92 replies to this topic

[Dew]

I miss when you could wreck people with dumbfire+EOC+HE dunks.

 

Hellfires right now are more "reliable" than the previous iterations, but unfortunately this removes the fancy tricks and stuff you used to be able to do ala Mexi's videos. Imo increase projectile speed and damage, not so sure about tracking... I feel like this is a hard weapon to balance without making it a complete menace in low-tier lobbies.

[kasei]

Hellfires right now are more "reliable" than the previous iterations, but unfortunately this removes the fancy tricks and stuff you used to be able to do ala Mexi's videos.

Nope, I do it all the time.



As someone who uses Hellfires a lot, I think they need a dry fire buff. The rockets' spread is too big, speed is too slow, and damage too little when dry firing. A lot of players can dodge locked-on Hellfire rockets if they can see them. Everyone dodges dry fire rockets unless it's at point blank range. I'd be happy if they just tightened the spread, so that more than half the rockets actually hit where the reticle is pointing.

Edited by kasei, 17 May 2015 - 03:47 PM.

[Hek_naw]

So someone requested newcomer feedback? I've been playing for 5 weeks now and I have something to say, even though I wouldn't call anything "insight" coming from a newbie.

 

The Rocketeer is the first mech I spent credits on. I liked the idea of assisted weapons (yeah, cut me some slack will ya). Also loved the way it looked! So it took me a few days to figure out you can actually target-lock enemies WITHOUT switching to Turret mode. #JustNoobThings. After several games I realised that I was frequently getting the "Most assists" award. (However my kills/deaths ratio has always been bad.) Not long ago I discovered you could retain target lock WHILE looking away from the target. This only made me love the mech even more. I'm already used to the trick and I'm now able to fire while taking cover.

 

Recently I found out that good players completely counter locked-on Hellfires. I found one specific way to counter-the-counter, which is dry-firing an enemy who has timed the targeted shots and is expecting me to target again, i.e. when they're shooting around a corner. They don't see the missiles coming until it's late. But it's an uncommon scenario.

 

I don't know if the Hellfires are UP or not. I do know lock-on is worthless face to face, especially against lighter mechs, and it's also worthless in long-range when the enemy can fire around a corner. But Hellfires are really effective when the enemy is not paying attention to me, and instead is focused in a skirmish with another mech. This, I think, is the main reason why I get lots of assists with the Rocketeer.

[Silverfire]

Nope, I do it all the time.



As someone who uses Hellfires a lot, I think they need a dry fire buff. The rockets' spread is too big, speed is too slow, and damage too little when dry firing. A lot of players can dodge locked-on Hellfire rockets if they can see them. Everyone dodges dry fire rockets unless it's at point blank range. I'd be happy if they just tightened the spread, so that more than half the rockets actually hit where the reticle is pointing.

 

I don't really count this as a "trick" for Hellfires given that firing around a corner is a fairly basic mechanic use of the Hellfires, simply firing around a corner.  We're talking complete 360 degree turnarounds to smack someone around a pillar (from the other side when they're coming at you headon), Hellfires going a complete 180 to hit people behind you, and other crazy Hellfire tracking stuff that I don't have video evidence of that Mexichanman (a former Rocketeer savant) and others were able to do.  Hellfires do what they are supposed to do now, but the element of crazy that used to a part of Hellfires just isn't there anymore. We can't do that kind of stuff with Hellfires now.  Damage needs a buff and dumb fire projectile speed could really improve (along with dumbfire spread), but it's tough to say what to do with tracking because it's either too strong or too weak in the past iterations of Hawken.

Edited by Silverfire, 19 May 2015 - 02:15 PM.

[Amidatelion]

I don't really count this as a "trick" for Hellfires given that firing around a corner is a fairly basic mechanic use of the Hellfires, simply firing around a corner.  We're talking complete 360 degree turnarounds to smack someone around a pillar (from the other side when they're coming at you headon), Hellfires going a complete 180 to hit people behind you, and other crazy Hellfire tracking stuff that I don't have video evidence of that Mexichanman (a former Rocketeer savant) and others were able to do.  Hellfires do what they are supposed to do now, but the element of crazy that used to a part of Hellfires just isn't there anymore. We can't do that kind of stuff with Hellfires now.  Damage needs a buff and dumb fire projectile speed could really improve (along with dumbfire spread), but it's tough to say what to do with tracking because it's either too strong or too weak in the past iterations of Hawken.

 

Silverfire and I actually sat down and tested a few trick shots last week and you need something like 8 mech frames distances for even 90° shots to track properly. 180° is out entirely. There's still functionality there for cover-reduction but not Mexi's stupid "there is no such thing as corner play anymore" tricks.

[kasei]

[...]

I know, I played back then too. Obviously you're not going to get shots like Mexi's anymore, and I think that's a good thing. Being able easily shoot over top shields was kinda ridiculous.

Edited by kasei, 19 May 2015 - 02:59 PM.

[n3onfx]

Increase the speed or damage of dumbfire a bit. But make them do more noise, if dumbfire is buffed you should be able to hear them come as much as a tow.

[Nov8tr]

Mexichan was THE hellfire man. Hey I had some people in game the other was asking if I had any videos of Mexichan. Sadly I do not. Anybody got anything? I and the others sure would appreciate it. How about Silver, Amid or hell anyone. :) Yeah Kasei we are talking about what they use to do. You could land them behind a wall, not just over it. Around corners in a 90. I use to be really good with them but not like him. He rocked em. I did it in a bruiser. I still play my bruiser. Hell I won a game last night with bruiser, #1 in game and MVP. It was a blast. We got to talking about the bruiser and how people like me were dying breed. Dueling with one is a real fuzzy bunny. In high level games, a bruiser is a death sentence. But I still use them for team support. I don't generally get high points but I've helped the team win quite a few times. It's just fun to watch people ducking for cover when the sound (which I don't hear) that comes when they have locked em on. :P Yeah they do need a slight buff for close up dumb fire. Make em a little more valid for duels. Which happen despite your best attempt now to, LOL. IMO of cours

 

I've found so far is a duel between MexichanMan and Xacius. Pretty awesome. http://www.twitch.tv/x9x8x7x/c/2994258

And a couple more. https://www.youtube....9Q9szmC0i8&hd=1     and this one with him using his room mates nvidia shield

https://www.youtube....YQqoOpsY5s&hd=1 PLUS I found out he hangs on Twitch. Talk to him if you have Twitch. http://www.twitch.tv...chanman/profile   ENJOY!!

Edited by Nov8tr, 19 May 2015 - 04:12 PM.

[MechFighter5e3bf9]

No. 

 

They're garbage.

 

They only hit if you don't care or don't know how to dodge.

perhaps you care more for the raider etc eating on you close up than a distant foe so then the hellfires WILL land  and in a 1v1 hellfires no lock up close are very deadly so like all rest of the game it seems balanced to me

[Sokram]

I recently encountered tons of Hellfire users. Then I tried it for myself....

 

 

Now im not sure that it needs any buff.  They are pretty good. Already hard to dodge. Already VERY easy to shoot stuff with. And damage is high enough.

[Dew]

Hellfires aren't hard to dodge, provided you know where they're coming from. If you can see them coming, it's pretty certain they aren't going to do any damage at all. Hell, they travel slow enough that at midrange if you wait for an A-class to dodge before you fire, they can still get another dodge off and take no damage at all by the time the missiles get there. Hellfires cannot be relied upon in any capacity for directly engaging a competent player at any range. They're strictly a support weapon.

[Flifang]

The only time I have an overly difficult time avoiding them is when the bleached white sky of some of the maps is behind the bright white rockets as they get ever narrower in array.

[Source_Mystic]

I think that a damage buff would be too close to the edge of making them op. Instead, if the way missiles bend could be modified, let's say delay the bend a little bit more to give the pilot a wider array of strategies around objects, that would be fair for me.

 

 

 

 this adds utility if you raised  hellfire  speed  a bit I think it could be a good option . Wide arks give me wide arks and I be happy

 

How about getting rid of that shity turret mode and give us another option for missals like corkscrew or no warning slightly higher speed for a limited amount .

Edited by Source_Mystic, 01 June 2015 - 09:38 AM.