90 replies to this topic

[Amidatelion]

The title should be sufficiently self-explanatory, but to clarify:

 

I would like to call for an indefinite moratorium on smurfing, creating new smurfs and consequently pubstomping (intentional or not). 

 

I know, weird coming from the guy who's last smurf was made in a MUD in the year 2000, but there we go. 

 

Hawken is finally seeing resurgence and new blood. It would not do to chase old friends and interested newcomers away with more brutal and unforgiving play than this game already gives due to matchmaking. You can't help getting dumping in a 1950-2500MMR lobby, but you sure as hell can opt not to go around in a 1900 account when you're 2500 in reality. 

 

The only vaguely legitimate excuse "I can't find any games at my level" is kaput for all but maybe 5 people. The old pros are back. I bloody well fought Exeon today ok and all of last week I had matches with cond0m, Xacius, comic_sans and Jeff Magnum. We do not have a shortage of players to fight up here in this so-called rarefied air. 

 

What was a graceless but justifiable choice is now just a fuzzy bunny move.

 

Be the players you were meant to be, not the ones new folks complain about.

 

Spoiler

Also, consider not partying up. It really screws with the balance.

[Rei]

I still regularly have empty available games in server browser.

[Nightfirebolt]

I never saw much point to making smurfs. I made one once, and within a few hours of playing I was back in the high MMR servers again. Kinda felt like a lot of hassle for a few measly hours of rampant bloodshed.

[ticklemyiguana]

The dude abides.

I will only use my two accounts, which are within 100 points of each other, the lower primarily used for drunk piloting. I feel this is acceptable.

[Rei]

I mean yeah, I get into higher tiered lobbies pretty quick on my smurf, but at least I can join things under 2100 now with my main smurf lol (not for long as it's already 2500+)

[Silverfire]

I don't even bother trying on my smurfs. I just screw around on them, trying to play bad really.

[Amidatelion]

I still regularly have empty available games in server browser.

 Ok, 6

[phed]

Yeah, stop stealing our mmrs with your dirty blue sneaky smurf hands...

[crockrocket]

As someone who used to smurf a fair bit (still do sometimes), I agree that this is very much needed. IMO there's not really a way to enforce it, but if you give a fuzzy bunny about increasing the player base, don't go pubstomping people under your mmr.

[phed]

You can't make them stop stomping, just ask that they pilot their main while they do it.

Otherwise, I know of like 12 people that will only be able to play each other, and 1 dude that will have to just sit and watch.

[Nept]

Time to retire "NotNept," I guess.

[x9x8x7x]

Now streaming on a smurf! http://www.twitch.tv/x9x8x7x

[driedjello]

I joined a match recently and low-and-behold, there was condOm.  I wish he would have put one on before that match! 

[EM1O]

and now, for something completely different (sorry Monte)...how about smurfs so you can get into 1600+ servers, because your main account's mmr sucks so bad (seriously: a year ago it was 1052)?

:D

[crockrocket]

and now, for something completely different (sorry Monte)...how about smurfs so you can get into 1600+ servers, because your main account's mmr sucks so bad (seriously: a year ago it was 1052)?
:D

I don't think anyone would have a problem with that!

[LaurenEmily]

This could be slightly offtopic but when i started playing i got continuously stomped by a certain player, i believe it was a smurf or a stomper and instead of demoralizing me it motivated me & made me fight harder and re-evaluate what i was doing wrong. it gave a reason to get better (i want to beat that person, i want to become as good as he/she is etc.)
What i'm trying to say is, it's not necessarily as terrible as people say it is. If i had been instantly good at this game i wouldn't have stayed.

[Hyginos]

To clarify, playing on an alt account is not so much the problem as abusing the lower MMR to pubstomp. I see nothing wrong with using an alternate account so long as you play up, or at least play nice.

[Superkamikazee]

Wish there was a way to prevent smurf account usage. 

[Interrobang87]

I am guilty of playing a smurf when I'm drinking or testing new play styles but it's around 2k.

Shame on you pub stompers!

[OmegaNull]

I have smurf accounts, but used them to have lower mmr while trying to help a new player (if they had questions, wanted lessons, etc). Since there are private servers, never on them anymore. 

Edited by OmegaNull, 24 March 2015 - 10:10 AM.

[SigmaOmega]

Could I have your children? +1 also

[opicr0n]

they call me: he who walks without smurfs.

[comic_sans]

I can find matches now, and I can play every class passibly so I don't have to do it to learn, so I guess I'm game.

[LEmental]

Wish there was a way to prevent smurf account usage. 

Allow players to join games.

 

Please do note, a lot of us play on odd hours when not many players are on.  So there are a lot more people who can't find games.

Edited by LEmental, 24 March 2015 - 10:38 AM.

[_incitatus]

Yeah, stop stealing our mmrs with your dirty blue sneaky smurf hands...

 

This.  1000 times this.  Maybe the super high tier guys would have more people closer to their mmr if it weren't for smurfs destroying the mmr of everyone they play with.  

 

Think about it, 2700 mmr player in a level 8 1900 mmr smurf, they are playing 800 points under their mmr and getting bonus underdog points.  They don't need those points.  Getting outscored by 3 times your own score by a level 8 account obliterates your mmr.  I have watched my mmr drop 30-50 points per round when I play against Dave's smurfs.  It takes some time to build that back up.

 

Even if your smurf is 2400 and your true mmr is 2700, you still wreck the mmr of everyone in the server when you win by double the points of the second place pilot.

Edited by _incitatus, 24 March 2015 - 10:44 AM.

[talon70]

Its not the pilots that would agree to a moratorium that are the problem. But its a great idea.

Edited by talon70, 24 March 2015 - 10:49 AM.

[OmegaNull]

I think maybe to resolve this is to increase the range at which players can join a match. Right now I think it is set to something like 300-400. Maybe increase it to around 500. Though I can see that really causing issues. 

[crockrocket]

I think maybe to resolve this is to increase the range at which players can join a match. Right now I think it is set to something like 300-400. Maybe increase it to around 500. Though I can see that really causing issues.

I have experienced it to be 500 in some cases already. I was able to join avg 2350 MMR servers last week when I was about 1870. Dropped below 1850 a few days ago, been meaning to test a 2350 & a 2300 since then in order to confirm. It is 300-400 on the low end though, I think.

[StubbornPuppet]

I'm a 1950 mmr player.  It never really seems to move any more, so I think that's about my cap.  I was once up to 2100, but the guys at the top made sure that was not long lived.

 

So, with such a "middle-of-the-road" mmr, I experience some very interesting extremes in match skill level.  The stars don't tell me a thing any longer.  I get matches that are 1900 - 2500.  I get matches that are 1400 - 2400.  And I get the dreaded matches that are 1250 - 2000... where there are always, without exception, at least 4 players who are lower than rank 10 who are at the top of the leaderboard by several hundred points.

 

And these players frequently try to deflect suspicion with transparent chat comments like, "Wow, this game is really easy." or "Man, that's the best match I ever played... I'm on a roll."  Really?  Shut up.  You do not get that good in just 3 hours of game-play on Hawken.  What is the appeal?  I don't get it.

 

It seems that the only surefire way to cut down on this is for an imposition of IP address... which comes with it's own unique problems.  But still, how many accounts would ever legitimately play from the same IP? (not counting countries where online gaming cafe's are the norm)

Edited by StubbornPuppet, 24 March 2015 - 11:32 AM.

[OmniStone]

So wait, is it even possible to find matches on main accounts now? I heard from Hestoned and Iaredave it was possible to sometimes find matches. I logged on my main and sat in a que for ages a few months ago. I wasn't able to get into matches even after most of our clan intentionally tried to lower our MMR so we could get some practice in after being gone from Hawken for a while.

 

I came to the conclusion that it was far easier to just spend that time you are wasting while sitting in a que to make a smurf account and level him up a bit. I figure you will get to about level 10 by the time you find a match anyways. It needs fixed, I suggest putting a "cap" to MMR. Something like 2400ish I think is a reasonable number.

 

Regardless, the solution shouldn't consist of "don't play the game anymore", or "sit in a que for 20 minutes until you find a game, like high MMR players should". Either of those options results in the creation of smurf accounts in this game and just about any other game that offers a system like this.

Edited by OmniStone, 24 March 2015 - 01:12 PM.

[_incitatus]

Capping the mmr used for matchmaking at 2400 sounds like a great idea. Don't cap the actual mmr of the pilot, but if your mmr is like 2700 matchmaking would just see it as 2400. Something like that?

[Sylhiri]

Capping the mmr used for matchmaking at 2400 sounds like a great idea. Don't cap the actual mmr of the pilot, but if your mmr is like 2700 matchmaking would just see it as 2400. Something like that?

 

Would it matter if they actually cap the mmr of the pilot?

[ticklemyiguana]

Would it matter if they actually cap the mmr of the pilot?

Yes, because if they capped the mmr of the pilot, it could be hestoned, Dave, xacius, and merl against myself, omega, bkcat, and metalbeard. All good players, but I know for a fact which team is going to win 95% of the time.

Edited by ticklemyiguana, 24 March 2015 - 01:21 PM.

[crockrocket]

Would it matter if they actually cap the mmr of the pilot?

You can't just circumcise someone's e-peen like that!

I mean I couldn't not say it...

[ticklemyiguana]

You can't just circumcise someone's e-peen like that!
I mean I couldn't not say it...

This was my first thought, but see above.

[Sylhiri]

Yes, because if they capped the mmr of the pilot, it could be hestoned, Dave, xacius, and merl against myself, omega, bkcat, and metalbeard. All good players, but I know for a fact which team is going to win 95% of the time.

 

Good point, it would need some rating to sort the 2400 group.

[_incitatus]

Good point, it would need some rating to sort the 2400 group.

That and the epeen thing. Also, I guess they could adjust the 2400 cap if need be based on everyone's actual mmr.

[OmniStone]

Yeah, capping the server matchmaking would be fine. Keeping your pilot's personal MMR for team balancing reasons would be great as well. So, it is just a slightly tweaked version of lowering the MMR requirements(sort of like what Omeganull said) on the servers so every high MMR pilot could join, instead of leaving out a few of the highest MMR ppl(which forces them to make smurfs to play the game).

[FlamingBeaker]

FWIW (very little) I have a rarely-used smurf that I use to try to work on my bad dodge timing - a CRT with no internals that never uses the primary weapon, only TOWs. Challenging, keeps my MMR down, and helps me find more matches, too. Should I park this one in the garage, also?

[crockrocket]

FWIW (very little) I have a rarely-used smurf that I use to try to work on my bad dodge timing - a CRT with no internals that never uses the primary weapon, only TOWs. Challenging, keeps my MMR down, and helps me find more matches, too. Should I park this one in the garage, also?

No, pretty sure the intent here is to not pubstomp, and it doesn't sound like you're doing that