174 replies to this topic

[Call_Me_Ishmael]

I'm confused by your question.

 

I practiced groundscout because I felt like my ground dodging needed to be worked on. After I felt like I learned what I wanted to, I put AC back on my Scout and went my merry way.

 

confirmed.

 

I don't recall implying or stating that air scout isn't competitive at higher levels of play at any point. On the contrary, I think that airscout can be very competitive at higher levels of play. The extra degree of maneuverability is pretty significant. I know some good scout pilots can forego AC when pubbing, but I think that most of them would probably choose to equip AC if they were in for a serious fight. I could be wrong though.

 

refuted.  But I don't know many who play scout in comp.

 

I don't know what you mean by your third question so please clarify that.

 

It was humor.  Can disregard.

 

 

In summary: I think that AC can be useful when used well, can overexpose someone when used poorly, can certainly be competitive at higher levels, and should be a universal movement mechanic instead of an internal (though I don't care too strongly about that last point). I'm happy to elaborate on any other points.

 

Hawken is about bipedal mechs and bipedal mech combat.  AC turns the game into air combat a few meters above the ground.  I would WAY prefer that the air game be limited to a few classes only, and have serious tradeoffs.  An example of the reverse: Scout is fast on the ground and slowest in the air.  AC in its current implementation removes that restriction for most players: a crutch to rely upon when things get slightly difficult.

 

I don't think it should be universal, and I think it should require skill to overcome the adjunct shortcomings (which are missing, mostly, except for slot deprivation in the current game).

[CZeroFive]

My reasoning is even if we vets can still use our legacy mechs, would they even be comparable to G2 mechs in terms of actual power? If they're not, why even bother to use legacy mechs if they're inferior to G2 mechs. I don't want the legacy mechs to become obsolete because those mechs still have classic (and imo the better) setups like Grenadier. Will Gren with dual RevGL outclass my "normal" grenadier with GL?

Tldr: EVen if i had all the G2 mechs, what's the motivation to use legacy mechs if they're going to be worse than newer implementations? Will they be worse? I mean as a dev you probably wouldn't say they'll be worse but the reasoning still stands.

 

The weapons on G2s are likely going to be equal to their G1 partners in the future. I don't want to say anything more than that because nothing is finalized regarding G2s.

[teeth_03]

Personally, i think the idea behind G2s are kind of dumb. Can the G2 weapons just be unlocks for the G1 mechs at Rank 5?

[crockrocket]

I think the G2 concept in PC hawken is okay. Niche playstyle versions of an existing mech in which the G2 version doesn't necessary need to be viable, just fun. That's a concept which is easily overused however. Use G2's like seasoning on the actual game

[Sriracha_Sauce]

I can agree with the G2 mechs' continued inclusion if their stats are +/- of their G1 counterparts. Kind of like Assault vs CRT in a way where both are the same mech fundamentally but have different stats, some better or worse than the other, like health, boost speed, etc. One is not statistically a straight upgrade over the other.

Will the G1 mechs be competitively viable against their G2 cousins?

[TheButtSatisfier]

I can agree with the G2 mechs' continued inclusion if their stats are +/- of their G1 counterparts. Kind of like Assault vs CRT in a way where both are the same mech fundamentally but have different stats, some better or worse than the other, like health, boost speed, etc. One is not statistically a straight upgrade over the other.

Will the G1 mechs be competitively viable against their G2 cousins?

 

I agree with your suggestion, and I think that Reloaded would still get the same amount of revenue if they made the G2 variants a distinct +/- of the G1 like you said. For example, back when I first saw mention of a G2 Predator the description said something about reinforced pneumatics and suspension so that the G2 walks faster. That sounded neat, like G2 pred was going to have a faster movement speed at the expense of armor or something. But noooo. Had to be a slight but definitive upgrade.

 

Doing straight +'s for the G2s automatically makes the G1 variants subpar in a quantifiable manner. Making G2 variants a +/- of G1s keeps the G1s relevant. That would effectively double the # of mechs that can be considered competitive and would add variety.

[wischatesjesus]

G2s should be a purely cosmetic option.

[StubbornPuppet]

I think G2's should be just like what was done with the G2 Raider. Keep the same base weapons, but change the mech itself to make it harder to master (but still balanced). The G2 raider was the perfect implementation of this concept as it IS, indeed, quite a challenge to play it correctly - but putting in the time to learn it is rewarding and the end result is a mean-ass mech that other players have to adapt to.

Edited by StubbornPuppet, 02 November 2016 - 09:16 AM.

[nepacaka]

Most of problem in G2 which I see, they making G1 totally useless. Until G2 is a "direct upgrade", you no need spent any HC or MC to unlock items and buy visual cosmetics (camo/parts/body) for G1 variant. Since you open G2, you just forget about G1 and never should play on it, cuz G1 just useless.

Making G2 pros and cons can help, to got 2 viable variants of mechs.
For example
G1 brawler - 800 HP, 1.4 dodge
G2 brawler - 850 HP, 1.6 dodge (+50HP, +0.2 dodge as cons)
etc.

Edited by nepacaka, 02 November 2016 - 09:11 PM.

[TheButtSatisfier]

Most of problem in G2 which I see, they making G1 totally useless. Until G2 is a "direct upgrade", you no need spent any HC or MC to unlock items and buy visual cosmetics (camo/parts/body) for G1 variant. Since you open G2, you just forget about G1 and never should play on it, cuz G1 just useless.

 

This is a good point. Technically Reloaded opens up more purchasing opportunities by making the G1 a viable mech. If a player is more likely to use that mech, then they're more likely to purchase cosmetics for it.

 

I'm assuming that skins don't transfer across G1 and G2 variants right now.

[DeeRax]

I'm assuming that skins don't transfer across G1 and G2 variants right now.

 

I would hope that paints are still universal, like they are on the PC version.

[nepacaka]

I would hope that paints are still universal, like they are on the PC version.

and cupcake parts/engines/camo. and alpha/beta camos.

[ATX22]

I'd rather RLD do away with interchangeability of the actual mech chasis parts in favor of making completely unique alternate chassis parts for each mech.  Paint schemes and the like that don't actually change the profile of the mech, IMHO should be interchangeable. 

[Amidatelion]

I'd rather RLD do away with interchangeability of the actual mech chasis parts in favor of making completely unique alternate chassis parts for each mech.  Paint schemes and the like that don't actually change the profile of the mech, IMHO should be interchangeable. 

 

That would be way more work though, for lesser returns.  

 

The profile of the mech doesn't even matter, you have a giant honking HUD that tells you what you are shooting at.

[ATX22]

That would be way more work though, for lesser returns.  

 

The profile of the mech doesn't even matter, you have a giant honking HUD that tells you what you are shooting at.

 

I don't care about what the HUD does or doesn't do, the current system still strikes me as being a lazy attempt to monetize all the same.  And while this isn't something that started with RLD, I can't say I'd be happy if they continue with the ADH/meteor tradition on this one.  if RLD can't be bothered to put the work into making actual unique chassis parts, I seriously don't understand why anyone would reward this by spending money on recycled assets.  

 

But hey, whatever, all things staying the same, I can continue to spend nothing on Hawken and put what I don't spend here towards the amounts of $$ that I do spend, which is more than I should, on other games where the developers and community create content worth the cash to me.  For the sake of Hawken, I hope I'm in the minority on this one if it's too much work for RLD to create the types of content they're actually supposed to charge for..