48 replies to this topic

[TronX33]

So,  got the Incin. I'm doing pretty good at it, however, I really don't understand the purpose of the ability. When should I use it? It takes a long time to start, and you lose all ammo for your secondary. Also, the stats for the PPA say it has a higher effective range of the BBY, but has worse accuracy. It also has a 3 second spinup (from SoldierHobbes11). He also mentioned that the M4MA makes enemies overheat faster, but is it significant enough to make it viable? I'm only a mech level 2 , but I would appreciate it if someone answered these questions.

[Onebullit]

Just don't play that abomination of a mech.

There, problem solved.

[Meraple]

Using the Ability is probably best as a finisher when you can't hit the enemy, but even then, it's very risky; if it doesn't kill the enemy you're dead.

I'm tired I don't have the brain power to write anything else.

[nepacaka]

use ppa and forget about his ability

[Dew]

Ability can be used to get some damage off if you're 100% certain you're going to die anyway.

 

Also useful because you can still use it if you get EMP'd.

 

Also useful to finish off A-classes if there aren't any other enemies nearby.

 

In general though, you want to keep your heat for the SAARE. As others have said, if you use it and whiff or fail to kill, you're a sitting duck until your weapon spins back up.

[Amidatelion]

The ability is basically a taunt that does damage. The damage goes up based on your heat, and you can't trigger it while overheating. Minimum damage is 65 and slowly crawls upwards. If you're not above 75% heat its generally not worth using because of the damage scaling and the obvious animation. The damage takes .5 seconds to trigger after the buttstomp animation starts, so a canny pilot can actually clear the AOE,

[comic_sans]

The ability is basically a taunt that does damage.

 

Think of it like this and enjoy it more as a result.  I always get super pumped if I die to the incin special.

[Dawn_of_Ash]

 

...and you can't trigger it while overheating. 

 

This really shouldn't be a thing in my opinion.

[Amidatelion]

Think of it like this and enjoy it more as a result.  I always get super pumped if I die to the incin special.

 

Yeah if you get one off, you've basically won, fuzz the scoreboard.

[Dew]

This really shouldn't be a thing in my opinion.

 

This completely defeats the purpose of even needing to manage heat as an Incin, though (not like managing PPA heat isn't easy to begin with). At least right now with PPA if you overheat it's pretty catastrophic. If you let people just dump their heat into even more damage after they screw up, that's just silly.

[MomOw]

PPA + Charged SAARE all day, dakka dakka POW and you won't overheat, POW once more if heat is too high.

 

Ability is only here to finish already damaged fuzzy bunny CQC A-class that break your turn rate.

[Panzermanathod]

BBY if you want more normal usage and/or are a team player.

 

PPA if you want to be more offensive, although heat is an issue.

 

M4MA for when you mess with groups, as the gun itself is not good for direct fighting.

 

The ability is good for finishing off guys or getting one last hit in before dying. I've killed plenty of enemies using it.

[crockrocket]

The ability should only be procced after screaming Allahu Crockbar!!!!!!!!!

[crockrocket]

The ability should only be procced after screaming Allahu Crockbar!!!!!!!!!

Because using the ability is a suicide mission. However, I think the ability is under-rated, especially against a-classes. Scooty scoot starts dancing and you have no idea where he's at, but you know he's low, just press the panic button. I have used it as a suicide bomber many times resulting in a kill where normally it would have just been my death.

[kaiserschmarrn_]

I'm ashamed that nobody is pointing out how overpowered the incin is.

I don't know what else to say, most of you know my reaction to imbalance very well.

[Dew]

Incinerator is OP in pubs or in competitive TDM with tech support. Literally nobody uses it in competitive MA.

[Elite_is_salty]

Incinerator is OP in pubs or in competitive TDM with tech support. Literally nobody uses it in competitive MA.

 

I've seen few players who used it in our MA scrims.

IIRC these include crock and tickle.

[Skrubdos7]

I'm ashamed that nobody is pointing out how overpowered the incin is.

I don't know what else to say, most of you know my reaction to imbalance very well.

Spoiler

[Amidatelion]

Incinerator is OP in pubs or in competitive TDM with tech support. Literally nobody uses it in competitive MA.

 

Hyginos and I talked about this, at least on Origin and I'm sort of coming around to his point. It lacks options. It won't let you do anything that you can't already do better with other mechs and its niche is basically defending the long approach to 2. Not great when you need to guard against the only counter to holding 2.

 

On other maps it can be more useful, but even then it's striking me as kind of a weak mech because it is dependent on so many factors and lacks the immediacy of other mechs. Spin-up time, dependency on ammo, lack of health and fuel... While its OP as fuzzy bunny with a tech, a tech is a straight-up liability in an even fight in MA, so you're cutting like, half the Incin's viability. It's a mech that you need to build a comp around.

[Dew]

it's striking me as kind of a weak mech because it is dependent on so many factors and lacks the immediacy of other mechs. Spin-up time, dependency on ammo, lack of health and fuel...

 

This. Most people think that just because it has insane damage that you can always reliably deal that damage or that damage is the be-all and end-all. When you can't choose your battles in an Incin and are forced to engage on your enemy's terms for half the match, it's a serious problem.

[Panzermanathod]

This. Most people think that just because it has insane damage that you can always reliably deal that damage or that damage is the be-all and end-all. When you can't choose your battles in an Incin and are forced to engage on your enemy's terms for half the match, it's a serious problem.

 

And the insane damage is only with one specific weapon at that.

 

I'm probably one of the main guys here saying Incin isn't OP and, while I only have a few months of play time in this game, having played Incin I've noticed more weaknesses with it than some are willing to admit.

 

Yes, PPA is very good damage but even I can't main that all the time because it's also the least practical weapon.

[Flifang]

Haven't really tested it very much compared to my other quirky builds and such but if you drop a heat charge right before you press your ability you can use it again for "varying" amounts of additional damage once the animation ends. Hard to pull of and I haven't gotten many kills out of it but it can work.

[WastingTime]

Use the incin like a steamroller
Only use the ability as a finisher on 'a classes' that are acting like a mosquito 

[StubbornPuppet]

I don't think anyone has mentioned that the Incinerator's ability also works as a support mechanism.  If you perform it next to a teammate, it magically cools them down.  So, if you're an Incin and you've got a Tech watching your back, you can use the "heat stomp" to cool the Tech down so it can keep healing you.

[Panzermanathod]

Wait, seriously?

 

Proof? I'd do this myself but my net has been iffy for the past few days.

[Dew]

The Incin constantly drains the heat of nearby mechs (friendly or not), but I wasn't aware that Heat Dispersion had any sort of instant additional effect of that sort...

Edited by Dew, 23 July 2015 - 07:18 AM.

[Hyginos]

The Incin constantly drains the heat of nearby mechs (friendly or not), but I wasn't aware that Heat Dispersion had any sort of instant additional effect of that sort...

 

It doesn't. Just tested it.

[1uster]

Not mentioned so far:

When you use the ability inside a shield you damage yourself. At least I heard that a while ago. Never checked, play this damn thing rarely.

IMHO the real problem is the heat distribution. When I fight against one with my Brawler, they just need to land two or three shots and my mech overheats. No matter if I generate heat by myself or not. This just feels totally stupid and is one the biggest issues I have on battlefield. Luckily the inc isn't that popular. But this throws me really off. Why fight when you overheat in seconds the whole time, only because the inc pilot can land his shots...

[Panzermanathod]

Overheating getting hit with 2/3 shots?

 

Even I admit that's a bit hard to believe that the Incin can overheat mechs *that* much.

[StubbornPuppet]

I don't think anyone has mentioned that the Incinerator's ability also works as a support mechanism.  If you perform it next to a teammate, it magically cools them down.  So, if you're an Incin and you've got a Tech watching your back, you can use the "heat stomp" to cool the Tech down so it can keep healing you.

 

Wait, seriously?

 

Proof? I'd do this myself but my net has been iffy for the past few days.

 

It doesn't. Just tested it.

 

It has been a very long time since I played the Incinerator, but I absolutely know I remember it doing this - from both doing it myself and from my time with the Tech back when the Incin was new and popular. 

I suppose its well within the realm of possibility that it got changed by Adhesive due to all the complaints about the Incin being OP.

[Dew]

No... Incin has always had a passive heat-draining aura and that's it.

[Flifang]

It's worth mentioning that the brawler scenario could be true assuming you shoot your primary and secondary at the same time. If I remember correctly if you fire both weapons simultaneously, you actually generate more heat than if you shot them separately.

[1uster]

I am serious. Happened to me often enough. My brawler overheats just by receiving direct SAAR hits.

Here is a video which is demonstrating the problem pretty much:

Unfortunately they showed only the inc-perspective.

Edited by 1uster, 24 July 2015 - 12:23 PM.

[Amidatelion]

I am serious. Happened to me often enough. My brawler overheats just by receiving direct SAAR hits.
Here is a video which is demonstrating the problem pretty much:

Unfortunately they showed only the inc-perspective.

That was 2 TOWs and 2 Flak shots, a combo that would very nearly put you above half your heat to begin with. Plus SIX SAARE shots TWO of which were direct hits so, yeah, you're gonna overheat.

[1uster]

Sorry. I don't care that much for the numbers but for the actual battlefield. And I am just tired of meeting incs and overheat so fast that the reason to fight leaves the room. It's boring, pointless and tiresome. Again - you overheat no matter if you shoot or not. Not talking about a possible pocket-tech...

[Amidatelion]

Sorry. I don't care that much for the numbers but for the actual battlefield. And I am just tired of meeting incs and overheat so fast that the reason to fight leaves the room. It's boring, pointless and tiresome. Again - you overheat no matter if you shoot or not. Not talking about a possible pocket-tech...

 

Sorry, this is basically working as intended. Also, you only dodged one of those SAARE's, amplifying the problem.

 

The issue is that the Large SAARE's damage, splash, heat gen, and spamability due to heat absorption and P4P4 stupidity make the incin an overpowered mech in general. Making an enemy overheat was always in the gameplan - it's basically the damn thing's point. But the strength of everything incidental to that make it problematic. 

[Dawn_of_Ash]

This completely defeats the purpose of even needing to manage heat as an Incin, though (not like managing PPA heat isn't easy to begin with). At least right now with PPA if you overheat it's pretty catastrophic. If you let people just dump their heat into even more damage after they screw up, that's just silly.

 

You say that as if using the Incin's ability doesn't make you stay in one place and basically call for free-shots. The fact is that the Incin's ability is barely used because it leaves you like a sitting duck when you are using it. I would prefer to be able to use it when I've overheated than never use it at all. It also doesn't make any sense lore-wise - why wouldn't this machine want to get rid of it's heat when it needs to get rid of it most?

[Panzermanathod]

 

The issue is that the Large SAARE's damage, splash, heat gen, and spamability due to heat absorption and P4P4 stupidity make the incin an overpowered mech in general.

 

"Overpowered in general" Implies it's overall overpowered. It's not.

 

You can argue whether or not the large SAARE and PPA are OP (although I think people just like to ignore the downsides of both weapons), but the mech, in general, isn't OP.

 

Just certain aspects.

 

 

I'm Anal for Incin.

[Amidatelion]

"Overpowered in general" Implies it's overall overpowered. It's not.

 

False.

 

There are some things it can't do well, like deal with mechs in the air.

 

...that's about it.

[Panzermanathod]

It can't do a fair number of things well, at least well enough to be "generally overpowered".

 

I see overpowered as overly strong in a large number of aspects with no real downsides. Which isn't what Incin is.