51 replies to this topic

[palad1ne]

I think its time now to remove the Brawler from the Garage and put a new Class C Mech instead in.

• the high HP dont compensate the slowness
  
• it hardly survive without Medic
  
• the Mech is total useless in his purpose to do pressure in qcq
  
• the weapon heat generation is somewhat pathetic
  
• turret ability a joke

Now lets see the several Weapon combinations

Flac + Tow

Good weapons in qcq but useless when moving in slow motion while unable to fire because of heat and slow turn rate.

SA + Tow

The Playstyle from the primary makes the secondary useless. Same in reverse. you can shoot from higher range where your tow can only spam. At near Range the primary is to weak for this slow turning mech.

Vulcan + Tow

Vulcan useless at Range for Tow. Tow not good usable at vulcan range. Mech to slow to change Position for proper firing. The old Failsafe would help but it was nerfed for all.

Altogether, the whole concept of the mech is a big fail. Dont know whats the idea behind this mech was.Description says :

The Brawler is built for close-range combat and taking plenty of punishment. The Fortified Turret special ability generates a steady amount of healing to increase this mech's effectiveness on the front lines.

For close Range to weak. The healing Turret would be usable if it could provide so much healing like a tech medic. Then the Brawler could stay in the close combat range while dealing some damage and also could stay in combat while fire pause because of Heat.
The actual concept forgot about to put the brawler in Balance with other Classes. Brawler can not get away when he is in Purpose Position. So he must stay there and deal with the situation against two or more light mechs. Thats the purpose of a Tank he should be.  
Otherwise he die like a fly against light mechs which are dealing 500dps(Det+Tow+Flac) without getting caught.

My conclusion after, hours of playing the Brawler and spending a lot of love in this Mech.

Remove this Mech from the Garage and put some new Mech in which can better survive in his role.

good day.

[Cruzxavier]

The mech's general idea is there but is not applied. Now...do not trie to throw away the mech just change its weapons and the problem is solved...The brawler should have weapons that in combat everyone should be afraid of facing one in a frontal assault even a group should be scaried much like the Hellfires lock on effect (croud blister away). The vulcan should be the first weapon (its a spearhead mech so it should have a weapon that harasses the opposition) and the secondary should be something with higher fire rate to compensate its flaws. Don't kill it...enhance it

[OmegaNull]

The mech is fine, just needs to be a tad faster. You just gotta know how to use it

[PoopSlinger]

Did they patch it like a week or two ago to make it boost faster_

[CounterlogicMan]

PoopSlinger, on December 26 2013 - 10:12 AM, said:

Did they patch it like a week or two ago to make it boost faster_

Yes but as omega said it could use a little more walk speed. Not a whole lot though.

Make sure you use the brawlers turret mode more defensively rather than offensively. If you want an offensive turret mode try the Vanguard.

[OmegaNull]

Vanguard turret mode is deadly if used in the right hands.

[Bazookagofer]

Last time I played was when Brawler didn't get the latest buff to it and even then I did pretty damn well with it even though it was UP. Just got to know how to play it. I topped score boards quite often with all C classes (apart from vanguard never got to that because FRAMES WENT TO ...)

[StruttingStray]

The recent buffs the Brawler has received have made it very playable for me. It still needs a little more speed though. A decent buff to suspensions should be enough. It doesn't make sense to me that the mech that is designed to hold a position has the slowest dodge cooldown even after maxing out that tuning stat.

[dEd101]

StruttingStray, on December 26 2013 - 12:59 PM, said:

The recent buffs the Brawler has received have made it very playable for me. It still needs a little more speed though. A decent buff to suspensions should be enough. It doesn't make sense to me that the mech that is designed to hold a position has the slowest dodge cooldown even after maxing out that tuning stat.

^^My viewpoint in a nut shell. Brawler needs to dance. It's got the speed to get in close now it needs to dodge at least as well as the other c classes to leverage it's weapons.

Still way better than before though so I'm grateful for that. I don't feel gimped when I take my favourite mech out for a spin anymore because I can actually get to the fight before it finishes.

[Highchu]

It still needs further improvement. They did buff it up somewhat, but its still too slow compared to the rest of the C classes. While more playable its basically just a fat drunk scout. I still don't see the incentive to play it over the Vanguard/Grenadier though.

[IareDave]

No. I'm tired of all these anti-brawler threads. The mech is fine the way it is. Perhaps lowering the fuel tank a bit more and increasing the suspensions is the only thing I believe it needs. Besides that, it's one of the best C-class mechs.

[Bazookagofer]

IareDave, on December 26 2013 - 01:25 PM, said:

No. I'm tired of all these anti-brawler threads. The mech is fine the way it is. Perhaps lowering the fuel tank a bit more and increasing the suspensions is the only thing I believe it needs. Besides that, it's one of the best C-class mechs.

There are 4 C classes... not much to choose from

[CounterlogicMan]

Slightly increase base walk speed or slightly decrease dodge cool down not both. If you did both the armor advantage would be too much I think.

[Saturnine]

palad1ne, on December 26 2013 - 09:33 AM, said:

I think its time now to remove the Brawler from the Garage and put a new Class C Mech instead in.

• the high HP dont compensate the slowness
  
• it hardly survive without Medic
  
• the Mech is total useless in his purpose to do pressure in qcq
  
• the weapon heat generation is somewhat pathetic
  
• turret ability a joke

Now lets see the several Weapon combinations

Flac + Tow

Good weapons in qcq but useless when moving in slow motion while unable to fire because of heat and slow turn rate.

SA + Tow

The Playstyle from the primary makes the secondary useless. Same in reverse. you can shoot from higher range where your tow can only spam. At near Range the primary is to weak for this slow turning mech.

Vulcan + Tow

Vulcan useless at Range for Tow. Tow not good usable at vulcan range. Mech to slow to change Position for proper firing. The old Failsafe would help but it was nerfed for all.

Altogether, the whole concept of the mech is a big fail. Dont know whats the idea behind this mech was.Description says :

The Brawler is built for close-range combat and taking plenty of punishment. The Fortified Turret special ability generates a steady amount of healing to increase this mech's effectiveness on the front lines.

For close Range to weak. The healing Turret would be usable if it could provide so much healing like a tech medic. Then the Brawler could stay in the close combat range while dealing some damage and also could stay in combat while fire pause because of Heat.
The actual concept forgot about to put the brawler in Balance with other Classes. Brawler can not get away when he is in Purpose Position. So he must stay there and deal with the situation against two or more light mechs. Thats the purpose of a Tank he should be.  
Otherwise he die like a fly against light mechs which are dealing 500dps(Det+Tow+Flac) without getting caught.

My conclusion after, hours of playing the Brawler and spending a lot of love in this Mech.

Remove this Mech from the Garage and put some new Mech in which can better survive in his role.

good day.

Nah.

[craftydus]

Saturnine, on December 26 2013 - 02:58 PM, said:

Nah.

...since brevity is the soul of wit,
And tediousness the limbs and outward flourishes,

Spoiler

[Daronicus]

If you try to take away my Brawler, I will... say mean things to you over the internet.

Seriously, Brawler is fine.  If I can go against top-level Scouts in it, so can you (with practice).

[LarryLaffer]

Brawler is pretty okay in it's current state. Maybe it needs some fuel tank reduction, just a tiny bit, 'cuz current amount of fuel is excessive (and this is not only my thoughts. The great moustache brawler is watching us )

[nepacaka]

Quote

slowness

This topic is trololo or sarcastic_ no_

brawler - the second fastest С-mech in the game, and the only one that can overcome the distance of 60% of map

idk, i think wall of text in first post - joke

[Muffintrumpet]

The Brawler’s first problem is heat
currently the light mechs can dump more heat than the big ones
(yeah, I know, arse-about-face but there we have it)
the Brawler is often at the point of managing heat to avoid shutdown after the first tussle but you’re also often unable to break off and cool down owing to size and lack of speed
the As & Bs on the other hand can not only fire for longer at a massive and barely mobile target but they can also very easily break off and cool down when required; versus a Brawler the As and most Bs have a Get Out Of Jail Free card
also, the good Brawler pilot is patient and picks his shots which has the side effect of lessening the impact of not being able to dump much heat; however, when you become good at aiming the old heat problem returns because you’re able to land accurate shots at something very close to maximum DPS, even against flippity-floppity As

the Brawler’s second problem is Tuning options
the Brawler sits in the unenviably unique position of needing to spend Tuning points just to become viable, and yet all the other mechs spend Tuning to enhance an already viable play style; this completely defeats the point of what Tuning points were meant to be for
I’d like to be able to spend Tuning points to accent a play style, not be presented with a list of mandatory Tuning point allocations

as surprising as this might sound to some: the Brawler’s third problem is the Tech
yes, one of the most poorly thought-out mech designs in Hawken’s relatively short history, the Tech, is at least partly responsible for the Brawler having a near-useless turret ability
there are _very_ few situations where turret mode is preferable to being mobile and most of those situations are usually only considered if there’s a Tech in attendance
#1.  _no_ mech ability should be reliant on the presence of another mech
#2.  the Tech is the very reason turret mode is as sh_t as it is now because the devs felt that Techs made a viable solo turret mode too stronk

A Brawler that remained stood up and deployed its armour limbs as riot shields for 40% damage reduction at the cost of not being able to Boost* would be much better
* counter to the Vanguard turret not being able to dodge but can boost freely and quickly

after all that being said, I still like pushing my fat bottomed girl around
(devs, please don’t mistake ‘like’ for ‘satisfied’)

TL;DR: the Brawler is better that it was but it's still comparatively weak

Edited by Muffintrumpet, December 27 2013 - 05:24 AM.

[LarryLaffer]

Quote

The Brawler’s first problem is heat

Agreed, brawler has pretty strict heat management.

Quote

the Brawler’s second problem is Tuning options

Well, you've got a point here, but Brawler's tuning options is a really sensitive case. Devs buffed brawler's stats just a tiny bit, and it made so huge effect. If they increase stats even more, it may cause a lot of whining about brawler's OPness.

Quote

there are _very_ few situations where turret mode is preferable to being mobile

It can be applied to all C-class mechs. Actually I find brawler's turret mode quite useful. I peeked some techniques with it from MexichanMan's stream, tried it and can say that turret mode really can save life in some cases

Edited by LarryLaffer, December 27 2013 - 09:50 AM.