anyone recall the original justification for moving from cooldown to charge based items? I can't seem to find the patch notes.

 

Here it is, kind of. 

 

http://hawken.mirror...te-patch-notes/

 

 

 

Item have undergone some rework. The item system got a bit complex and we wanted to simplify it a bit while still giving players choices when equipping their mech. The balance of items was also adjusted. Complete statistics for each item can be found here: Item Statistics

 

[*]Items no longer regenerate after use. Instead, you are given a limited amount of charges (uses) for each item. Charges are refilled when a mech is destroyed and redeployed from the hanger.

[*]All versions of an item have the same statistics. The only difference between the slot size is the amount of charges the item has each mech life.

 

[*]MK-I = 1 charge

[*]MK-II = 2 charges

[*]MK-III = 3 charges

[/list]

[*]To prevent players from using offensive items quickly one after the other, there is now a global cooldown on usage of items. After using an item, players must wait 7 seconds before using another.

[/list]Developer's Note: The simplification of the item system allows players to identify exactly what an item does when they see it, without having to worry about how powerful it is. It also allows for a much more balanced player experience. MK-I items sometimes felt useless for having low stats and some MK-III items felt too strong. The transition to normalized stats for items allows us to make all items useful and more balanced. Having different charges makes the slots meaningful and still allows players to make meaningful choices.

 

Here are some notable functional changes we made to a few particular items:

 

[*]Shield

 

[*]Now blocks all damage and projectiles from all directions. Mechs can no longer shoot out of the shield from within it and can no longer attach to other players or walls.

[/list]

[*]ISM Disruptor

 

[*]Projectile will now explode on direct contact with a mech.

[/list]

[*]EMP

 

[*]Projectile functionality is now similar to the ISM Disruptor.

[*]Projectile will generate beeps once deployed and explode a short time afterwards.

[*]Projectile will explode on direct contact with a Mech.

[/list]

[*]Regenerator

 

[*]With the changes to items, the regenerator was reworked. It now reduces the global item cooldown from 7 to 5 seconds.

[/list]

[*]Detonator

 

[*]Decreased damaged from 80 to 60.

[/list]

[*]HE Charge

 

[*]Decreased damage from 85 to 65.

[/list]

[*]Repair Charge

 

[*]Repair Charges now take 2 seconds to activate after deployment. This means players will not be able to extract anything until after 2 seconds.

[/list]

[/list]Internals

 

[CraftyDus]

22 internals isn't too many IMO, especially considering that 9 of them are simply a different sized version of another internal, and there are only 14 items. The issue is, as you said, that many of are too little use. I think some sort of fix for the orblord build would introduce quite a bit of variety. Even just fixing the repair kit's pickup speed would be helpful.

 

Does anyone recall the original justification for moving from cooldown to charge based items? I can't seem to find the patch notes.

 

 

Here it is, kind of. 

 

http://hawken.mirror...te-patch-notes/

 

perhaps Vanashinkaku or Hughes mention the item update on that cockpit episode

 

item discussion at 17 minutes

Edited by CraftyDus, 19 January 2016 - 10:10 AM.

[Superkamikazee]

I don't remember the exact order of the updates anymore, but was the item cool down removal update implemented before or after the TTK was lowered to current values?

[StubbornPuppet]

I don't remember the exact order of the updates anymore, but was the item cool down removal update implemented before or after the TTK was lowered to current values?

 Before.

[Superkamikazee]

 Before.

 

Late days ADH just throwing blindly, looking for a hail mary. 

Edited by Superkamikazee, 19 January 2016 - 12:41 PM.

[Nept]

If you're referring to the TTK changes, those had been in the works for some time.

[CraftyDus]

According to the discussion with Vana I linked, on feb 6, it was after

 

 

edit:

 

TTK was lowered before the steam update/release, hit that vod @ 17 minutes and Kej is talking about the lower ttk in past tense while discussing the reaper and ss with Vana 

Edited by CraftyDus, 19 January 2016 - 01:54 PM.

[ShadowWarg]

According to the discussion with Vana I linked, on feb 6, it was after

 

 

edit:

 

TTK was lowered before the steam update/release, hit that vod @ 17 minutes and Kej is talking about the lower ttk in past tense while discussing the reaper and ss with Vana 

 

I know I am late to the convo (heck I'm late to this whole "new" hawken thing), and this post wont appear until later until it gets approved.

 

TTK was increased during the ascension time frame, adding about 50 - 100 point to health I think (think is the key word, I don't have the numbers), Then lowered again around the time they did the changes to Items, boosting and made all mech health individual. But at the same time they also increased movement speed which also contributed to the TTK. Problem is, the TTK wasn't lowered a bit it was lowered A LOT because of those changes throwing the game off quite a bit.

 

Where does the TTK stand now compared to pre-ascension?